All Blacks v Argentina II
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@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Snowy said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@Jet said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@sparky said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
44 Test tries now for Beauden Barrett. It's some career he's having.
He should have broke Howlett's record ages ago.
He had scored 36 tries from 2013-2019. An average of 5+ a year.
He has only scored 8 in the 5 seasons since the 2019 RWC despite being undroppable.
How much of that time did he spend playing at 10?
Played 10 2016/2017/2018.
2019 was dual pivot rubbish with Mo'unga.
And he has basically been a fullback ever since.
Beaudie has started 30 tests at fullback for 8 tries:
- 3 in 2024 (1 try)
- 10 in 2023 (2 tries)
- 3 in 2022 (0)
- 4 in 2020 (0)
- 8 in 2019 (4 tries)
- 1 in 2013 (1 try)
- 1 in 2012 (0)
He has started 56 tests and 1 non-test at 1st 5 for 28 tries:
- 5 in 2022 (1 try)
- 7 in 2021 (2 tries)
- 1 in 2020 (0)
- 2 in 2019 (0)
- 11 in 2018 (8 tries)
- 14 in 2017 (6 tries)
- 11 in 2016 (8 tries)
- 1 in 2015 (1 try)
- 5 in 2014 (2 tries)
He has come off the bench in 42 tests for 8 tries:
- 2 in 2024 (0)
- 1 in 2023 (0)
- 3 in 2022 (1 try)
- 6 in 2021 (1 try)
- 2 in 2016 (1 try)
- 7 in 2015 (2 tries)
- 7 in 2014 (0)
- 10 in 2013 (3 tries)
- 4 in 2012 (0)
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@booboo said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@antipodean said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@canefan said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@LatsToTheMax said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@sparky said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
- It was high.
- There was some head contact.
How is a tackle in the ribs high? There’s head contact when the ball carrier hinges horizontal into contact. If that is yellow, then you have to PK every time a bloke drops his head running at the line.
I think you have to look at the way the tackle is ruled these days to see your argument is false. Aumua was too upright, and there is head to head contact along with the impact from the tackle to the body. You can't get away with that most of the time, as a general rule this is nothing new for the last couple of years. Of course there have been the odd incident that has been let go (Kolisi on Ardie, Porter on BBBR) for reasons I can't understand.
I don't understand why either but I have a suspicion that a different standard was applied to All Blacks on the receiving end. The motive can only be explained by the referee who stands out as a statistical anomaly.
To be fair, Rugby Jesus getting off was down to the TMO due to the "sudden change of height" ...
And obviously very hard for "Madiba" Kolisi to adjust his height accordingly given that he only had 20m to lineup Ardie before giving him a flying headbutt...
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@Bones said in [All Blacks v Argentina II]
I said what I meant, not the various different words you tried to pretend I said. I don't think it's worth conversing about Rieko with you, you've clearly made up your mind he provides no value and look at all the stats and stats only to prove it!
Where did I pretend?
@Bones said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
Or shall we just ignore the lack of change out wide for Argentina, the extra space out wide for black, the fuck all line breaks and turnovers in the midfield?
So in the context of discussing Rieko you insinuated he was the reason for 'fuck all line breaks and turnovers in the midfield'.
Rieko had the 2nd least tackles made (Jordie made 3x as many) in the entire backline but you are giving him all the credit for shoring up the midfield defense?
Rieko had the most turnovers in the entire team but you are giving him credit for the midfield turnovers supposedly being eradicated?
You're triggered by my stats so what's your alternative? Do you have some intangible evidence I'm not aware of that somehow makes what you said above true?? If you think I'm naively only looking at stats educate me and tell me what I'm missing.
Otherwise if not, maybe don't just spread false narratives that can be easily falsified by a quick look at what actually happened in the game.
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@Bones said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@kpkanz like I said, no point conversing with you. Added bonus points to that for the word "triggered", definitely not worth conversing with people who use that to describe someone not sharing their opinion.
Someone earlier claimed Rieko was the only one who played poorly.
You replied saying BS and provided all your reasons why.
I provided direct counters that (I felt) invalidated your reasons.
You refuse to engage back and defend your position because apparently I have made my mind up (even though you never provided a single counter to even ascertain whether my mind could be changed).
Very convenient that when you don't have any valid justification for your opinion it's only because I am so bad faith that you refuse to engage. As opposed to you not being able to defend your original positions without looking disingenuous or misinformed.
Makes the whole point of a rugby forum and 'discussion' pointless but if it makes you feel better to die on that hill go ahead.
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@Bones said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@kpkanz I think it's quite clear I'm not dying on any hill. Keep up the ranting though, I'm so triggered I've come out the other side and finding it hilarious.
Still haven't provided a single counter.
All the best 👍 -
@canefan said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@LatsToTheMax said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@sparky said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
- It was high.
- There was some head contact.
How is a tackle in the ribs high? There’s head contact when the ball carrier hinges horizontal into contact. If that is yellow, then you have to PK every time a bloke drops his head running at the line.
I think you have to look at the way the tackle is ruled these days to see your argument is false. Aumua was too upright, and there is head to head contact along with the impact from the tackle to the body. You can't get away with that most of the time, as a general rule this is nothing new for the last couple of years. Of course there have been the odd incident that has been let go (Kolisi on Ardie, Porter on BBBR) for reasons I can't understand.
Completely disagree. He smacks him fair in the ribs. The head clash was purely accidental.
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@LatsToTheMax said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@canefan said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@LatsToTheMax said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@sparky said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
- It was high.
- There was some head contact.
How is a tackle in the ribs high? There’s head contact when the ball carrier hinges horizontal into contact. If that is yellow, then you have to PK every time a bloke drops his head running at the line.
I think you have to look at the way the tackle is ruled these days to see your argument is false. Aumua was too upright, and there is head to head contact along with the impact from the tackle to the body. You can't get away with that most of the time, as a general rule this is nothing new for the last couple of years. Of course there have been the odd incident that has been let go (Kolisi on Ardie, Porter on BBBR) for reasons I can't understand.
Completely disagree. He smacks him fair in the ribs. The head clash was purely accidental.
I respect your right to disagree. Unfortunately World Rugby says your viewpoint is incorrect
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@LatsToTheMax said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@canefan said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@LatsToTheMax said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@sparky said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
- It was high.
- There was some head contact.
How is a tackle in the ribs high? There’s head contact when the ball carrier hinges horizontal into contact. If that is yellow, then you have to PK every time a bloke drops his head running at the line.
I think you have to look at the way the tackle is ruled these days to see your argument is false. Aumua was too upright, and there is head to head contact along with the impact from the tackle to the body. You can't get away with that most of the time, as a general rule this is nothing new for the last couple of years. Of course there have been the odd incident that has been let go (Kolisi on Ardie, Porter on BBBR) for reasons I can't understand.
Completely disagree. He smacks him fair in the ribs. The head clash was purely accidental.
That is rarely a consideration in rugby these days. In league it definitely comes into play more.
This is all split second stuff, but Aumua entered that tackle on an angle that he needed to have a lower body height.
The below is right before impact. His shoulder needed to be lower to get him in the ribs and then not run the risk of head contact.
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under current interpretations that was a definite yellow.
but
my problem with that interpretation is, just based on that still alone, the highest body part a the point of contact was the shoulder of the tackled player. if there was slightly less force from both players (a change in direction sent the tackled in to the tackler much quicker) then there is no sanction. He's essentially carded for going too hard. I hate that.
agree that the lesson here is aim at the bottom of the ribs and end his night while you stay on the field, and have the games most replayed highlight.
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@LatsToTheMax said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@canefan said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@LatsToTheMax said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@sparky said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
- It was high.
- There was some head contact.
How is a tackle in the ribs high? There’s head contact when the ball carrier hinges horizontal into contact. If that is yellow, then you have to PK every time a bloke drops his head running at the line.
I think you have to look at the way the tackle is ruled these days to see your argument is false. Aumua was too upright, and there is head to head contact along with the impact from the tackle to the body. You can't get away with that most of the time, as a general rule this is nothing new for the last couple of years. Of course there have been the odd incident that has been let go (Kolisi on Ardie, Porter on BBBR) for reasons I can't understand.
Completely disagree. He smacks him fair in the ribs. The head clash was purely accidental.
Doesn't matter whether the head contact was accidental. Heads touching there mean you're flirting with a red, and it's a nailed on yellow.
This isn't the way 'we' necessarily want this reffed - but it is the norm aroudn the world. You can see why we get so many cards ... our tackle technique is years out of date. I don't like it, but it's the rules of the game
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@mariner4life Argentina looked like they'd been on the piss all week For sure a much better performance but still an unconvincing performance from an uninspired selection
So far this season we have struggled at home against the world #5 team capitulated against the #7 (ranked lower until they beat us) and won comfortably away against the number 10.
A good 40 minutes against Argentina doesn't disguise the inherent weaknesses in this team or inspire confidence that we are in for anything other than pain against the Bokke
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it sounds really harsh but i don't disagree. We did apply a lot more pressure this week, and they made some errors off that. But when we went through the phases i didn't think we were getting much change (and Ardie beastmode bullshit run aside. wait, that's not fair, one of them actually resulted in quick ball off the back of it).
We were able to open up the field a lot easier this week, as the Argie tackling was far less accurate, and there was far less heat on our ruck.
Great confidence booster in really shitty conditions though, we absolutely slapped them. Probably could have scored two more tries in the 2nd half with an ounce more patience.
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@canefan said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@LatsToTheMax said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@canefan said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@LatsToTheMax said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@sparky said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
- It was high.
- There was some head contact.
How is a tackle in the ribs high? There’s head contact when the ball carrier hinges horizontal into contact. If that is yellow, then you have to PK every time a bloke drops his head running at the line.
I think you have to look at the way the tackle is ruled these days to see your argument is false. Aumua was too upright, and there is head to head contact along with the impact from the tackle to the body. You can't get away with that most of the time, as a general rule this is nothing new for the last couple of years. Of course there have been the odd incident that has been let go (Kolisi on Ardie, Porter on BBBR) for reasons I can't understand.
Completely disagree. He smacks him fair in the ribs. The head clash was purely accidental.
I respect your right to disagree. Unfortunately World Rugby says your viewpoint is incorrect
And I'm calling World Rugby's viewpoint BS.
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@nzzp said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@LatsToTheMax said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@canefan said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@LatsToTheMax said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
@sparky said in All Blacks v Argentina II:
- It was high.
- There was some head contact.
How is a tackle in the ribs high? There’s head contact when the ball carrier hinges horizontal into contact. If that is yellow, then you have to PK every time a bloke drops his head running at the line.
I think you have to look at the way the tackle is ruled these days to see your argument is false. Aumua was too upright, and there is head to head contact along with the impact from the tackle to the body. You can't get away with that most of the time, as a general rule this is nothing new for the last couple of years. Of course there have been the odd incident that has been let go (Kolisi on Ardie, Porter on BBBR) for reasons I can't understand.
Completely disagree. He smacks him fair in the ribs. The head clash was purely accidental.
Doesn't matter whether the head contact was accidental. Heads touching there mean you're flirting with a red, and it's a nailed on yellow.
This isn't the way 'we' necessarily want this reffed - but it is the norm aroudn the world. You can see why we get so many cards ... our tackle technique is years out of date. I don't like it, but it's the rules of the game
It's completely flawed. There are head knocks almost every tackle. The laws have caused exponential cards yet nothing has changed in terms of injuries. It was nothing more than a god hard tackle.
