All Blacks 2025

reprobate

@Duluth said in All Blacks 2025:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

I don't think Retallick

He was a shit. Whether or not I cared depended on what jersey he wore

Yeah, if you say so - but regardless you could make a long list of niggly fuckwits who have been beaten on the field by people who weren't. It's just not a requirement for success, and it's not what is making us lose.

antipodean

@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2025:

@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2025:

I expect the 2025 squad to be the 2024 squad with maaaaybe some fiddling around the edges, and the test team to be the same as last year as well. That's kinda depressing really.

I think you'll be right on this. I expect most of us will be able to pick 90% of the squad.

But, I think there's a significant jump to test level from Super rugby, so most of the best prospects take time to get acclimatised - so there's a bit of disincentive to change.

But, more importantly, we never have to deal with any man-management issues associated with dropping a player. For example, if you were to drop Ardie - as many were advocating last year - you'd be feeling a bit sick right now if he'd signed a multi-million dollar contract to fuck off to Japan.

Maybe, possibly also hopeful as I think it might force the AB coaches to get balance in our backrow.

brodean

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

@Duluth said in All Blacks 2025:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

I don't think Retallick

He was a shit. Whether or not I cared depended on what jersey he wore

Yeah, if you say so - but regardless you could make a long list of niggly fuckwits who have been beaten on the field by people who weren't. It's just not a requirement for success, and it's not what is making us lose.

All of the teams that wo the RWC were niggly af.

reprobate

@brodean said in All Blacks 2025:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

@Duluth said in All Blacks 2025:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

I don't think Retallick

He was a shit. Whether or not I cared depended on what jersey he wore

Yeah, if you say so - but regardless you could make a long list of niggly fuckwits who have been beaten on the field by people who weren't. It's just not a requirement for success, and it's not what is making us lose.

All of the teams that wo the RWC were niggly af.

As per Duluth, all the teams that aren't us are niggly AF. I don't think they were more niggly in the years they won, we were just more irritated by them. Our winning teams weren't particularly niggly.

booboo

Aren't we blaming the Chief's loss on the weekend on Samipeni Finau for being a niggly fuck? Worked well huh?

DaGrubster

@brodean said in All Blacks 2025:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

@Chris said in All Blacks 2025:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

@brodean said in All Blacks 2025:

@nzzp said in All Blacks 2025:

@brodean said in All Blacks 2025:

One of the best maulers around too on attack and defence.

and a workrate that is off the charts. Man he gets involved a lot - not always good outcomes, but his motor is massive

Yeah the workrate stats are interesting this year.

Locks Contact Involvements Per 80 Minutes ( Carries + Rucks + Tackles )

64.84 Zach Gallagher
58.89 Will Stodart
56.07 Isaia Walker-Leawere
54.02 Jamie Hannah
53.5 Cameron Suafoa
53.09 Fabian Holland
52.83 Caleb Delany
50.23 Josh Lord
49.83 Naitoa Ah Kuoi
49.45 Josh Beehre
48.99 Scott Barrett
47.3 Tupou Vaa'i
46.86 Patrick Tuipulotu
46.47 Antonio Shalfoon
43.36 Allan Craig
40.74 Mitchell Dunshea

Based off theanalyst stats.

Of those guys, Holland would be the first actually playing 80 minutes maybe?

Yeah Holland,Barrett,Vai,Tuipulotu are the only ones playing 80 min consistently.

That matches what I've been seeing, the Dutchman has some motor, and the other 3 would all be targeting the international season. Pick him I reckon.
If he can put a few more kg on and keep the workrate he has a heap of potential. It's only really his emergence along with Vaai arguably outplaying Barrett last year which makes Barretts spot look anything less than rock solid.

He's already 120kg isn't he? I think Holland should be there. Unfortunately it looks like Lord and Darry are going the way of Blackadder with their injuries.

Yeah - 124kg. He doesn't need more weight on his frame at his age. He will put weight on naturally as he gets older.

He derserves to be called up. He has huge potential and reminds me of of a young retallick with his high workrate

Victor Meldrew

@No-Quarter

Def agree with your premise on developing players over time (see Tupou Vaa'i). And while Akira was treated badly by Hansen but he had more opportunists than many under Foster but never quite kicked on.

Robertson and co. may have missed a trick last year with him, but we'll never know

Nepia

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:

@No-Quarter

Def agree with your premise on developing players over time (see Tupou Vaa'i). And while Akira was treated badly by Hansen but he had more opportunists than many under Foster but never quite kicked on.

Robertson and co. may have missed a trick last year with him, but we'll never know

And neither did Blackadder and Frizell yet one is an insta pick when fit and the other one is being courted constantly by the Tubby coach despite the fact he is in Japan and a shitty human.

reprobate

@Nepia said in All Blacks 2025:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:

@No-Quarter

Def agree with your premise on developing players over time (see Tupou Vaa'i). And while Akira was treated badly by Hansen but he had more opportunists than many under Foster but never quite kicked on.

Robertson and co. may have missed a trick last year with him, but we'll never know

And neither did Blackadder and Frizell yet one is an insta pick when fit and the other one is being courted constantly by the Tubby coach despite the fact he is in Japan and a shitty human.

Akira was given about an equal chance by Foster vs Frizellm then they chose Frizell. He was going overseas before Robertson announced a squad. And apparently shitty humans is the way forward anyway.
Blackadder still hasn't played as many games for the ABs as Akira did - so you could argue he hasn't had as much of a chance yet..

nostrildamus

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

Blackadder still hasn't played as many games for the ABs as Akira did - so you could argue he hasn't had as much of a chance yet..

I don't really want to wade back into this argument but you've got to admit the fact that Blackadder has been injured a helleva lot more often than Akira really puts into question this whole 'he hasn't had as much of a chance' conclusion..

SBW1

What are the chances of getting some of our older All Blacks like Aaron Smith back for another Super season?

reprobate

@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

Blackadder still hasn't played as many games for the ABs as Akira did - so you could argue he hasn't had as much of a chance yet..

I don't really want to wade back into this argument but you've got to admit the fact that Blackadder has been injured a helleva lot more often than Akira really puts into question this whole 'he hasn't had as much of a chance' conclusion..

Well you can't prove yourself at test level without playing at test level, so obviously being injured prevents that opportunity.
Given how upset people are at Akira only getting 22 goes, they must be clamouring for Blackadder to get a lot more than his current 14?

nostrildamus

@SBW1 said in All Blacks 2025:

What are the chances of getting some of our older All Blacks like Aaron Smith back for another Super season?

Pretty good, I imagine a certain team in the north wouldn't mind an experienced 9 with a good pass.

brodean

@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

Blackadder still hasn't played as many games for the ABs as Akira did - so you could argue he hasn't had as much of a chance yet..

I don't really want to wade back into this argument but you've got to admit the fact that Blackadder has been injured a helleva lot more often than Akira really puts into question this whole 'he hasn't had as much of a chance' conclusion..

If you look at the current crop of players and the players over the last cycle most of them didn't start playing consistently better until after they had 20 or 30 odd tests under their belt. Richie Mo'unga for example was at about 30 tests by the end of the Irish series. He played through that period when we lost with the rest of those players.

Sure he produced some good games now and then but he also failed to take tests by the scruff of the neck on multiple occasions - he did that at Super level but not at test level.

Same with Jordie Barrett. It took him about 30 tests before he stopped the brain farts.

I've seen Newell get his head shoved up is us a couple of times against the South African scrum.

Havili is on 30 odd tests now and he's still getting chances even though he's thrown at least 3 intercepts for the ABs that led to tries.

Reece on multiple occasions has shown he is a liability under the highball and lacks pace.

So many players have gotten multiple chances despite their deficiencies.

nostrildamus

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

@nostrildamus said in All Blacks 2025:

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

Blackadder still hasn't played as many games for the ABs as Akira did - so you could argue he hasn't had as much of a chance yet..

I don't really want to wade back into this argument but you've got to admit the fact that Blackadder has been injured a helleva lot more often than Akira really puts into question this whole 'he hasn't had as much of a chance' conclusion..

Well you can't prove yourself at test level without playing at test level, so obviously being injured prevents that opportunity.
Given how upset people are at Akira only getting 22 goes, they must be clamouring for Blackadder to get a lot more than his current 14?

I'm not convinced you addressed what I posted but anyway Akira was up against Frizell, Blackadder if/when he was available was recently up against Sititi. Who of SF and WS do you think offered the stronger competition?

Nepia

@reprobate said in All Blacks 2025:

@Nepia said in All Blacks 2025:

@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2025:

@No-Quarter

Def agree with your premise on developing players over time (see Tupou Vaa'i). And while Akira was treated badly by Hansen but he had more opportunists than many under Foster but never quite kicked on.

Robertson and co. may have missed a trick last year with him, but we'll never know

And neither did Blackadder and Frizell yet one is an insta pick when fit and the other one is being courted constantly by the Tubby coach despite the fact he is in Japan and a shitty human.

Akira was given about an equal chance by Foster vs Frizellm then they chose Frizell. He was going overseas before Robertson announced a squad. And apparently shitty humans is the way forward anyway.
Blackadder still hasn't played as many games for the ABs as Akira did - so you could argue he hasn't had as much of a chance yet..

Frizell clearly got more opportunities than Akira, otherwise how else would he have failed so spectacularly in a RWC final? Akira wasn't there. My response was to a comment saying he had more opportunists (sic) than others.

You're being a bit disingenuous about the number of games Blackadder has played, he's an insta pick in AB squads when not injured, he's just injured frequently.