All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham
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@Duluth said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
@Steve said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
similarly Vermuelen was slapping the head off Jacobsen
It was his back. Stop being a sore loser
We were out played
The third one 100% clatters him on the head.
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Not the be all and end all but playing with 7 Forwards against the Boks forward pack did not help it made the Job a lot tougher, that was One of many factors.
Both hookers could not throw straight.
We couldn't hold there scrum with 7 forwards
Passive clean outs at ruck and maul time Scott Barrett really the only one who did that and he missed his target and got carded.
Lack of aggression in our carries.
Our Captain looked shell shocked.We look like we were going though the motions to be honest, a real lack of intent,I have seen that before during the last 3 years.
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Agree with all of that
In general I just don't think our pack is that good. It's competitive but we struggle when the game is dragged into an arm wrestle. We only have one style of play
I think the core problem is SR. The game is refereed differently at that level therefore what works at that level doesn't always apply to Test level.
For instance one of the higher rated forwards in NZ almost never enters through the gate. In SR the attacking team is given so much leeway so he never gets called. When he's in the Test side he concedes a lot of penalties and NZ fans complain about pedantic refs
The positives of SR are there too. If we do manage to get quick ball we play pretty rugby and run away with matches. It's just a lot harder to get quick ball because of the higher quality opposition and refs that enforce the laws
At least it's a long tournament so we might be able to adjust. Otherwise it will be feast or famine from week to week. As it has been for years
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Yep spot on,We are not conditioned for that hard Grind arm wrestle type game.
SR has to change then but I can not see that happening.
Maybe a global Club championship may help some what, even it is only 2 or 3 of our SR teams qualify for it. -
We’re in a bit of a bind, then. We stuck in an ever narrowing competition with Australia, which needs pretty, free-flowing rugby with lots of tries to compete in a crowded winter sports market. Northern Hemisphere-style grindfests, with the referee blowing the pea out of the whistle, won’t sell in this television dominated market. And without the South African teams offering a point of difference anymore, the NZ teams are locked into that style. The Silver Lake cash will run out eventually and in the meantime the brand will be gradually destroyed. But in the nature of private equity investment, they will extract every drop of remaining value before they inevitably pull out. Sad, but true.
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Mix up the refs. Some NH ones come down, we send some of ours north for a few weeks
5 teams run from the top down doesn’t encourage innovation. It’s great if the style being imposed from the top is the right choice
More independence for the SR sides would be good. Let’s have a NZ team playing like the Boks
Maybe more than 5 teams too…
Getting way off topic now
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@Duluth said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
For instance one of the higher rated forwards in NZ almost never enters through the gate. In SR the attacking team is given so much leeway so he never gets called. When he's in the Test side he concedes a lot of penalties and NZ fans complain about pedantic refs
Who are you talking about there?
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Gregor Paul has a go at over-zealous officiating.
Gregor Paul: Rugby World Cup looks set to be hijacked by pedantry, fakery and group-think
Opinion: The biggest loser on Saturday was potentially the global rugby fraternity.
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Plenty of things can go wrong by agreeing to play our biggest nemesis as a warm up match. Or go right, if you get it right.... But we didn't get this one right
Still prone to brain snaps under pressure
Roigard probably best number two, but will sit behind the ginger unless injury occurs.
Hoping Lomax heals quickly from that nasty gash, wonder if he will be called hermy in camp?
Is the balance of the squad right? Still not sure.A timely reminder you're only as good as your last game and players need to keep their head in the game, just can they correct it in time?. We all know that they can, but we have also seen at times they tend to double down on stupid plays even when they know they shouldn't.
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@bayimports said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
Roigard probably best number two, but will sit behind the ginger unless injury occurs.
Even Foster isn't that dumb - is he?
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I think a lot has to do with what the referee focuses on early and we are caught out by starting with what works in super rugby when others play NH style with an NH ref.
The slowing down of the game and the cunning way the Boks played the ref meant that we hardly got a look in by trying super rugby tactics.I thought our defence under the constant pressure was very good indeed. Missing an easy penalty would have been a confidence drainer as would yielding intercepts to retreating players.
I wonder if Will Jordan could run closer to inside players to make it harder for defenders to disrupt our chain moves?Looks to me like squad balance is very wrong now. Telea is a lock in with his tackle breaking ability. And we may need a bench player who has strong clearing kicks much more than another power winger.
Far more need for another 6 or lock or both now. Unless we address this I can see France Boks and Ireland with a 6 2 bench against overpowering us.
Maybe we will have learned enough from this loss to make some radical changes needed for the challenges ahead. I hope so. -
RasNaber have created a nice to have problem with player depth in their squad. The new generation of players look like passing the 2019 WC group. Willemse vs Willie, KLA and Moodie vs Kolbey and Mapimpi, AE and Moodie/Kriel vs Am and Ellendig, Libbok vs Pollard, Faf vs Hendricks, Vermeulen vs Wiese, Kwagga vs PST, Etsebeth and Mostert vs Snyman and Kleyn, Malherbe vs Koch, Marx vs Bongi and Kitshoff vs Ox. Then they have third options who can make most country teams.
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@His-Bobness said in All Blacks vs Springboks - Twickenham:
Gregor Paul has a go at over-zealous officiating.
Gregor Paul: Rugby World Cup looks set to be hijacked by pedantry, fakery and group-think
Opinion: The biggest loser on Saturday was potentially the global rugby fraternity.
Would you like some cheese with your whine Gregor?
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@MiketheSnow he has clicks to collect.
When does the RWC start? Man this thread is gonna take a thrashing!
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@Steve Great post.
Something went wrong with the side’s identity after McCaw, Carter, Nonu, Smith, Woodcock and Mealamu retired and we went all Disney in the off season of 2016-7. And they have struggled to recapture a hard nosed ruthless edge since.
PR photos from last week of them grinning like idiots on the Ted Lasso bench had me worrying about the mindset ahead of a physical struggle with the Boks.
We’ve become far too nice, something you would never have said about Sean Fitzpatrick, Buck Shelford and co.
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@His-Bobness For me the worry is that some of the officiating this weekend has been zealous, some of it has been laissez-faire.
Sides that can adapt from the start to different refereeing styles will be at a huge advantage in the RWC. South Africa are helped by having players in their squad who play in lots of different domestic competitions around the world and some of their squad have played club or provincial rugby in several countries.
