All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2
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@reprobate said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@voodoo That's the thing though - he didn't have a blinder. And it was still the best our backline has functioned in a couple of years.
soooo, maybe it was more to do with our forwards and Smith then? Plus the midfield getting more and more chops?
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@voodoo said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@reprobate said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@voodoo That's the thing though - he didn't have a blinder. And it was still the best our backline has functioned in a couple of years.
soooo, maybe it was more to do with our forwards and Smith then? Plus the midfield getting more and more chops?
Or maybe it's a first five who plays flat at the line and combines well with his backline (inside and out).
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
I think I'd characterize that quite differently - I think he's actually a very consistent selector. He gives people runs of games and I think has a very clear idea of what his top team is - it just doesn't always accord with what the Fern thinks and wants. He probably errs in sometimes showing too much loyalty/consistency.
On first fives, Beaudy started the first half of last season (carrying on from 2021 when he'd got his nose in front in the latter part of the season - and recalling babies and injuries at the end) and only after the run of losses did Richie take over.
Havili got a long run at 12 and Jordie was clearly established as our first choice 15. I'd guess Fozzie didn't want to disrupt his backfield combination (Clarke, Jordan, Jordie) to try to solve his midfield problem.
He clearly wants Jordan at 14, so he's been very consistent there.
You don't think those two things might be related? Our back play has been terrible since BB became our starting 1st-5. Then we have RM and DMac and things start to look up. That isn't a coincidence in my book.
Foster is beyond "consistent" and deep into stubborn. He will play Beauden until he breaks, no matter how many passes he shovels right in front of the posts to people in worse positions.
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@voodoo The forwards have fronted up off and on over the past 2 years, and Smith has rarely been less than excellent: even at his worst he's been very good by others' standards. Barrett helps the midfield, but again, Foster's hand was somewhat forced there and despite the solution then being right in front of him he kept trying to revert to what hadn't worked in the past.
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@voodoo said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@reprobate said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@voodoo That's the thing though - he didn't have a blinder. And it was still the best our backline has functioned in a couple of years.
soooo, maybe it was more to do with our forwards and Smith then? Plus the midfield getting more and more chops?
Or maybe it's a first five who plays flat at the line and combines well with his backline (inside and out).
who knows - but I'll tell you one certainty - the knives will come out for RM when he gets rushed ball this week cos the forwards struggle for dominance (or maybe even parity), and because the midfield isn't able to break the gain line after receiving identical ball to last week...
Look, I'm no DMac hater - he did some great stuff last week. But we love to call RM a "rocks and diamonds" guy, and DMac's effort last week was the ultimate R&D showcase.
The reality is that we simply don't have the kind of 10 in our squad who can boss a game with his boot when territory is all important - they all look great behind dominant forwards, and bloody awful when time is taken away from them.
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@voodoo said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@reprobate said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@voodoo That's the thing though - he didn't have a blinder. And it was still the best our backline has functioned in a couple of years.
soooo, maybe it was more to do with our forwards and Smith then? Plus the midfield getting more and more chops?
Dmac got 3 try assists in that game, Ioane, BB and Narawa all to do with him helping create space and putting men into that space - as you would expect a good first 5 to do and what he did for the Chiefs all season.
Yeah the forwards and Smith helped create some space/less bodies in the line but you still have to see it and still put people into it - which Dmac did, even after a shaky start.
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@voodoo said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
and DMac's effort last week was the ultimate R&D showcase.
'The ultimate rocks and diamonds showcase'. You think that's just a tad hyperbolic? On the charge down the Argies were miles offside and I remember he dropped a ball in the second half but the ultimate rocks and diamonds is way overboard.
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@voodoo said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@voodoo said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@reprobate said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@voodoo That's the thing though - he didn't have a blinder. And it was still the best our backline has functioned in a couple of years.
soooo, maybe it was more to do with our forwards and Smith then? Plus the midfield getting more and more chops?
Or maybe it's a first five who plays flat at the line and combines well with his backline (inside and out).
who knows - but I'll tell you one certainty - the knives will come out for RM when he gets rushed ball this week cos the forwards struggle for dominance (or maybe even parity), and because the midfield isn't able to break the gain line after receiving identical ball to last week...
Look, I'm no DMac hater - he did some great stuff last week. But we love to call RM a "rocks and diamonds" guy, and DMac's effort last week was the ultimate R&D showcase.
The reality is that we simply don't have the kind of 10 in our squad who can boss a game with his boot when territory is all important - they all look great behind dominant forwards, and bloody awful when time is taken away from them.
Yup, I couldn't agree more.. The fowards set a great platform that enabled the backs to take advantage and play well. Best exemplified by the lack of a strong platform and the resulting scrappiness of the last 30mins last week once the fwd reserves came on.
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@Chester-Draws said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
I think I'd characterize that quite differently - I think he's actually a very consistent selector. He gives people runs of games and I think has a very clear idea of what his top team is - it just doesn't always accord with what the Fern thinks and wants. He probably errs in sometimes showing too much loyalty/consistency.
On first fives, Beaudy started the first half of last season (carrying on from 2021 when he'd got his nose in front in the latter part of the season - and recalling babies and injuries at the end) and only after the run of losses did Richie take over.
Havili got a long run at 12 and Jordie was clearly established as our first choice 15. I'd guess Fozzie didn't want to disrupt his backfield combination (Clarke, Jordan, Jordie) to try to solve his midfield problem.
He clearly wants Jordan at 14, so he's been very consistent there.
You don't think those two things might be related? Our back play has been terrible since BB became our starting 1st-5. Then we have RM and DMac and things start to look up. That isn't a coincidence in my book.
I completely agree - well, I'm not quite as harsh on Beaudy's whole career, but clearly he had to go mid-2022!
Fozzie's "consistency" is why I'll be amazed if DMac supplants Richie barring injury or some disastrous performances.
Mainly, at this point, I like that. It would be pretty concerning to be this close to a RWC and not have a clear idea of who our first choice first five is. It would be like a top NFL team starting their season not knowing who their starting QB is.
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@voodoo said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
and DMac's effort last week was the ultimate R&D showcase.
'The ultimate rocks and diamonds showcase'. You think that's just a tad hyperbolic? On the charge down the Argies were miles offside and I remember he dropped a ball in the second half but the ultimate rocks and diamonds is way overboard.
They may have been offside but he still put the ball to boot! He then missed 2 very kickable shots at goal. That can easily be enough in a big game.
I can let the 2nd half stuff go given how disjointed the whole team looked.
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@Windows97 said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@voodoo said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@reprobate said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@voodoo That's the thing though - he didn't have a blinder. And it was still the best our backline has functioned in a couple of years.
soooo, maybe it was more to do with our forwards and Smith then? Plus the midfield getting more and more chops?
Dmac got 3 try assists in that game, Ioane, BB and Narawa all to do with him helping create space and putting men into that space - as you would expect a good first 5 to do and what he did for the Chiefs all season.
Yeah the forwards and Smith helped create some space/less bodies in the line but you still have to see it and still put people into it - which Dmac did, even after a shaky start.
That to me was the difference. The ABs tries weren't scored from individual brilliance they were tries created through manipulation - something that has been rare in the ABs for years.
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@voodoo said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@reprobate said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
@voodoo That's the thing though - he didn't have a blinder. And it was still the best our backline has functioned in a couple of years.
soooo, maybe it was more to do with our forwards and Smith then? Plus the midfield getting more and more chops?
Or maybe it's a first five who plays flat at the line and combines well with his backline (inside and out).
a first five that actually looked to unleash his backline rather than either run it himself or kick it away?....madness
DMac was not perfect...at least twice worried me running sideways ducking and weaving behind our line...BUT...he was looking to put people in holes or in space
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
That to me was the difference. The ABs tries weren't scored from individual brilliance they were tries created through manipulation - something that has been rare in the ABs for years.
Yes agree with that, the AB's have been a hard watch recently as so much of the attack seems to be based off someone pulling something out of their ass or throwing the ball around in the hope that one of our backs gets a 1:1 with a fatty in the defensive line.
Rugby is beautiful to watch when a defense is manipulated, space is created and people run into that space. Maybe it's just me - but when you outthink your opposition to score instead of just using brute force or flair it's just so much more pleasing.
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@Winger said in All Blacks Vs Springboks RC Week 2:
Not testing Roigard in the next 2 tests would be idiotic. I hope he starts in 1 and is a replacement in the other. And if he doesn't measure up then he shouldn't be in the RWC squad
I reckon he’s a good chance in the Bledisloe. Alternatively he’s just there for the experience and their 3rd choice halfback for the RWC is getting actual game time in the AB XV
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On Fozzie's consistency - here's our team last time we played the Boks. By my count, 17 of the 23 are the same. Five are out due to injury (though a couple probably wouldn't make the 23), and Akira is subbed by Paps.
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The only reason Ennor gets consistent bench spots is because he covers wing. Why the fuck is Clarke on the bench with him then? Throw in the fact that Reiko covers wing!!!!!
It’s the fucking wing and we’ve got 5 people covering it
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What is the point in bringing Finau and Roigard into the squad if they won’t be used. The World Cup is so close and they’re just there to hold the tackle bags.
Are the starters for the ABs xv the actual back ups to the main ABs?
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@Yeahtheboys while I am sure Roigard and Finau are learning alot and will be the better for being immersed in the AB Squad, it is frustrating that they havent had a shot, Roigard in particular given Christie is a bit of an issue at present, Finau possibly was a shot to come off the bench if SW was fit?
You'd have to think probably 18 or 19 of this side was penciled in before they left for Argentina.
