Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF
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@dice 12/13 are tough positions to defend, and often it is better as a combination builds rather than 1 being a good defender and the other poor, which makes it all the more odd when coaches choose to slot someone in there when they not only havent been playing there to build a combination, but when it isnt thier usual position.
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@dice said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
@act-crusader said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
@shark said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
Laumape reminds me of Sam Tuitupou in many ways. Similarly limited but good enough at what he does well to please people when he’s on.
Sammy T moved well laterally on defence. Laumape can hit hard in the tackle like Tuitupou but struggles with an all round defensive game.
Laumape's midfield partner was even worse on defense. Jordie missed a fat 7 tackles against the Crusaders.
He needs to chat to Sam W or Brodie about tackling technique as a giraffe. He often goes too high and risks a penalty or is easily stepped/bumped off. He's young so will learn but it's something he should be focusing on right now.
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@dice said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
@winger said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
@gt12 said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
@shark said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
At least last night's game eases the AB midfield 'logjam' with Laumape having by far his worst game of the season. No pressure to select him now.
Agreed. His defense was woeful at times - it’s a real shame because, on attack, I think he has the tools to be awesome at the next level. On defense though, he looks a liability right now.
I would prefer to see Aso (best position looks to be 12 and he's too good not to start) starting at 12 next year with Laumape as an impact player. At this stage he's too one dimensional. If a team defends well Laumape is ordinary
Aso is largely invisible when he's played 12. He had no impact at all when he played there at NPC level. He's got gas and it's best used in the outside channels, similar to Rieko.
He was outstanding when he started one game at 12 for the Canes.But like all players they need time to find their feet in a new position. Hes not a center though so 2nd or wing
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@taniwharugby said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
@dice 12/13 are tough positions to defend, and often it is better as a combination builds rather than 1 being a good defender and the other poor, which makes it all the more odd when coaches choose to slot someone in there when they not only havent been playing there to build a combination, but when it isnt thier usual position.
Jordie isn't a center yet. Goosen should have started there (his defense is usually a strong point) with Jordie at FB but once poor selecting / coaching.
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@mimic said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
I must admit, after watching this game, I believe Richie is the answer to the rush defence.
His option taking and passing in tight spaces were brilliant.
Using that game as the complete sample size, I would have him as the ABs starting 10.
BB is a bit of an enigma. Maybe he suits test rugby better than Super somehow.
If Mounga can play like that most of the time and also do so when given a shot in black he would be our best 10. -
@crucial said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
If Mounga can play like that most of the time and also do so when given a shot in black he would be our best 10.
That 'if" is doing some mighty heavy carrying.
It needs to be a "because" before he gets to start as AB 10.
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@shark said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
Laumape reminds me of Sam Tuitupou in many ways. Similarly limited but good enough at what he does well to please people when he’s on.
Saw Sam last year playing club rugby for Coventry. A little larger round the middle, but still runs very punchy lines off the short ball.
Does Laumape have any form with Lions locks?
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I watching the game again and focused on the Cnaes defense. It use to us a strength and now its a weakness
Some of the defensive laps were school-boyish. For example two players grouping together with nil reason too. Savea and Lam were guilty of this
Lam is not a great defender. He is not quick enough other than running straight. But moving quickly to one side. He's hopeless. So give him the ball with the line open or against poor defenders and he's brilliant. But otherwise not up to much.
Savea was Ok-good but blundered once by not staying out instead moving in to help his mate out. Jordie is not a center. I doubt if he ever will be. Either FB or maybe 2nd 5 but he needs to learn the defensive ropes at 2nd. Laumape is great and poor. MS I can't really remember him doing anything bad but not much good either
So Savea was the best of the outside back defensively along with Goosen when he came on. And thats the issue for me. Too many outside backs that are limited defensively. And a good+ defender (Goosen) and a good attacker doens't get to start. Hes a much better option than Jordie at center
The forwards went well. But Shields made a few blunders and missed on easy enough tackle. If he wants to make the England starting team he will have to improve a lot of this front
I'm unsure whats happened to the coaches. they just seem to have (completely) lost the plot. Don't they review the games afterwards. Defense has been an issue for some time
Next years they must have a good defending mid-field. Its essential. BB is good as is Penenara. So Proctor and Goosen are two options. I haven't really watched Aso in this respect. Jordie isn't good enough. He might be one day but not yet. Laumape needs a lot of work on this aspect.
Lam also needs to massively improve. Either do so or they must look at other options. The coaches have been rubbish this year. I thought the attack game plan was dreadful but there are also major issues with the back-line defense. Although to be fair the forward with lots of injuries went well. Maybe the fall out with Boyd leaving created fiction. I hope its this not Plumtree having lost it
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I am watching the game again too and I must say that the Canes scrum was not as bad as some ferners lamented (with one notable occasion though).
Gareth Evans was their best forward while Toby Smith ran hard. Sam Lousi looked tired. Riccitelli as well. Maybe both of them have played too much this year. -
@winger That's one game though.
Aso isn't that good in traffic and that's something he's going to have to deal with at 12. He has size but isn't much of a crash ball guy nor a guy who wins the gain line when he doesn't have space to work with. He reminds me a lot of Romi Ropati, who could also play 12, but did his best work at centre and wing.
It's odd that you say that the Canes need a good defensive midfield, but champion Aso of all people to be in that midfield.
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@cgrant said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
I am watching the game again too and I must say that the Canes scrum was not as bad as some ferners lamented (with one notable occasion though).
Gareth Evans was their best forward while Toby Smith ran hard. Sam Lousi looked tired. Riccitelli as well. Maybe both of them have played too much this year.Spot on. Due to Coles' and Aumua's injuries, he has played the most minutes (1,231) of all hookers in the SR competition. The next one is Malcom Marx with 999 minutes, who obviously still has a game to play. That must be the 2nd year in a row for Riccitelli to play that much, considering Coles was also injured during most of the 2017 season and there was no adequate back-up (Apisai was also injured for some time).
Only one frontower has played more than Riccitelli this year; Tom Robertson from the Waratahs with 1,252 minutes.
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Missed tackle stats are one thing but how/why they are missing tackles is more important.
It’s interesting when you look back at stats alone there are a few quality centres that had relatively high missed tackle counts. Kahui for example, even Conrad.
There’s not a rugby player on this earth that will ever not miss a tackle and yes the midfield is tough place to defend, but you know when someone’s not moving well or shoots out of the line and doesn’t read the play. Laumape, Reiko and Jordie have some ways to go when it comes to those aspects.
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@act-crusader not to mention how often a player mis-reads a play or is too slow to react, and the attacker waltzes past them (not a miss for them in stats) this player then beats the 2nd line of defence and the FB or winger gets a missed tackle stat, despite it not really being his fault.
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@taniwharugby said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
@act-crusader not to mention how often a player mis-reads a play or is too slow to react, and the attacker waltzes past them (not a miss for them in stats) this player then beats the 2nd line of defence and the FB or winger gets a missed tackle stat, despite it not really being his fault.
Agree TR. Just on that, that is one of Jordie’s real strengths in defence. He’s an excellent cover tackler (as is his brother). They have the combination of good anticipation and speed to cover ground and run a good angle. Beauden one of the best I’ve ever seen.
DMac isn’t too bad either. Havili ok and improving. He’s a better front on tackler and probably doesn’t have the pace of those other 3.
Dan Carter (remember that guy) was a damn good 12 because his defence was superb. Copy book tackling technique and good eye for reading the play. He didn’t make every tackle but he rarely got caught out of position.
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@act-crusader I don't think Conrad has ever been that high in missed tackles, at least compared to the volume of tackles he made. I followed his stats for years and his tackle completion % was consistently around 89%- 90%. Honestly, it rarely went lower or higher than that, which I found fascinating.
I remember when there use to be debates here on Conrad vs Kahui, and the tackle stats came out and Kahui had more missed tackles than Conrad, but Conrad attempted more than twice as many tackles. Conrad would be in my shortlist for GOAT defender.
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@rocky-rockbottom said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
ps changed my profile pic in solidarity with my southern freak brothers
Change it back to your Bloos logo ya freak
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Is that the same as @SammyC 's? If so we could get some amusing cases of mistaken identity
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@mariner4life haha I only just realised it wasnt @SammyC and was thinking I am certain that was your avatar already!
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@rocky-rockbottom said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
@mariner4life said in Crusaders v Hurricanes - SF:
we could get some amusing cases of mistaken identity
it's gonna be weird getting thought of as someone who makes sense for 1 or 2 minute spells
I'm looking forward to when the cantab mafia round on Sammy when he declares Akira Ioane to be waaaay better than Luke Whitelock; and for hating on Tana
