All Blacks v Ireland II
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Just on watching the Cane Henshaw thing again you can actually make argument that Henshaw's spin around actually made him 'headbutt' Canes shoulder rather than Cane initiating contact (i.e. Henshaw's head was moving slightly faster than Cane's shoulder. The contact looks to be head and shoulder simultaneously. Absolutely no intent or clumsiness on Cane's part. He is actually crouching to go into the tackle so can hardly be targeting.
Whatever the initial contact I think Henshaw having to leave the field was probably more to do with landing heavily and his head whiplashing into the deck then being landed on by Cane's hip area. He basically got a triple-whammy.
All accidental and I could even live with a card if it was under the protocol that head contact is to be clamped down on and even accidental stuff treated harshly to force players to aim lower.
That said, the swinging arm on BB points to the officials not enacting any such protocol (if one exists at all)
Fekitoa's one was ugly and obvious. -
to me cane's tackle was just bad luck. one angle looked bad, but the other angle showed his left arm wrapping first - and the initial contact not high - then the right shoulder and head clash. just one of those things that happens in a contact sport.
fekitoa was clear yellow. so was sexton. -
Just looked at the Rugby Refs forum to see if there was any outrage/discussion and so far just these comments (both from Australian refs)
"Correct decision.
Looked bad at full speed but the slow-mo shows it was a head clash that floored the Irish player. Initial contact in the tackle was OK but rode up.""Two eyes in that commentary box - one for each commentator."
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@Samurai-Jack said in Ireland II:
Bugger me. The Cane thing was such a non-event it is ridiculous to even talk about it let alone be awarded a penalty. Same goes for the A.Smith YC! Yellow card for what Peyper? Coming through the gate and competing for the bloody ball? Arse!
I watched that sequence again and Peyper has it all wrong. The Irish set a maul and took it to ground - there's clearly an Irish player at the front on his knees. Peyper gives them a penalty advantage. That rolls into a tackle where Murray is unimpeded getting to the ball but is exposed because the Irish have gone off their feet beyond the ruck. Peyper calls a second penalty advantage. Aaron comes through from onside and kicks the ball without playing Murray. For that he receives a yellow card.
Unfortunately the TMO's correct ruling on Barrett's try appeared to fluster Jaco to the point he never addressed Sexton's foul play.
@Crucial said in Ireland II:
Just on watching the Cane Henshaw thing again you can actually make argument that Henshaw's spin around actually made him 'headbutt' Canes shoulder rather than Cane initiating contact (i.e. Henshaw's head was moving slightly faster than Cane's shoulder. The contact looks to be head and shoulder simultaneously. Absolutely no intent or clumsiness on Cane's part. He is actually crouching to go into the tackle so can hardly be targeting.
Whatever the initial contact I think Henshaw having to leave the field was probably more to do with landing heavily and his head whiplashing into the deck then being landed on by Cane's hip area. He basically got a triple-whammy.
All accidental and I could even live with a card if it was under the protocol that head contact is to be clamped down on and even accidental stuff treated harshly to force players to aim lower.The absurdity is Henshaw is taller than Cane so it's not like Cane was careless.
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@Crucial said in Ireland II:
Just looked at the Rugby Refs forum to see if there was any outrage/discussion and so far just these comments (both from Australian refs)
"Correct decision.
Looked bad at full speed but the slow-mo shows it was a head clash that floored the Irish player. Initial contact in the tackle was OK but rode up.""Two eyes in that commentary box - one for each commentator."
Their commentary was disgraceful and it got worse than this as the game went on:
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That's tame. Try the RTÉ commentary. It was far more biased.
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On another topic, I have just been watching BBs try again (by the way was able to freeze frame a clear and obvious grounding) and the making of that break is a brilliant piece of planning by Foster to utilise BBs acceleration.
Basically Ireland's defensive pattern is illegal. Their halfback moves across to cover the attacking 10 channel before the scrum ends without dropping behind his 8.20.12
(e)
The scrum half whose team does not win possession of the ball must not move away from the scrum and then remain in front of the offside line. For that scrum half that runs through the hindmost foot of that player’s team in the scrum.This means the 10 can drift to the attacking 12 etc creating an extra man in defence and looking to double team the ball carrier.
Instead of whinging to the ref about this what the ABs noticed is that the 10 will not come back in, he relies heavily on the 9 to cover the gap (which he usually can because he takes off early). So BB stationed himself wide and his outsides acted like they were going to be the ball carriers. AS then passed fast and long (better at this than TJP) and BB ran as close as he could to the inside shoulder of the 10 and just out of reach of the covering 9. The 10 could have easily tackled him but was relying on the 9. The initial pass was bang on, BBs speed and angle did the rest.I think this is what Foster meant in the post match when he said they spotted some players that pushed up and held in defence without actually wanting to tackle. It was exploited beautifully.
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@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
That's tame. Try the RTÉ commentary. It was far more biased.
I didn't realise there was more than one Irish commentary we have been talking about I don't think the one I had (on SkySport UK) was the one in that clip. Must have been the RTE one as it was positively feral the whole game. You could have sworn it was a team of Phil Kearns' Irish cousins.
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@Crucial said in Ireland II:
@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
That's tame. Try the RTÉ commentary. It was far more biased.
I didn't realise there was more than one Irish commentary we have been talking about I don't think the one I had (on SkySport UK) was the one in that clip. Must have been the RTE one as it was positively feral the whole game. You could have sworn it was a team of Phil Kearns' Irish cousins.
Honestly, on the RTE stream (which is what I had on rugbypass), NZ would have finished with 5 men on the park. I just felt like saying "harden up". Yes, the Fekitoa tackle was a shocker, but it was like every NZ tackle was a potential YC or RC.
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Whoever the comments man was on sky sport was disgraceful. At one stage he was saying the all blacks were crossing the line by being aggressive, at every stoppage he was moaning about all blacks illegal tactics, like "being very quick". As said, Cane should have been red carded and the referees were cheating along with the all blacks, yet not even a word about Sexton. I'm sure he said something to imply Cane was injured as he was cheating too.
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Normally I don't bother grabbing the NZ comms version of any AB game to rewatch as I can usually laugh at people like Kearns et al, but these lot were full on vitriolic and as close to naked Hatred as I've ever heard. I was surprised there was no mention of St "I might have Died" BOD asthat would probably have resulted in my monitor going through the french doors.
It's this sort of aberrant nonsensical fuckstickery that gives me no regrets about supporting ABI (unles it's the Poms)
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Well I haven't had a chance to watch the game yet and by the sounds of it, haven't missed much.
New Zealand won is the only relevant thing though.
Wonder how the Australia game will go.
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@Pot-Hale it was a tough, tight game and there were some flashy moments but I don't know if it could be considered a great game. Ireland were very good and great teamwork but lacked finish, NZ had flair but lacked ..ah, the ball.
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@Pot-Hale said in Ireland II:
Well I haven't had a chance to watch the game yet and by the sounds of it, haven't missed much.
New Zealand won is the only relevant thing though.
Wonder how the Australia game will go.
Your pack was excellent, especially your backrow.
Your backs didn't really know what to do with the ball, the old chestnuts of Payne in the centres, and Trimble/Kearney in the back three will come into focus again.
I'm rapidly losing interest in the game though, the Irish media going to town with gifs, screenshots, clickbait etc, as if NZ was a bunch of criminals. The criminal element is Australia (many of Irish descent...)
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@Bones said in Ireland II:
Whoever the comments man was on sky sport was disgraceful. At one stage he was saying the all blacks were crossing the line by being aggressive, at every stoppage he was moaning about all blacks illegal tactics, like "being very quick". As said, Cane should have been red carded and the referees were cheating along with the all blacks, yet not even a word about Sexton. I'm sure he said something to imply Cane was injured as he was cheating too.
Ignoring the way that Cane was injured by falling back with a trapped leg after being clouted in the face with a forearm smash on the edge of a ruck......
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@Crucial said in Ireland II:
@Pot-Hale you seem to have had one of your best players on the bench too. That VanderFlier bloke was pretty good when he came on. Really got go forward at times and good skills too.
Yeah he is class. SOB reminds me of McCaw, while VDF reminds me of Jones. His running lines for Leinster this season have been a joy to behold.
I reckon the NZ backrow got fairly schooled across the 2 tests, which is a worry.
If I could ask Steve Hansen one question it would
What did you think of the NZ high tackles yesterday?
No actually, it would be "why haven't you picked Akira Ioane in your wider training squad?"
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@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
@Crucial said in Ireland II:
@Pot-Hale you seem to have had one of your best players on the bench too. That VanderFlier bloke was pretty good when he came on. Really got go forward at times and good skills too.
Yeah he is class. SOB reminds me of McCaw, while VDF reminds me of Jones. His running lines for Leinster this season have been a joy to behold.
I reckon the NZ backrow got fairly schooled across the 2 tests, which is a worry.
If I could ask Steve Hansen one question it would
What did you think of the NZ high tackles yesterday?
No actually, it would be "why haven't you picked Akira Ioane in your wider training squad?"
If Akira was playing I think Irish fans would have even more reason to whinge about supposed dirty play. That's actually partly why he isn't there.
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@Billy-Tell said in Ireland II:
What did you think of the NZ high tackles yesterday?
Is that a joke about how that Irish journo asked him that question 3 times in a row?
