Foster, Robertson etc
-
@Machpants said in Foster:
@taniwharugby said in Foster:
Well that's that then. Lock the thread.
So all Sam is saying is that Gats was right, anyone could coach the ABs!
Foster (pro era) and McDonald have proven that is a fallacy.
Ireland can't beat us for 100 years, then suddenly go to better than 50% and the coach (and systems behind them) don't matter? Pull the other one!
The Irish used to play us with total passion, 100% commitment, and lose. Now they are far more controlled, less passionate, and win.
Coaching is a major part of any modern team. If you include the wider picture -- selections, training in the off season, fitness, mental preparation etc -- I would suggest it is at least as important as the players.
-
@Chester-Draws said in Foster:
Coaching is a major part of any modern team. If you include the wider picture -- selections, training in the off season, fitness, mental preparation etc -- I would suggest it is at least as important as the players.
Just up to the end of Q3 in the springbok test. Their players look in better condition. Fit, strong and fast. Athletic and skilled - and generally thinking fast and clearly. We look sluggish by comparison.
I wonder if our prep has fallen behind the rest of the world. Training drills, conditioning, etc - all seemed inferior to Ireland and SA. Hopefully that's just a confidence thing, but damn we look a distant second right now.
-
@Chester-Draws said in Foster:
@Machpants said in Foster:
@taniwharugby said in Foster:
Well that's that then. Lock the thread.
So all Sam is saying is that Gats was right, anyone could coach the ABs!
Foster (pro era) and McDonald have proven that is a fallacy.
Ireland can't beat us for 100 years, then suddenly go to better than 50% and the coach (and systems behind them) don't matter? Pull the other one!
The Irish used to play us with total passion, 100% commitment, and lose. Now they are far more controlled, less passionate, and win.
Coaching is a major part of any modern team. If you include the wider picture -- selections, training in the off season, fitness, mental preparation etc -- I would suggest it is at least as important as the players.
You quoted the wrong person!
-
@Chester-Draws said in Foster:
Coaching is a major part of any modern team. If you include the wider picture -- selections, training in the off season, fitness, mental preparation etc -- I would suggest it is at least as important as the players.
Just up to the end of Q3 in the springbok test. Their players look in better condition. Fit, strong and fast. Athletic and skilled - and generally thinking fast and clearly. We look sluggish by comparison.
I wonder if our prep has fallen behind the rest of the world. Training drills, conditioning, etc - all seemed inferior to Ireland and SA. Hopefully that's just a confidence thing, but damn we look a distant second right now.
Maybe because we ran ourselves ragged in three first 3/4!
-
@Chester-Draws said in Foster:
Coaching is a major part of any modern team. If you include the wider picture -- selections, training in the off season, fitness, mental preparation etc -- I would suggest it is at least as important as the players.
Just up to the end of Q3 in the springbok test. Their players look in better condition. Fit, strong and fast. Athletic and skilled - and generally thinking fast and clearly. We look sluggish by comparison.
I wonder if our prep has fallen behind the rest of the world. Training drills, conditioning, etc - all seemed inferior to Ireland and SA. Hopefully that's just a confidence thing, but damn we look a distant second right now.
Maybe because we ran ourselves ragged in three first 3/4!
it's been consistent right the way through. I'm seriously impressed - after the WIll Jordan break of the Ardie inside ball, we got good quick ruck ball 30+metres downfield -- and their rush defence out wide was rushing and hassling CC. Remarkable effort.
We just seem so passive it's annoying; partially gameplan, but the fitness and skill of the Bokke was superb.
-
@nzzp fitness is something people have pointed at or asked questions of for the past couple of years I think.
Sure we dont have the firepower on the bench we used to, but our fitness was almost always far superior, now, it, along with our innovation and skills has fallen away.
-
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@ACT-Crusader said in Foster:
Pressure will be up tenfold in my view and whoever comes in, there will be the shortest of honeymoon periods
Yep, and as almost all the ills have been placed at Foster's doorstep by commentators near and far, people will expect nothing less than rapid improvement.
Nah.
You can stop digging....
-
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@ACT-Crusader said in Foster:
Pressure will be up tenfold in my view and whoever comes in, there will be the shortest of honeymoon periods
Yep, and as almost all the ills have been placed at Foster's doorstep by commentators near and far, people will expect nothing less than rapid improvement.
Nah.
You can stop digging....
Seriously? Because I'd be looking for some serious improvement with game-plan, Defence and player performance with a new Coach by the EOYT, otherwise what's the point?
-
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@ACT-Crusader said in Foster:
Pressure will be up tenfold in my view and whoever comes in, there will be the shortest of honeymoon periods
Yep, and as almost all the ills have been placed at Foster's doorstep by commentators near and far, people will expect nothing less than rapid improvement.
Nah.
You can stop digging....
Seriously? Because I'd be looking for some serious improvement with game-plan, Defence and player performance with a new Coach by the EOYT, otherwise what's the point?
Well in the space of 1-2 weeks Jason Ryan has rapidly improved the lineout and maul defence.
-
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@ACT-Crusader said in Foster:
Pressure will be up tenfold in my view and whoever comes in, there will be the shortest of honeymoon periods
Yep, and as almost all the ills have been placed at Foster's doorstep by commentators near and far, people will expect nothing less than rapid improvement.
Nah.
You can stop digging....
Seriously? Because I'd be looking for some serious improvement with game-plan, Defence and player performance with a new Coach by the EOYT, otherwise what's the point?
It's taken a couple of years to gradually totally fuck it, and you want it fixed overnight otherwise "what's the point?" Removing the bloke that fucked it doesn't mean someone else can fix it all immediately. All we want is to see some progress instead of more decline. A bit of cohesion, dealing with the high ball, kicking accurately, and not selecting old men over Samisoni. That'd do me for a few games, win or lose.
-
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@ACT-Crusader said in Foster:
Pressure will be up tenfold in my view and whoever comes in, there will be the shortest of honeymoon periods
Yep, and as almost all the ills have been placed at Foster's doorstep by commentators near and far, people will expect nothing less than rapid improvement.
Nah.
You can stop digging....
Seriously? Because I'd be looking for some serious improvement with game-plan, Defence and player performance with a new Coach by the EOYT, otherwise what's the point?
You said rapid, in your continuing crusade that ditching Foster just isn't enough and a new coach must be infinitely better with much stricter KPIs.
Dollars to donuts we'll get it (rapid improvement) anyway.
Yes, donuts. I said donuts.
Free lifetime supply if you step aside Fozzie...
-
@reprobate said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@ACT-Crusader said in Foster:
Pressure will be up tenfold in my view and whoever comes in, there will be the shortest of honeymoon periods
Yep, and as almost all the ills have been placed at Foster's doorstep by commentators near and far, people will expect nothing less than rapid improvement.
Nah.
You can stop digging....
Seriously? Because I'd be looking for some serious improvement with game-plan, Defence and player performance with a new Coach by the EOYT, otherwise what's the point?
It's taken a couple of years to gradually totally fuck it, and you want it fixed overnight otherwise "what's the point?" Removing the bloke that fucked it doesn't mean someone else can fix it all immediately.
Tell me where I said I wanted it fixed immediately or overnight. If you'd read what I actually wrote, you'd have seen : "looking for some serious improvement with game-plan, Defence and player performance with a new Coach by the EOYT".
All we want is to see some progress instead of more decline. A bit of cohesion, dealing with the high ball, kicking accurately, and not selecting old men over Samisoni. That'd do me for a few games, win or lose.
Is 8 Tests enough for you?
-
You said rapid, in your continuing crusade that ditching Foster just isn't enough and a new coach must be infinitely better with much stricter KPIs.
Nope. You missed the context. I said people would be expecting rapid progress. I've repeatedly said something like 9 Tests or to the end of 2022 to see significant progress.
And yes, I think people are living in cloud cuckoo land if they think simply replacing the Head Coach means all will be well and we'll be heading inexorably back to the top of the pile. If I were NZR, I'd set some measures and use those to review progress to ensure we don't get a repeat of the last 2-3 years.
And this GOM prefers Chocolate Limes over doughnuts
-
@KiwiMurph said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@ACT-Crusader said in Foster:
Pressure will be up tenfold in my view and whoever comes in, there will be the shortest of honeymoon periods
Yep, and as almost all the ills have been placed at Foster's doorstep by commentators near and far, people will expect nothing less than rapid improvement.
Nah.
You can stop digging....
Seriously? Because I'd be looking for some serious improvement with game-plan, Defence and player performance with a new Coach by the EOYT, otherwise what's the point?
Well in the space of 1-2 weeks Jason Ryan has rapidly improved the lineout and maul defence.
Thanks. Your post pretty much highlights my point that people think rapid progress is easily attained with a coaching change and will expect it.
Personally, I'd want a few more games with that sort of improvement rather than one Test as evidence though.
-
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
if they think simply replacing the Head Coach means all will be well and we'll be heading inexorably back to the top of the pile
No one thinks that. You're arguing against thin air.
-
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@KiwiMurph said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@ACT-Crusader said in Foster:
Pressure will be up tenfold in my view and whoever comes in, there will be the shortest of honeymoon periods
Yep, and as almost all the ills have been placed at Foster's doorstep by commentators near and far, people will expect nothing less than rapid improvement.
Nah.
You can stop digging....
Seriously? Because I'd be looking for some serious improvement with game-plan, Defence and player performance with a new Coach by the EOYT, otherwise what's the point?
Well in the space of 1-2 weeks Jason Ryan has rapidly improved the lineout and maul defence.
Thanks. Your post pretty much highlights my point that people think rapid progress is easily attained with a coaching change and will expect it.
Personally, I'd want a few more games with that sort of improvement rather than one Test as evidence though.
Depends what you are talking about. Something like a lineout you can see improvement pretty quickly with organisation and practice (and selecting the right hooker....)
I'm not saying that pace of improvement is realistic for all aspects of play.
However it does show the impact coaching can have.
-
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
if they think simply replacing the Head Coach means all will be well and we'll be heading inexorably back to the top of the pile
No one thinks that. You're arguing against thin air.
It is a loop tape!
-
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
if they think simply replacing the Head Coach means all will be well and we'll be heading inexorably back to the top of the pile
No one thinks that. You're arguing against thin air.
As I said, they'd be living in cloud cuckoo land.
But a nice deflection from your saying I wanted rapid improvement when I said I thought we should expect some serious improvement by the end of 2022.
-
@KiwiMurph said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew said in Foster:
@ACT-Crusader said in Foster:
Pressure will be up tenfold in my view and whoever comes in, there will be the shortest of honeymoon periods
Yep, and as almost all the ills have been placed at Foster's doorstep by commentators near and far, people will expect nothing less than rapid improvement.
Nah.
You can stop digging....
Seriously? Because I'd be looking for some serious improvement with game-plan, Defence and player performance with a new Coach by the EOYT, otherwise what's the point?
Well in the space of 1-2 weeks Jason Ryan has rapidly improved the lineout and maul defence.
Actually thought our lineout maul D was shit.
Bokke made mileage without even trying.
