All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test
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@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Bones seriously?
It wouldnt be the ref deciding it, if the RULES state if a prop has to come on for a scrum in that situation, the team must take off a forward.
As I said, as it appears it happens that way, I assumed that was a RULE not something made up by a ref, clearly I was wrong, it wasnt a RULE and teams have chosen to remove a forward, as there is no RULE specifying a forward or back go off.
Fuck me. Point me to the rule stating who is a forward. You dedicate front row replacements, that's it Nothing else You can bold the word rule as much as you like, but that doesn't mean the ref gets to decide if Ardie plays 12 or 8. Are you just being deliberately obtuse? Because that's my domain.
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@reprobate said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Sam Cane was pretty good, lots of tackling - he is just a harder-tackling Reuben Thorne though.
You had me until this. I can't let this slide. That was Rueben Thorne's forte! He was an immense tackler and extremely strong! One of the best defenders in NZ rugby history! I can't recall him ever missing one. His defence got him to where he got.
Carry on. -
@No-Quarter said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Geez reprobate, calm down mate, lol. Can I make a suggestion, if comments or anything fill you with rage, perhaps you shouldn't follow the GAME. I would honestly not follow any sport that upset ne as it a pastime, I followed the game as a one eyed AB supporter etc for 60 odd years, but if it ever got me into a rage, I wouldb't bother!
FFS we lost a test, thought we played poorly and had our arses handed to us on a plate by a very good team, but notthing any sane person should get into a rage over! It's almsot like the shit that happened with death threats to John Hart etc after we knocked out of WC, we got some peole who really need help!
I would say the same to supporter of any team. Boks lost tp Wales for first time in SA on weekemd. Italy got beaten by Georgia, I would hope there supporters aren't getting into a rage tc. or it;s time to shut sport down. It
I'm not really sure why you follow the ABs? You don't care if we win or lose, and your default response to any poster doing analysis on the players and coaches is that they are just some random on the internet that doesn't know what they are talking about because they are not in the inner circles of the ABs. Which is just complete bullshit on so many levels, I just can't stand the "well the AB coaches know more than us so just accept their decision" posts on here, they add absolutely nothing to the discussion.
In what part of my response do you see me say I don't care if we win or lose, all I say is don't get upset, it's sport. And I will almost always say that people inside the organisation will know more than me, but thats a fact.
I really not arrogant enough to think I could even coach a test team, hell I found coaching schoolboy and senior club rugby hard enough, so pretty hard to yell to loud about how much better I am than any high level coached whether it provincial, super or test level. -
@Quo-vadis said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@reprobate said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Sam Cane was pretty good, lots of tackling - he is just a harder-tackling Reuben Thorne though.
You had me until this. I can't let this slide. That was Rueben Thorne's forte! He was an immense tackler and extremely strong! One of the best defenders in NZ rugby history! I can't recall him ever missing one. His defence got him to where he got.
Carry on.Papalii isn't as fast as Cane though eh?
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@Dan54 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@No-Quarter said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Geez reprobate, calm down mate, lol. Can I make a suggestion, if comments or anything fill you with rage, perhaps you shouldn't follow the GAME. I would honestly not follow any sport that upset ne as it a pastime, I followed the game as a one eyed AB supporter etc for 60 odd years, but if it ever got me into a rage, I wouldb't bother!
FFS we lost a test, thought we played poorly and had our arses handed to us on a plate by a very good team, but notthing any sane person should get into a rage over! It's almsot like the shit that happened with death threats to John Hart etc after we knocked out of WC, we got some peole who really need help!
I would say the same to supporter of any team. Boks lost tp Wales for first time in SA on weekemd. Italy got beaten by Georgia, I would hope there supporters aren't getting into a rage tc. or it;s time to shut sport down. It
I'm not really sure why you follow the ABs? You don't care if we win or lose, and your default response to any poster doing analysis on the players and coaches is that they are just some random on the internet that doesn't know what they are talking about because they are not in the inner circles of the ABs. Which is just complete bullshit on so many levels, I just can't stand the "well the AB coaches know more than us so just accept their decision" posts on here, they add absolutely nothing to the discussion.
In what part of my response do you see me say I don't care if we win or lose, all I say is don't get upset, it's sport. And I will almost always say that people inside the organisation will know more than me, but thats a fact.
I really not arrogant enough to think I could even coach a test team, hell I found coaching schoolboy and senior club rugby hard enough, so pretty hard to yell to loud about how much better I am than any high level coached whether it provincial, super or test level.Quitter
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@Bones said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Fuck me. Point me to the rule stating who is a forward. You dedicate front row replacements, that's it Nothing else You can bold the word rule as much as you like, but that doesn't mean the ref gets to decide if Ardie plays 12 or 8. Are you just being deliberately obtuse? Because that's my domain.
did you miss this bit, and the prior points where I said the same thing?
I assumed that was a RULE/LAW not something made up by a ref, clearly I was wrong
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@Bones said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@No-Quarter said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Geez reprobate, calm down mate, lol. Can I make a suggestion, if comments or anything fill you with rage, perhaps you shouldn't follow the GAME. I would honestly not follow any sport that upset ne as it a pastime, I followed the game as a one eyed AB supporter etc for 60 odd years, but if it ever got me into a rage, I wouldb't bother!
FFS we lost a test, thought we played poorly and had our arses handed to us on a plate by a very good team, but notthing any sane person should get into a rage over! It's almsot like the shit that happened with death threats to John Hart etc after we knocked out of WC, we got some peole who really need help!
I would say the same to supporter of any team. Boks lost tp Wales for first time in SA on weekemd. Italy got beaten by Georgia, I would hope there supporters aren't getting into a rage tc. or it;s time to shut sport down. It
I'm not really sure why you follow the ABs? You don't care if we win or lose, and your default response to any poster doing analysis on the players and coaches is that they are just some random on the internet that doesn't know what they are talking about because they are not in the inner circles of the ABs. Which is just complete bullshit on so many levels, I just can't stand the "well the AB coaches know more than us so just accept their decision" posts on here, they add absolutely nothing to the discussion.
In what part of my response do you see me say I don't care if we win or lose, all I say is don't get upset, it's sport. And I will almost always say that people inside the organisation will know more than me, but thats a fact.
I really not arrogant enough to think I could even coach a test team, hell I found coaching schoolboy and senior club rugby hard enough, so pretty hard to yell to loud about how much better I am than any high level coached whether it provincial, super or test level.Quitter
Yep, i am mate, don't see the point of beating my head against brick wall!!
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@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Bones said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Fuck me. Point me to the rule stating who is a forward. You dedicate front row replacements, that's it Nothing else You can bold the word rule as much as you like, but that doesn't mean the ref gets to decide if Ardie plays 12 or 8. Are you just being deliberately obtuse? Because that's my domain.
did you miss this bit, and the prior points where I said the same thing?
I assumed that was a RULE/LAW not something made up by a ref, clearly I was wrong
That's what I'm saying, what's the basis for it potentially being a rule/law? A halfback/flanker of all people should know that's off the charts weird.
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well....fuck that was one of the worst days of rugby i can remember
club game had my coach storm off and leave half way through the first half and then the pleasure of watch that
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@Dan54 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
I really not arrogant enough to think I could even coach a test team, hell I found coaching schoolboy and senior club rugby hard enough, so pretty hard to yell to loud about how much better I am than any high level coached whether it provincial, super or test level.
Criticising a coaching staff does not = saying that you could coach better than them.
Same as criticising a player does equate to saying you could play better than them.
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@Bones said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Frank said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
I'd like to hear from Foster's most ardent defenders (Crucial you're so quiet mate) as to why he should stay on or what the Fern is missing?
Foster doesn't have defenders. There's just people that don't bitch and moan about the same old shit time and again and actually try and come up with something coherent.
Foster does have defenders. The NZRU for one. The media aren't laying into him half as much as they should be. It is still "The All Blacks need to do this ..." and "the All Blacks need to do that ..." rather than pointing the finger solidly at him.
I try to keep my rants about him to less than one a month, but how is the position that he is the real problem, and should go, not "coherent"?
I said it about him when he was Chiefs coach. I said it about Blackadder after a couple of years with the Crusaders too. At a certain point it becomes clear that a good team is being held back. After that point no amount of analysis helps.
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@Chester-Draws said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Bones said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Frank said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
I'd like to hear from Foster's most ardent defenders (Crucial you're so quiet mate) as to why he should stay on or what the Fern is missing?
Foster doesn't have defenders. There's just people that don't bitch and moan about the same old shit time and again and actually try and come up with something coherent.
Foster does have defenders. The NZRU for one. The media aren't laying into him half as much as they should be. It is still "The All Blacks need to do this ..." and "the All Blacks need to do that ..." rather than pointing the finger solidly at him.
I try to keep my rants about him to less than one a month, but how is the position that he is the real problem, and should go, not "coherent"?
I said it about him when he was Chiefs coach. I said it about Blackadder after a couple of years with the Crusaders too. At a certain point it becomes clear that a good team is being held back. After that point no amount of analysis helps.
It was pretty jarring going from that game to the Aus v Eng game. You could clearly see what both sides were trying to do, both looked like better coached sides than us.
Doesn't mean I think Eng or Oz are better than us, just that the players all seemed in sync and looked organised. We seemed to be all over the place and relying on individual brilliance.
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@Dan54 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
I really not arrogant enough to think I could even coach a test team, hell I found coaching schoolboy and senior club rugby hard enough, so pretty hard to yell to loud about how much better I am than any high level coached whether it provincial, super or test level.
Fair enough. I know that I am a pretty shit coach too.
But I recognised was out of my depth, so I let better people do it. (And I never blamed the players for my weaknesses.)
I don't expect Foster to be a great coach. I do expect him to recognise that he isn't.
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
I really not arrogant enough to think I could even coach a test team, hell I found coaching schoolboy and senior club rugby hard enough, so pretty hard to yell to loud about how much better I am than any high level coached whether it provincial, super or test level.
Criticising a coaching staff does not = saying that you could coach better than them.
Same as criticising a player does equate to saying you could play better than them.
If it did the fern wouldn’t exist. I don’t think too many of us are former ABs.
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it was very clear from last week, and this week, that the plan is to play nothing in our half. if we start a set of phases in our own territory, kick it.
But it was like we stopped the planning after that. The how seemed to get forgotten about, so the kicks looked haphazard, and the chase like they didn't know where it was going.
Last week it sorta worked, but Ireland fielded them better this week, and then returned the kicks better, so we started losing ground (throw in a lineout fucked at selection time).
Then, when it was apparent this tactic wasn't working, and the scoreboard became an issue, we started trying to play a bit. But that's when it got ugly. It looked honestly like the players had nothing to fall back on. We just didn't seem to know how we were going to play. Seriously disjointed, off-the-cuff play right from the beginning of every set of phases. It was not pretty.
Again though, huge credit to the irish who took on board what they did well the week before, but also addressed what they did poorly. That was a significant turn around in performance, and points to a squad unified in their vision.
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@MN5 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
I really not arrogant enough to think I could even coach a test team, hell I found coaching schoolboy and senior club rugby hard enough, so pretty hard to yell to loud about how much better I am than any high level coached whether it provincial, super or test level.
Criticising a coaching staff does not = saying that you could coach better than them.
Same as criticising a player does equate to saying you could play better than them.
If it did the fern wouldn’t exist. I don’t think too many of us are former ABs.
i am 100% a better rugby player than all of the current AB's...more than happy to say it....proving it is where i have an issue
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@Chester-Draws said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Dan54 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
I really not arrogant enough to think I could even coach a test team, hell I found coaching schoolboy and senior club rugby hard enough, so pretty hard to yell to loud about how much better I am than any high level coached whether it provincial, super or test level.
Fair enough. I know that I am a pretty shit coach too.
But I recognised was out of my depth, so I let better people do it. (And I never blamed the players for my weaknesses.)
I don't expect Foster to be a great coach. I do expect him to recognise that he isn't.
A simple analogy would be you don't have to be a chef to know a meal tastes bad.
It's a weak argument to make that we wouldn't do any better, the bar needs to be slightly higher than that!
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Re the early tackle and whether it should have been a yellow and a penalty try - the fact that the ball wasn't actually passed to the Irishman who was tackled, does that play a part in the decision making? In the circumstances on the weekend I think it should. On my one viewing it didn't even look like the ball carrier was about to pass to the supporting player.
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@Crazy-Horse isnt the rule supposed to be made whereby you are essentially removing the offending player from the equation, and then determine if a try probably would have been scored.
I personally think YC & PT (would also have avoided the RC, sliding doors and all)
