All Blacks vs Springboks II
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@stodders said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@bones lesson learned after 2007 was to take the ref out of the equation. ABs did enough to win today, especially from 25-20 down. Boks also did enough, especially from 20-11 down.
Tight game, small margins. ABs wind the clock down and I'm sure it would South African fans bemoaning the calls not going their way.
I would hate to think what the scores would've been if jordie hasn't been available these two matches, we'd have lost both by a big margin
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@gt12 said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@tim said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
Worst ref I've seen in ages.
I think its really hard to be good in a game like this.
I often wonder if non-neutral refs would be better for SA-NZ games. They'd be less phased by the occasion and would be under so much scrutiny and weight of tradition to be impartial that we'd get better reffing.
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Just watched the 2nd half again. Richie made a blunder in the 73rd minute unfortunately, had an overlap with Sevu, Rieko and ALB outside of him on the South African 22, and there was a good chance that a try would have been scored as there was so much of space but he chose to take it up himself. Wasn't catastrophic as we got a penalty from the next ruck but a 7 pointer then would have meant that the Boks would have had to score a try to win it.
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@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@machpants said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
Foster's team with no ability too deal with this shit.
Been there long before Foster took over. Thought there were signs of improvement but the last 2 games have exposed that thought
Thus late Hansen/foster, as I said. Hansen should have retired post lions as originally planned, foster would have had his go at RWC 19, this would now be second year of a decent, innovative set up. But this cycle is a wash out
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Cant get away from the fact the Bok forwards were just better They deserved to win Regrettably some of our forwards dont have a McCaw motor
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@berniescorner said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
Cant get away from the fact the Bok forwards were just better They deserved to win Regrettably some of our forwards dont have a McCaw motor
I think the selections of Bower and Aumua were a mistake. Karl T is easily our second best scrumaging loosehad and Samisoni Taukei'aho is our form hooker atm, and is a better lineout thrower than Aumua.
We had to know that our weaker props were going to come up against their strongest front row in the 2nd half and the gap in class was evident between the two front rows during that period. Should have selected the best players available, last night was not a time for experimentation and we have paid the price for it.
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@billy-tell said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
I don't like having a go at the match officials, and fair play to Carling for having the guts to whistle penalties at the end, but there bad calls both ways. The worst for mine though was Mpimpi being a good few metres offside on the kick chase, not spotted by anyone.
I was yelling at the TV then. It wasn't even close and the AR was right there.
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@pakman said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
Rewatch 36 to 66.
ABs lineout better than Boks's in period!!!! Only miss Aumua throwing directly to Kitshoff and not to Patty T. BBBR jumping forced Bok miss at 36. Akira pressure another at 48. Akira took several in meantime (and beautiful one for Savea try).
Scrum slightly moving forward except first of H2, following Jordie (non-) forward pass. Bok TH twisted, which ref ruled Moody infringement. Wrong side for camera. Props looked bemused.
Ref's inconsisitency on tackle release directly caused the result. Not just BB at 38 (Faf never released), but also at 54:30 followng a period of AB pressure, when Etzebeth held on to Jordie and Marx given penalty. Huge swing.
Even worse, in next minute Kitshoff was about to be turned over 5m out from AB line and ABs penalised for... 'no clear release'!!! Led to penalty dead in front and 3.
At 50 Steyn 50/22 MASSIVE. Good LO/maul/momentum. Poor short side defence and Boks over. Also huge Steyn kick gain at 58.
Perhaps most damning, though, from 46 to 48 ABs hot on attack. Several recyclings but pattern of ball to BB and then Havili not aligned for backline move. BBBR couple of time gets pass with nowhere to go.
BUT NO OTHER TIGHTIES TO BE SEEN. FFS LJ and BB trying to bind and defend counter ruck???
Also at 66 RM gets ball but Bok fish hook cuts him off from rest of backline. Shepherded into pod of e.g. Marx/Kwagga/a lock.
Our backline alignment/interplay with forwards was non-existent?! And Boks had done homework.
Forwards always in wrong place and unavailable for cleanout. Was there no plan?
TBC...
That no clear release made me lose my shit. He'd suddenly discovered that law after just ignoring it minutes before.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@pakman said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
Rewatch 36 to 66.
ABs lineout better than Boks's in period!!!! Only miss Aumua throwing directly to Kitshoff and not to Patty T. BBBR jumping forced Bok miss at 36. Akira pressure another at 48. Akira took several in meantime (and beautiful one for Savea try).
Scrum slightly moving forward except first of H2, following Jordie (non-) forward pass. Bok TH twisted, which ref ruled Moody infringement. Wrong side for camera. Props looked bemused.
Ref's inconsisitency on tackle release directly caused the result. Not just BB at 38 (Faf never released), but also at 54:30 followng a period of AB pressure, when Etzebeth held on to Jordie and Marx given penalty. Huge swing.
Even worse, in next minute Kitshoff was about to be turned over 5m out from AB line and ABs penalised for... 'no clear release'!!! Led to penalty dead in front and 3.
At 50 Steyn 50/22 MASSIVE. Good LO/maul/momentum. Poor short side defence and Boks over. Also huge Steyn kick gain at 58.
Perhaps most damning, though, from 46 to 48 ABs hot on attack. Several recyclings but pattern of ball to BB and then Havili not aligned for backline move. BBBR couple of time gets pass with nowhere to go.
BUT NO OTHER TIGHTIES TO BE SEEN. FFS LJ and BB trying to bind and defend counter ruck???
Also at 66 RM gets ball but Bok fish hook cuts him off from rest of backline. Shepherded into pod of e.g. Marx/Kwagga/a lock.
Our backline alignment/interplay with forwards was non-existent?! And Boks had done homework.
Forwards always in wrong place and unavailable for cleanout. Was there no plan?
TBC...
That no clear release made me lose my shit. He'd suddenly discovered that law after just ignoring it minutes before.
Me, too!
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@billy-tell said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
As an aside that SA medic is lovely. If I were a bok I’d be sure to have a permanent groin niggle that needed attending to
beforeduring the big match.What is this before you speak of?
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@berniescorner said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
Cant get away from the fact the Bok forwards were just better They deserved to win Regrettably some of our forwards dont have a McCaw motor
I know he got around a lot but there was only ever one McCaw in the All Blacks. In twenty years time or so hopefully it is a different story (somebody hide Gemma's hockey sticks)..
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I must have watched the final stages about 20 times by now and noticed this: Following the SA kick off, once the scrum is awarded, Richie clearly instructs Asafo to take an injury break so they can have a strategy meeting. Rieko’s body language gives it away as does Asafo when he looks at Brodie as he does it. The medic comes on initially and chats to Asafo but this is obviously just part of the drill. A few seconds later the second medic comes on and pretends to be looking in his bag. At this point medic #1 walks over to the strategy meeting at which point Ardie is offering instructions so he just hangs on the outside and then after a few camera cuts and second passed is then seen talking with Brodie.
So the ABs just the same as the Boks doing it in the first half soooo obviously after a line break when the crowd weren’t having it.
And on those 2 carries after the scrum - now I maybe miles off here, so please fill me in - why attempt to win the contact? Why not just go sideways or backwards?
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@rancid-schnitzel said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
That no clear release made me lose my shit.
You have a point, and a right to feel aggrieved, but that line above just looks darn funny to me.
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End of the day , the loss is probably a reality check of where we are at ,
A narrow win may have papered over the cracks
Still plenty to work on
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Another thing that I don't think has been mentioned yet is how easy it is for teams to pin us in our own half following kick off. This has been a problem for a few years now. Last night the Boks were superb at it. Kick long and high to give the chasers time to get in a defensive position. Then stop the ensuing maul, smash our one off hit up and pressure the subsequent kick. We end up defending a lineout between our 22 and 10 metre line if we are lucky.
We miss a long punting game, especially at 10.
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@crazy-horse True, and it's because we are sticking to the conventional method of having the 10 kick it out. BB doesn't have the biggest punt and neither does Richie. Why not utilise Havili's boot or Jordie's?
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@akan004 said in All Blacks vs Springboks II:
@crazy-horse True, and it's because we are sticking to the conventional method of having the 10 kick it out. BB doesn't have the biggest punt and neither does Richie. Why not utilise Havili's boot or Jordie's?
Jordie has had problems with having his kicked charged hasn't he? Agree, he does have a bigger kick though.
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