All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3
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@chimoaus said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
Apologies if this has been raised already but why did we not setup for a drop goal at the death?
Because TJP was seagulling and watching the scrum instead of the ball. Failed to do his basic job. He's been so good for the Canes and against Samoa, but fark me he's been headless when he comes on for the ABs.
Aaron's still number one, and by some margin
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@No-Quarter said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
@chimoaus said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
Apologies if this has been raised already but why did we not setup for a drop goal at the death. We had 3? capable kickers that could do it. We were right in front not far out. I'm assuming most top teams would have gone for this instead of spreading it wide? Didn't we get into the goat a few moons ago about ignoring drop goals?
It hasn't really been discussed and is a fair point, especially when Jordie seems to be able to whack them over from anywhere.
Hindsight I guess...
Did you see what he did when the first half ended? He was pushed into touch near the halfway, then turned around and kicked the ball right through the posts. He has some freakish skills.
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Poite's wasn't the biggest individual error of the night.
Savea dropping a sitter, and Barrett missing from in front were the biggest game defining errors of the night. Somewhere in behind those 2 clangers and Poite would be Smith's supersonic pop pass from the tighthead.
I have real doubts about Savea's big game temperament, almost a carbon copy of him fluffing the 2015 SR final.
Barrett I have doubts about his goal kicking, well duh ...... but I don't doubt his game temperament, although the ultra flat backline is high risk high reward but he has plenty of other parts to his game.
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@nzzp what this series showed is that Aaron Smith is back and TJ is still some ways off.
I think Smith needed to stay on in test 2 & 3, he did stay longer in #3, but as Woodward pointed out in #2, this was a turning point in that game when Smith went and TJ came on.
Sometimes you do wonder about subs whether they are done tactically or just cos...it certainly felt like TJ and Scott Barrett subs on Saturday were done just cos.
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I can't back this up but I think that when Smith was at his best before he had that small crash in form, he would indicate when he was ready to be subbed in that he would use everything in the tank.
It really raised my eyebrows when I read the article when ever it was.
I'm not sure that holds true at the moment though as Smith did seem a bit miffed over being subbed
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@Wairau said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
@MiketheSnow
Sorry, I disagree, Read didn't make the Lions player fall, it was his other team mate unbalancing him, and a hollywood where he lifted his legs and flopped on the ground.It was an appalling decision. Poite clearly lied twice. He said we have a deal, meaning the umpires have an agreement. However, that is not what he said to the video ref (I did not hear him talk to Garces). Then, he said to both captains that 16 red didn't play at the ball, it just touched him on the shoulder accidentally, so they play the knock on.
We also lost 15 seconds of gametime before they stopped the clock.
The other thing is he did not give any advantage, and ALB was away.
Sorry, but one or two lies and inability to apply advantage, or stop the clock quickly. An incompetent performance.
When have I said that the final decision was incorrect?
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It is funny, Beaudie seems to have a great temperament when the pressure is on but he just is not a consistent goal kicker. Fluffs them at the beginning as much as at the end. Ultimately we have to have a goal kicking full-back or Beaudie goes to 15 and we have a goal-kicking 10. I really hate having to move Ben Smith to the wing but you feel like we might be heading there.
Savea had some really good moments but for me his drop and his dreadful support line of Laumape was criminal.
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Metres per game
All Blacks - 409
Lions - 330
All Blacks leader - Rieko Ioane 45.3
Lions leader - Jonathan Davies 57http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11888331
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@DMX said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
It is funny, Beaudie seems to have a great temperament when the pressure is on but he just is not a consistent goal kicker. Fluffs them at the beginning as much as at the end. Ultimately we have to have a goal kicking full-back or Beaudie goes to 15 and we have a goal-kicking 10. I really hate having to move Ben Smith to the wing but you feel like we might be heading there.
Savea had some really good moments but for me his drop and his dreadful support line of Laumape was criminal.
It needs its own thread, I'll start one .......
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If Savea had hands on Saturday, I reckon we win that at a canter, he looked really up for it, except for his ability to catch.
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That's interesting as it provides a bit of support for the argument I've been having with my welsh coworker.
We've been talking about who we would choose as the man of the series, and I think it has to be Davies. My colleague is picking Farrell, which is also understandable.
I was choosing Davies based on his work on D - making the rush work is fucking hard for a 13 and he was excellent - only getting undone once that I can remember by a fantastic offload.
His attack stats in that article also show how well he did making our midfield have a hard time too. Just brilliant.
He's the first player I'd have brought across to the ABs too I reckon (not the only one either).
Slightly off topic (maybe we can split), but who would others choose?
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@gt12 Sam Cane. Met and beat the Lions pack physically, especially in the game when our pack was down a man for 3/4. Huge battle with not only O'Brien, but a couple of flankers at a time, and i reckon shaded it. Huge series.
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Davies easily LIons man of the series, Cane for us.
I was disappointed with Itoje after hearing he was the next big thing, didn't think he was that good, very busy but not that effective (although as I have been banging on about) was often a lazy runner, often standing off side, while not directly affecting play, was just a nuisance, maybe that is good, not sure but I expected a lot more.
For us, biggest disappointment was probably Beaudy, not that he was poor, but because he wasn't able to create any of the magic he usually does, which was in part due to the good work by the Lions.
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@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
Davies easily LIons man of the series, Cane for us.
I was disappointed with Itoje after hearing he was the next big thing, didn't think he was that good, very busy but not that effective (although as I have been banging on about) was often a lazy runner, often standing off side, while not directly affecting play, was just a nuisance, maybe that is good, not sure but I expected a lot more.
For us, biggest disappointment was probably Beaudy, not that he was poor, but because he wasn't able to create any of the magic he usually does, which was in part due to the good work by the Lions.
Davies was really good. They were re-organised so quickly out wide, which must be down to his chat. He was fast and aggressive on defense, cutting off our wide channels; and then on turnover ball got himself in positions to be a very useful outlet. A really great series.
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
@gt12 Sam Cane. Met and beat the Lions pack physically, especially in the game when our pack was down a man for 3/4. Huge battle with not only O'Brien, but a couple of flankers at a time, and i reckon shaded it. Huge series.
Yup in the forwards Cane was huge. In the backs I'd give it to Aaron Smith, he was excellent in all three matches and subbing him off in tests 2 & 3 really hurt us - black mark against Hansen there.
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@Hooroo said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
So the general feeling about the town is that while it is a pity we didn't win, it was a hell of a series and a really good result for Rugby.
I don't disagree either.
The Lions fans have to be the best travelling fans of any sport?
I'm not too miffed about all that happened. If it was against England or Aussie or South Africa then I would be more gutted.
I'm going to go a little against the grain here of the Fern wisdom - just a personal opinion so pitchforks can stay holstered. As someone who isn't over there soaking up the atmosphere, after the heady early days of the tour I've actually found this tour has broken my spirit for rugby a bit. I'm sure if I was there intermingling with the travelling fans and not just following online on forums and through the media my thoughts might be different.
Firstly the officiating, I know some people think we should rise above the officiating but that's a bullshit cop out, it should be held to account like everything else that happens out on the field - if we can moan about TJs flapping, Cruden existing, SBW being SBW, Fatty being unfairly/fairly picked on, etc etc then we can discuss the ref as well. As I've mentioned earlier in the thread I think the 'spirit' of the reffing switched between the 2nd and 3rd test (and even times within the 3rd test) and it negatively affected the ABs both times. The final test draw was worse than the 2nd test loss for me to take personally because of the bullshit at the end.
The tour also served up a bunch of negative rugby that was at times penalised and other times wasn't. The offside line was at various times policed and not policed. The ABs tries in the first test and the Lions counter attacks in the second should have been the takeaways from the tour but it was the negative play that overshadowed everything else. Both teams dished out a wee bit of dirty and or reckless play (IMHO and with my biases one team got penalised a bit more for it) that probably didn't need to happen. Oh and fuck Connor Murray and his ball rolling and fuck the refs for letting him do it (Smith also did it on occasion as well in the 3rd test).
The Lions management chipping in the media was annoying. As noted above the Lions played right on and over the borderline of the laws throughout the test series yet they spent a bunch of time moaning about the ABs tactics to the media and refs. It's like they don't own a mirror. The moaning about blockers was particularly annoying as they were consistently guilty of the same tactics. Speaking of blocking, in the 2nd test BBBR was penalised, a penalty that gained the Lions 3 points, for an act that happened throughout the 3 test series on both sides.
The media just did my head in on this tour - and that's really only through posters linking to it on here. How come all rugby media is just trolling? From both sides.
Should we have won the series? Yes. Would it have made my thoughts any different? Probably, I guess we'll never know, a few less dropped balls, a couple less injuries, a couple of not dropped on their head French babies and I might be singing a different tune.
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@Pot-Hale said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
@canefan said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
@Pot-Hale So that's still a penalty right?
No, I don't think so. I'm surmising here. If Poite is saying to Read that the ball hit Owens first on the shoulder then that is accidental offside. Handling it is secondary.
The ball doesn't hit Owens in the shoulder. He catches it, in an offside position.
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Anyone notice when they showed Farrell's career kicking stats during the 3rd test. His career average was in the low 70% although he was trucking well for the series. Interesting given the commentary on BB.
