Red Cards
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@Crazy-Horse said in Red Cards:
@taniwharugby said in Red Cards:
@Kirwan it was 6...but got reduced to 4 cos.
Not much of a disincentive is it. For that sort of clear thuggery, no reductions should be made. He had so much time to pull out of that.
Was genuinely upsetting to watch Hodgman writhing on the ground after that.
Not disagreeing with you about Barrett pulling out, but on a side note I wish they would also replay these things in 'real time' so we can get a better feel as to how much time players actually have.
Less than people think I suspect.
You'd have to be psychopathically stupid to be intentionally planting a shoulder into people's heads these days with camera replays all over the show.
Most of them I think people start to do something, somehow get their timing compromised and end up looking like they're thugs - especially in slow mo.
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@taniwharugby said in Red Cards:
@Nepia the key for me, is that we have an even contest of 15 v 15 for as much of a match as possible, I dont want to see 15 v 13/14...even if it works in my teams favour.
Do rugby players get fined for cards, they do in NRL dont they?
Obviously in a comp like the NPC where some players earn $10k for thier season, so it needs to be relative.
So maybe have a 10 or 20 minute sin bin but you can come back on however you will also be assessed by tribunal with possible suspension. Stick with outright off for the rest of the game and tribunal visit for outright bad behaviour ( stomping, eye contact, fighting etc)
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YC for careless or cynical play: Sin bin and on report (fine/ban)
OC for reckless or dangerous play: Sinbin and you can't return, and on report (fine/ban)
RC for intentional filth: Off with no replacement (fine/ban)
Report system for anything missed with bans lengthened by one match
Penalties also lengthened across the board and fines used.Edit: Another idea would be, if people don't like an orange card, to have people not be able to return from the Sinbin. So, pretty much everything is either a penalty or YC, and after 10 minutes the team has the choice to replace players until they are out of replacements. Red cards are only for intentional filth.
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Most of them I think people start to do something, somehow get their timing compromised and end up looking like they're thugs - especially in slow mo.
Or, they try to impose themselves with a hard, high hit and fuck it up, meaning they should have compromised the hard and not gone high...
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Most of them I think people start to do something, somehow get their timing compromised and end up looking like they're thugs - especially in slow mo.
Or, they try to impose themselves with a hard, high hit and fuck it up, meaning they should have compromised the hard and not gone high...
...and then they read the fern and they see people nit picking between tackles and dominant tackles
in principle i agree though, i think the only way is to slow things, soften some impacts, accept more given and take, i'd like to see less subs tried and maybe
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@Kiwiwomble said in Red Cards:
Most of them I think people start to do something, somehow get their timing compromised and end up looking like they're thugs - especially in slow mo.
Or, they try to impose themselves with a hard, high hit and fuck it up, meaning they should have compromised the hard and not gone high...
...and then they read the fern and they see people nit picking between tackles and dominant tackles
Discuss
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@gt12 love it
Starts getting gnarly with definitions though. Interested in your opinions on:
Was the Sam Cane hit on that Irish bloke a red? What about Naholo going high on their winger?
Ofa red card against Australia?
I don’t think any of them were dirty, a don’t return sinbin for all of them, with bans for all as well (as required) would make the system conceptually consistent.
My prerence is something which - even if the refs aren’t consistent - will be similarly consistent and doesn’t require advanced degrees in physics.
If a player is getting sat out of games often enough, soon their value will drop dramatically.
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@gt12 cool, bit would you see that the same way if you were Irish?
Basically you're saying proper filth gets the red, and it'll be 1 or 2 a season
Yep.
Anything that could potentially see another play unable to keep going would also result in you not continuing.
We’d still get (mostly) a 15 vs 15 game though.
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@gt12 I'm still not a fan of reducing a team to 14 (or less) for the balance of the game.
Filth, you are gone but still replaced, why is the rest of your team punished cos you a dirty fluffybunny? Why are fans punished cos you a dirty fluffybunny?
The accidental ones are tougher, Barrett for example, huge bone head thuggish move, but no way did he go out to hurt/injure someone, but he has, so he needs to go too and not return, I'd be keen on an orange card being 10 mins, but automatic 2 week ban to go with your judiciary visit, more time off and a fine.
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I'm convinced that rugby needs a cultural change so that cards for head contact are replaced with a citation system and longer suspensions.
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@antipodean said in Red Cards:
I'm convinced that rugby needs a cultural change so that cards for head contact are replaced with a citation system and longer suspensions.
I tend to agree. Think there needs to be a distinction between deliberate dangerous play, like kneeing someone in the neck, and what is essentially poor tacking technique.
If on-field sanction is needed, perhaps a YC and citation/suspension system where things can be looked at away from the baying crowd?
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I'm not sure the real issue is being addressed.
If it was being addressed properly, then the numbers should be going down. They aren't. They are sky rocketing.
First step in resolving a problem, is really understanding what the problem is. I'm not sure that's being done here.
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@MajorRage said in Red Cards:
I'm not sure the real issue is being addressed.
If it was being addressed properly, then the numbers should be going down. They aren't. They are sky rocketing.
First step in resolving a problem, is really understanding what the problem is. I'm not sure that's being done here.
You could look at it another way in that it's well and truly recognised now by officials, but not being addressed by coaches and players, hence the sky rockets in flight.
No afternoon delight.
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@MajorRage said in Red Cards:
I'm not sure the real issue is being addressed.
If it was being addressed properly, then the numbers should be going down. They aren't. They are sky rocketing.
First step in resolving a problem, is really understanding what the problem is. I'm not sure that's being done here.
You could look at it another way in that it's well and truly recognised now by officials, but not being addressed by coaches and players, hence the sky rockets in flight.
No afternoon delight.
Yeah, very true. However perhaps a certain number of head knocks are just part of how the game is played & there really is nothing you can do about them other than punish those that find themselves being the perpetrator.
People aren't perfect and never have been. Modern game you need to tackle around the chest to stop plays. As long as this remains the key way to clear people out / collide, then head knocks are always going to happen. If everybody did everything perfectly runners would never get injured, tennis players would never do an unforced error, cricketers would never drop catches.
It's just not reality.
