All Blacks 2022
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@No-Quarter said in All Blacks 2022:
Rieko is now a world class centre and Jordie is finally getting game time at 12.
Well, I hope you are right and he's a shoe-in for the 13 jersey now ALB is out.
But I think we should reserve judgement until he has started a few more tests against top-level teams.
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2022:
@Victor-Meldrew Mikaele-Tu'u, if it's to build for the future. MMT is 24; PGS is 27 (and his form has dropped).
PGS is 27, he probably looked 27 when he was 17 then.
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2022:
@Victor-Meldrew Mikaele-Tu'u, if it's to build for the future. MMT is 24; PGS is 27 (and his form has dropped).
I think/hope we'll see MMT in the squad if not in the 23 so the coaches can have a good look at him. He might be one of those players who transitions to Test level easier than most.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2022:
@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2022:
@Victor-Meldrew Mikaele-Tu'u, if it's to build for the future. MMT is 24; PGS is 27 (and his form has dropped).
I think/hope we'll see MMT in the squad if not in the 23 so the coaches can have a good look at him. He might be one of those players who transitions to Test level easier than most.
Very raw player, probably similar to Akira 3 or so years ago, so yeah take a punt while we have 4-5 other solid loosies. Those players are few and far between in NZ.
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@Bones said in All Blacks 2022:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2022:
@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2022:
@Victor-Meldrew Mikaele-Tu'u, if it's to build for the future. MMT is 24; PGS is 27 (and his form has dropped).
I think/hope we'll see MMT in the squad if not in the 23 so the coaches can have a good look at him. He might be one of those players who transitions to Test level easier than most.
Very raw player, probably similar to Akira 3 or so years ago, so yeah take a punt while we have 4-5 other solid loosies. Those players are few and far between in NZ.
Yeah. And while not getting into a Foster as coach argument, he does seem to do well with talented but raw players at Test level - e.g. Akira
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2022:
Those raw players for the future, isn't that where the All Blacks XV team comes in? The non-test squad that is likely to play a few matches this year, according to some?
No. They come from super rugby typically, like every other year. Mounga, Christie, Jordan, Jordie, Reece, Blackadder, Savea, Lord, Taukieaho, Coles, Tu'ungafasi, the list goes on....
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@Bones said in All Blacks 2022:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2022:
@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2022:
@Victor-Meldrew Mikaele-Tu'u, if it's to build for the future. MMT is 24; PGS is 27 (and his form has dropped).
I think/hope we'll see MMT in the squad if not in the 23 so the coaches can have a good look at him. He might be one of those players who transitions to Test level easier than most.
Very raw player, probably similar to Akira 3 or so years ago, so yeah take a punt while we have 4-5 other solid loosies. Those players are few and far between in NZ.
He doesn't seem to be missing as many tackles as last year (roughly averaging 5, missing 1 looking at ESPN stats), which is a positive, although I'm not always convinced by his workrate on defence. Nevertheless, I'd have him close and defnitely starting for the AB 15.
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@gt12 said in All Blacks 2022:
@Bones said in All Blacks 2022:
@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2022:
@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2022:
@Victor-Meldrew Mikaele-Tu'u, if it's to build for the future. MMT is 24; PGS is 27 (and his form has dropped).
I think/hope we'll see MMT in the squad if not in the 23 so the coaches can have a good look at him. He might be one of those players who transitions to Test level easier than most.
Very raw player, probably similar to Akira 3 or so years ago, so yeah take a punt while we have 4-5 other solid loosies. Those players are few and far between in NZ.
He doesn't seem to be missing as many tackles as last year (roughly averaging 5, missing 1 looking at ESPN stats), which is a positive, although I'm not always convinced by his workrate on defence. Nevertheless, I'd have him close and defnitely starting for the AB 15.
It'd probably be at the expense of someone like Robinson though - although I see him more as in competition with Vaai for that lock/6 spot.
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@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2022:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2022:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
He has the distribution skills, the boot, and he is big and strong. The only thing I notice is he is less visible in the game in terms of doing significant things, due to lack of space? I have no doubt he has great potential to be a sort of second 10 type of 12 who is also able to take on the line
My trouble with JB at 12 right at this moment is that what we desperately need there is someone with linking vision. While his style can be very effective I don't see him setting RI/Jordan/Clarke etc into space, more a line runner/bender and re-set behind the gain line type.
In short he plays 12 like a fullback.I saw him distribute for the Blacks in the lions series. Small sample size though. I think he plays that way for the Canes because that's the way they play. He's played in midfield at age group level so he has some background. I'd like to see how he goes in a test
I'm not saying he's a bad midfielder. I actually think he's quite good. But if you look at his style and how it may assist in getting our strikepower free I just don't see him as a link man like Goodhue has shown to be and QT is fast developing as. I just don't see the need to move the 15 that everyone was raving about as our best player just last year to a different spot.
If RI is at 13 we have 4 very good options in Goodhue, RTS, QT and Havili (in no order). At fullback we have 1 other very good option (2 if you move BB back there)He needs to play. But it is a risk to move a guy who's recently nailed down 15 to another position. Maybe a one off trial, it's getting close to the next RWC so time is running out. Having said that, in my mind no one has nailed down spots starting in midfield except perhaps ALB
I see it as Jordie needs to play where he's best suited and wants to play, because Jordan's form means he should be starting at fullback.
There's plenty of Tests between now and the RWC.
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Fakatava eligible
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@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2022:
@Stargazer another option is have Perenara in the Maori squad and then call him up if needed
TJP can be captain of NZ Maori. A fitting 'demotion' for a servant of the black jersey and one I think he would relish.
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@Crucial said in All Blacks 2022:
@KiwiMurph said in All Blacks 2022:
@Stargazer another option is have Perenara in the Maori squad and then call him up if needed
TJP can be captain of NZ Maori. A fitting 'demotion' for a servant of the black jersey and one I think he would relish.
He loves those hakas.
Perhaps he can perform two before the game. -
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@antipodean said in All Blacks 2022:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2022:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2022:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
He has the distribution skills, the boot, and he is big and strong. The only thing I notice is he is less visible in the game in terms of doing significant things, due to lack of space? I have no doubt he has great potential to be a sort of second 10 type of 12 who is also able to take on the line
My trouble with JB at 12 right at this moment is that what we desperately need there is someone with linking vision. While his style can be very effective I don't see him setting RI/Jordan/Clarke etc into space, more a line runner/bender and re-set behind the gain line type.
In short he plays 12 like a fullback.I saw him distribute for the Blacks in the lions series. Small sample size though. I think he plays that way for the Canes because that's the way they play. He's played in midfield at age group level so he has some background. I'd like to see how he goes in a test
I'm not saying he's a bad midfielder. I actually think he's quite good. But if you look at his style and how it may assist in getting our strikepower free I just don't see him as a link man like Goodhue has shown to be and QT is fast developing as. I just don't see the need to move the 15 that everyone was raving about as our best player just last year to a different spot.
If RI is at 13 we have 4 very good options in Goodhue, RTS, QT and Havili (in no order). At fullback we have 1 other very good option (2 if you move BB back there)He needs to play. But it is a risk to move a guy who's recently nailed down 15 to another position. Maybe a one off trial, it's getting close to the next RWC so time is running out. Having said that, in my mind no one has nailed down spots starting in midfield except perhaps ALB
I see it as Jordie needs to play where he's best suited and wants to play, because Jordan's form means he should be starting at fullback.
There's plenty of Tests between now and the RWC.
But TUJ is a specialist midfielders & a much better 12 than Jordie, watch a replay of the Canes vs Landers match, TUJ physically dominated Barrett in the midfield.
Jordie has played far better at 15 for the Canes, he hasn't looked convincing at 12.
You're basing your rational on feeling.
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@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2022:
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2022:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2022:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2022:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
He has the distribution skills, the boot, and he is big and strong. The only thing I notice is he is less visible in the game in terms of doing significant things, due to lack of space? I have no doubt he has great potential to be a sort of second 10 type of 12 who is also able to take on the line
My trouble with JB at 12 right at this moment is that what we desperately need there is someone with linking vision. While his style can be very effective I don't see him setting RI/Jordan/Clarke etc into space, more a line runner/bender and re-set behind the gain line type.
In short he plays 12 like a fullback.I saw him distribute for the Blacks in the lions series. Small sample size though. I think he plays that way for the Canes because that's the way they play. He's played in midfield at age group level so he has some background. I'd like to see how he goes in a test
I'm not saying he's a bad midfielder. I actually think he's quite good. But if you look at his style and how it may assist in getting our strikepower free I just don't see him as a link man like Goodhue has shown to be and QT is fast developing as. I just don't see the need to move the 15 that everyone was raving about as our best player just last year to a different spot.
If RI is at 13 we have 4 very good options in Goodhue, RTS, QT and Havili (in no order). At fullback we have 1 other very good option (2 if you move BB back there)He needs to play. But it is a risk to move a guy who's recently nailed down 15 to another position. Maybe a one off trial, it's getting close to the next RWC so time is running out. Having said that, in my mind no one has nailed down spots starting in midfield except perhaps ALB
I see it as Jordie needs to play where he's best suited and wants to play, because Jordan's form means he should be starting at fullback.
There's plenty of Tests between now and the RWC.
But TUJ is a specialist midfielders & a much better 12 than Jordie, watch a replay of the Canes vs Landers match, TUJ physically dominated Barrett in the midfield.
Jordie has played far better at 15 for the Canes, he hasn't looked convincing at 12.
You're basing your rational on feeling.
I'm a fan of both of them at 12 and I guess it comes down to what style of rugby the All Black's want to play this year. If they want a powerful 12 to get them over the advantage line then TUJ is your man, if they want a 12 that has a physical presense, a strong kicking game and a sound offloading game then Jordie is your man.
If I had to pick one of them I would go with Jordie Barrett, he just needs more time at 12 but I think he will develop into a world-class midfielder. We are 18 tests out from the WC aswell so I'd rather go with someone that's already well equipped to playing test rugby vs an out and out rookie.
Best case scenario - they both get picked and they both get a shot in the jersey. Beats David Havili at 12 any day and I think if RTS gets selected he will be more of an impact player coming off the bench.
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@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2022:
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2022:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2022:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2022:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
He has the distribution skills, the boot, and he is big and strong. The only thing I notice is he is less visible in the game in terms of doing significant things, due to lack of space? I have no doubt he has great potential to be a sort of second 10 type of 12 who is also able to take on the line
My trouble with JB at 12 right at this moment is that what we desperately need there is someone with linking vision. While his style can be very effective I don't see him setting RI/Jordan/Clarke etc into space, more a line runner/bender and re-set behind the gain line type.
In short he plays 12 like a fullback.I saw him distribute for the Blacks in the lions series. Small sample size though. I think he plays that way for the Canes because that's the way they play. He's played in midfield at age group level so he has some background. I'd like to see how he goes in a test
I'm not saying he's a bad midfielder. I actually think he's quite good. But if you look at his style and how it may assist in getting our strikepower free I just don't see him as a link man like Goodhue has shown to be and QT is fast developing as. I just don't see the need to move the 15 that everyone was raving about as our best player just last year to a different spot.
If RI is at 13 we have 4 very good options in Goodhue, RTS, QT and Havili (in no order). At fullback we have 1 other very good option (2 if you move BB back there)He needs to play. But it is a risk to move a guy who's recently nailed down 15 to another position. Maybe a one off trial, it's getting close to the next RWC so time is running out. Having said that, in my mind no one has nailed down spots starting in midfield except perhaps ALB
I see it as Jordie needs to play where he's best suited and wants to play, because Jordan's form means he should be starting at fullback.
There's plenty of Tests between now and the RWC.
But TUJ is a specialist midfielders & a much better 12 than Jordie, watch a replay of the Canes vs Landers match, TUJ physically dominated Barrett in the midfield.
Jordie has played far better at 15 for the Canes, he hasn't looked convincing at 12.
You're basing your rational on feeling.
The same TUJ that fades in and out of super rugby games? Thereās definite talent there but very much a work in progress.
I think Jordieās natural progression as a footy player and as an AB is a move to 12.
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@ACT-Crusader yeah, in TUJ's case he just needs to get consistent game time under his belt. He's been battered with injuries all throughout his career to date so he's certainly not the finished product. Maybe a player to look at post WC if he doesn't make the cut.
I wouldn't mind seeing him and his bro as starting midfielders in that shadow A.B team.
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@Canes4life said in All Blacks 2022:
@kiwi_expat said in All Blacks 2022:
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2022:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2022:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
@Crucial said in All Blacks 2022:
@canefan said in All Blacks 2022:
He has the distribution skills, the boot, and he is big and strong. The only thing I notice is he is less visible in the game in terms of doing significant things, due to lack of space? I have no doubt he has great potential to be a sort of second 10 type of 12 who is also able to take on the line
My trouble with JB at 12 right at this moment is that what we desperately need there is someone with linking vision. While his style can be very effective I don't see him setting RI/Jordan/Clarke etc into space, more a line runner/bender and re-set behind the gain line type.
In short he plays 12 like a fullback.I saw him distribute for the Blacks in the lions series. Small sample size though. I think he plays that way for the Canes because that's the way they play. He's played in midfield at age group level so he has some background. I'd like to see how he goes in a test
I'm not saying he's a bad midfielder. I actually think he's quite good. But if you look at his style and how it may assist in getting our strikepower free I just don't see him as a link man like Goodhue has shown to be and QT is fast developing as. I just don't see the need to move the 15 that everyone was raving about as our best player just last year to a different spot.
If RI is at 13 we have 4 very good options in Goodhue, RTS, QT and Havili (in no order). At fullback we have 1 other very good option (2 if you move BB back there)He needs to play. But it is a risk to move a guy who's recently nailed down 15 to another position. Maybe a one off trial, it's getting close to the next RWC so time is running out. Having said that, in my mind no one has nailed down spots starting in midfield except perhaps ALB
I see it as Jordie needs to play where he's best suited and wants to play, because Jordan's form means he should be starting at fullback.
There's plenty of Tests between now and the RWC.
But TUJ is a specialist midfielders & a much better 12 than Jordie, watch a replay of the Canes vs Landers match, TUJ physically dominated Barrett in the midfield.
Jordie has played far better at 15 for the Canes, he hasn't looked convincing at 12.
You're basing your rational on feeling.
I'm a fan of both of them at 12 and I guess it comes down to what style of rugby the All Black's want to play this year. If they want a powerful 12 to get them over the advantage line then TUJ is your man, if they want a 12 that has a physical presense, a strong kicking game and a sound offloading game then Jordie is your man.
If I had to pick one of them I would go with Jordie Barrett, he just needs more time at 12 but I think he will develop into a world-class midfielder. We are 18 tests out from the WC aswell so I'd rather go with someone that's already well equipped to playing test rugby vs an out and out rookie.
Best case scenario - they both get picked and they both get a shot in the jersey. Beats David Havili at 12 any day and I think if RTS gets selected he will be more of an impact player coming off the bench.
Foster has already strongly indicated that they're fiercely opposed to moving Jordie away from 15 again.
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@kiwi_expat I think if the All Black's want to improve on their game this is the obvious move when you take into account the form of Will Jordan. Infact, if we don't see the Jordie at 12 / Jordan at 15 combination early into the test season, then it just reiterates to me that the wrong person is incharge of this All Black's side.
