Foster, Robertson, Rennie etc
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@machpants said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
I’m totally reserving judgement until the end of the year.
Just like the NZR board fucking should have.
ouchy ouch. At least in the quality of their decision-making they have been consistent ...
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@antipodean said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@pukunui said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@antipodean said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@pukunui said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
Let’s not forget that we have only played against a club player filled Tonga, Fiji, a historically poor Wallabies and a defence only Argentina.
I don’t think any proper judgement can be made until we play the Boks and some of the NH teams. Hopefully the trend of not making stupid selections and not using stupid tactics continues.
Still got concerns over our discipline, scrum and lineout.Well you say that, but Argentina scored points against the Boks. Oz beat them.
So what if Arg scored a couple of points against the Boks. They are rubbish at the moment. An comfortable win against them is absolutely the minimum required standard for the ABs. One that wasn’t achieved last year.
As for Aus beating the Boks, that is pretty much standard for the last 20 years isn’t it? The Boks have always struggled in Aus.
Doesn’t change the fact that Bok style and players will be a bigger test of where the ABs are than the teams we have played over the last 2 years.
Again; I'm pointing out based on form the Boks won't be much of a test.
You are completely missing the definition of the word test.
ie. trying something and see what the result is so you can come to informed conclusions.
Maybe the result of the boks games tells us we are much better than them. Great. I want to see some actual evidence of that before claiming superiority via some pathetic ‘we beat them and they beat you so we are therefore better than you’ type crap.Easy wins against lower ranked teams mean nothing when measuring yourself against higher ranked teams.
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@booboo said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@pukunui said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@antipodean said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@pukunui said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
Let’s not forget that we have only played against a club player filled Tonga, Fiji, a historically poor Wallabies and a defence only Argentina.
I don’t think any proper judgement can be made until we play the Boks and some of the NH teams. Hopefully the trend of not making stupid selections and not using stupid tactics continues.
Still got concerns over our discipline, scrum and lineout.Well you say that, but Argentina scored points against the Boks. Oz beat them.
. An comfortable win against them is absolutely the minimum required standard for the ABs. One that wasn’t achieved last year.
I guess you missed the other game where they beat us for the first time ever? That failure doesn’t get erased by the next game. That standard applies to every game.
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@bones said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@pukunui said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
I don’t think any proper judgement can be made until we play the Boks and some of the NH teams.
Yeah and then when we beat them, judgement can't be made until we play Japan and Canada and then after that, well Foster hasn't beaten the moon has he!
Don’t know why im bothering to reply to this rubbish but here goes.
Are Japan and Canada ranked above us?
Are they current world champs?
Have they beaten us at any point in our last few games?Do you really need this concept explained to you?
Beating shit teams means nothing. -
@pukunui said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
Beating shit teams means nothing.
who are the good teams?
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@mariner4life said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@pukunui said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
Beating shit teams means nothing.
who are the good teams?
You know, those ones, those good teams. Those ones that never lose, that are always physical, that overpower opposition forwards. You know those ones.
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@arhs said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@pukunui so presumably you are counting Australia, therefore South Africa and therefore British Lions in that. I find your logic very hard to follow
it's really quite simple
I think Foster is shit, so the shit teams are the ones we have beat. and the good teams are the ones that we haven't played yet
Once you you realise the first 5 words are the key ones, then the rest flows pretty easy.
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@pukunui said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@antipodean said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@pukunui said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@antipodean said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@pukunui said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
Let’s not forget that we have only played against a club player filled Tonga, Fiji, a historically poor Wallabies and a defence only Argentina.
I don’t think any proper judgement can be made until we play the Boks and some of the NH teams. Hopefully the trend of not making stupid selections and not using stupid tactics continues.
Still got concerns over our discipline, scrum and lineout.Well you say that, but Argentina scored points against the Boks. Oz beat them.
So what if Arg scored a couple of points against the Boks. They are rubbish at the moment. An comfortable win against them is absolutely the minimum required standard for the ABs. One that wasn’t achieved last year.
As for Aus beating the Boks, that is pretty much standard for the last 20 years isn’t it? The Boks have always struggled in Aus.
Doesn’t change the fact that Bok style and players will be a bigger test of where the ABs are than the teams we have played over the last 2 years.
Again; I'm pointing out based on form the Boks won't be much of a test.
You are completely missing the definition of the word test.
ie. trying something and see what the result is so you can come to informed conclusions.
Maybe the result of the boks games tells us we are much better than them. Great. I want to see some actual evidence of that before claiming superiority via some pathetic ‘we beat them and they beat you so we are therefore better than you’ type crap.Easy wins against lower ranked teams mean nothing when measuring yourself against higher ranked teams.
We're talking conditional reasoning and comparison.
What do you call losing to a lower ranked team?
We're three from three. The "World Champions" just lost to a team we beat so badly they've still got a negative points differential of 50.
In one game against Argentina we equalled the points differential they required two games to amass.
So I'd like to know why/ how you come to the conclusion we can't make an informed judgement on this.
I guess when we retake the number one ranking we'll never be able to know how well we're doing because they're all lower ranked teams.
How's your argument looking now?
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@act-crusader last year the big scary teams were England and SA, one of those scary teams just lost to Aus...
Can only play what you have in front of you.
Look I think the process on how he got the job in the first place seemed shit, and the extension so early even more farcical, but I think these past few games there have been more than glimpses of improvement in our play, so jury still out, but I'm leaning toward thinking we will be ok.
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@taniwharugby One of those scary teams lost to Oz. Once. By 2 points. After an uncharacteristic display from the boot. And a pile of quarantine.
The point is, you can’t base relative strength off one game IMO. It’s one of the reasons I really care about our WR ranking, which is a better indicator than RWC win of long term strength. ABs are obviously better than Aus and Arg, based off the last few games. Boks? Dunno, we’ve lost/drawn/won a few. The relative strength will be much easier to judge at the end of the RC. England? Well we got spanked and scrapped a win last couple of games (previous ones are too far away). So I don’t know ATM, and we won’t find out.
If, as I expect, Boks utterly smash Oz last weekends result will obviously be an anomaly. It’s all about sustained results in rugby, not one offs.
I will stick to we’ll see if Foster deserved the extension at the end of the year. So far it’s better than 2020, so that’s hopeful. But playing high ranked Tier 1 teams is the real measure - atm that’s Boks, Eng, and Fr.
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@machpants well, SA havent been much cop against us in recent decades, winning 10 of the last 43 tests, and worse when you go to the last decade with 3 wins and a draw from 18...so you could argue they are a weak opponent for us to truly measure ourselves against too.
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@taniwharugby said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@machpants well, SA havent been much cop against us in recent decades, winning 10 of the last 43 tests, and worse when you go to the last decade with 3 wins and a draw from 18...so you could argue they are a weak opponent for us to truly measure ourselves against too.
Still feels satisfying to beat them. Let's deepen that hole
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@taniwharugby you gotta admit the boks have turned themselves around under ranting rassie!
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@machpants said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@taniwharugby you gotta admit the boks have turned themselves around under ranting rassie!
We beat them last time we played them and then a 2 year break for them. The Lions weren't great so we will see.
Is it still double points for RWC? Would they even be ranked #1 without that?
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@snowy said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@machpants said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@taniwharugby you gotta admit the boks have turned themselves around under ranting rassie!
We beat them last time we played them and then a 2 year break for them. The Lions weren't great so we will see.
Is it still double points for RWC? Would they even be ranked #1 without that?
Hard to tell about RWC ranking cos that’s what kept us on top for so long too. But I’m not saying they are better than ABs ATM, just that it is hard to judge. Just cos we smashed Oz and Oz scrapped past Boks doesn’t make us better.
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@machpants said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
Hard to tell about RWC ranking cos that’s what kept us on top for so long too.
Really? We were consistently winning even with out double points for RWC. Not disputing it - haven't looked but don't think it helped us much? We would have been there anyway?
@machpants said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
But I’m not saying they are better than ABs ATM, just that it is hard to judge. Just cos we smashed Oz and Oz scrapped past Boks doesn’t make us better.
Agreed. Mutually exclusive events and no indicator of outcome of a future event. Wasn't implying otherwise. Argentina should not have beaten us last year either.
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@snowy said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@machpants said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
Hard to tell about RWC ranking cos that’s what kept us on top for so long too.
Really? We were consistently winning even with out double points for RWC. Not disputing it - haven't looked but don't think it helped us much? We would have been there anyway?
@machpants said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
But I’m not saying they are better than ABs ATM, just that it is hard to judge. Just cos we smashed Oz and Oz scrapped past Boks doesn’t make us better.
Agreed. Mutually exclusive events and no indicator of outcome of a future event. Wasn't implying otherwise. Argentina should not have beaten us last year either.
RWC, I dunno. It has always included RWC double points, so you’d have to recalculate the whole thing. We’ve won 2 RWCs in tha period so obviously has helped us more than others. Could well be, recalculated sans RWC double, we’d still be top. A better system, the RWC double is just to save the embaressment of having the RWC champ not being world No 1!
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@pukunui said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@bones said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
@pukunui said in Foster signs 2 year extension:
I don’t think any proper judgement can be made until we play the Boks and some of the NH teams.
Yeah and then when we beat them, judgement can't be made until we play Japan and Canada and then after that, well Foster hasn't beaten the moon has he!
Don’t know why im bothering to reply to this rubbish but here goes.
Are Japan and Canada ranked above us?
Are they current world champs?
Have they beaten us at any point in our last few games?Do you really need this concept explained to you?
Beating shit teams means nothing.The moooooon!
I'm disappointed you went within a hair's breadth of "do you even watch rugby". Two times in one week would have made me happy.
