Super Rugby Women's Competition
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How about we put the "equality between the sexes" principle to the test and imagine that NZ Netball decided to provide an opportunity for a Men's league - exactly the same as NZRU are doing for women's rugby?
I wonder what the viability of that would be? The reaction from the existing netball sorority? Gushing support from the media?
Calm down, I'm making the point that comparing the sexes on the basis of equality is a failed concept. It veers into equality of outcome and illuminates fools like the woman in the tweet.
NZRUs push to provide equality of opportunity is highly and wholly commendable. Once the opportunity is rightfully given then the project is dependent on itself, and comparisons to male rugby are doomed to divide good intentioned people.
Watch out for this great opportunity for girls if it's contaminated and hindered by people focusing on outcomes- from both sexes.
Rule 4: "Compare yourself with who you were yesterday, not with who someone else is today." 🙂
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@siam said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
How about we put the "equality between the sexes" principle to the test and imagine that NZ Netball decided to provide an opportunity for a Men's league - exactly the same as NZRU are doing for women's rugby?
I wonder what the viability of that would be? The reaction from the existing netball sorority? Gushing support from the media?
Calm down, I'm making the point that comparing the sexes on the basis of equality is a failed concept. It veers into equality of outcome and illuminates fools like the woman in the tweet.
NZRUs push to provide equality of opportunity is highly and wholly commendable. Once the opportunity is rightfully given then the project is dependent on itself, and comparisons to male rugby are doomed to divide good intentioned people.
Watch out for this great opportunity for girls if it's contaminated and hindered by people focusing on outcomes- from both sexes.
Rule 4: "Compare yourself with who you were yesterday, not with who someone else is today." 🙂
I basically agree, but it’s worth pointing out the Olympics requirement.
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@bovidae although most NPC teams have been operating within themselves in recent years, no longer running at losses, but fair point.
But yea I guess it depends how much growth you expect from the woman's game internationally and therefore potential revenue increases.
Reality is, some woman's sports are often perceived as an inferior product to the men's version, so while there may be increased participation it doesn't always translate to dollars.
I do wonder what number of fans would pay same price of admission to watch the Black Ferns v Aus at Eden Park that they would for ABs v Aus, as a stand alone, not a curtain raiser (and again if you replicated in Aus) and similarly eyeballs on tv.
I'm not putting the product down, I just think we are a long way off them selling out EP for a BFs test
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@taniwharugby said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@bovidae although most NPC teams have been operating within themselves in recent years, no longer running at losses, but fair point.
If you removed the annual NZR grant I doubt that the PUs would be able to pay their players/staff and survive solely on sponsorship income and gate receipts.
I do wonder what number of fans would pay same price of admission to watch the Black Ferns v Aus at Eden Park that they would for ABs v Aus, as a stand alone, not a curtain raiser (and again if you replicated in Aus) and similarly eyeballs on tv.
I'm not putting the product down, I just think we are a long way off them selling out EP for a BFs test
I agree with that. From memory, the first women's rugby test I went to was in the late 1990s. The likes of Vanessa Cootes and Louisa Wall were playing. I've been to a few more in Hamilton since then but entry has always been free.
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Can I be a complete misogynistic arsehole and point out that no one wants to see women play sport unless they look like beach volleyballers ?
No matter how professional they get the blokes are always gonna be fitter, faster, stronger and more skilled overall. So people will watch them instead.
Anyway, must dash the other half is getting my pipe and slippers ready after a hard days work.
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@bovidae SUper Rugby teams would likewise be unable to survive is they had to rely on gate takings and sponsorships generated by themselves. Money from the PUs share of the television rights paid to the NZRFU technically is the PUs anyway given they are the providers of the product being televised.
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@mn5 said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
Can I be a complete misogynistic arsehole and point out that no one wants to see women play sport unless they look like beach volleyballers ?
No matter how professional they get the blokes are always gonna be fitter, faster, stronger and more skilled overall. So people will watch them instead.
Anyway, must dash the other half is getting my pipe and slippers ready after a hard days work.
Is that what they call "an inconvenient truth"?😉
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@bovidae not sure if this will work unless they play these as curtain-raisers to the men’s Super Rugby teams. I just can’t see them selling enough tickets / getting enough eyes on screens to make this feasible if the games are marketed as seperate events entirely.
Many would disagree, but to me the women’s game isn’t at a high enough standard yet to warrant their own Super competition, especially during a pandemic. I tried watching some of the Farah Palmer Cup the other day and let’s just say I wouldn’t exactly spend my hard earned $$ on the product.
I’m all for growing women’s rugby but rushing a comp like this could end up doing more damage than good. Will be interesting to see what happens and happy to be proven wrong.
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@canes4life said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
I’m all for growing women’s rugby but rushing a comp like this could end up doing more damage than good. Will be interesting to see what happens and happy to be proven wrong.
I coach a female rep team as part of the investment in developing a women's senior competition and I wouldn't pay to watch women's rugby.
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Men's Super Rugby is of a much higher standard than NPC, so women's SR will also be of a much higher standard than FPC.
If these games are stand-alone games, they'll be played at small grounds (e.g. Jerry Collins stadium instead of Sky Stadium; Rugby Park, instead of Christchurch Stadium etc.), so the ticket prices will be much lower.
I'll happily pay for a ticket to a women's SR game, provided it's not at Sky Stadium prices.
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@bovidae said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
Reading an article today, planning is well advanced for a 4-team competition to start in March next year. Teams based in Auckland, Hamilton, Wellington and Christchurch. A round-robin and final.
...wait...so i'd have to support the crusaders?...i thought they were trying to attract new fans....
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@kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@bovidae said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
Reading an article today, planning is well advanced for a 4-team competition to start in March next year. Teams based in Auckland, Hamilton, Wellington and Christchurch. A round-robin and final.
...wait...so i'd have to support the crusaders?...i thought they were trying to attract new fans....
They've taken the best Otago players already.
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@stargazer said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
Men's Super Rugby is of a much higher standard than NPC, so women's SR will also be of a much higher standard than FPC.
If these games are stand-alone games, they'll be played at small grounds (e.g. Jerry Collins stadium instead of Sky Stadium; Rugby Park, instead of Christchurch Stadium etc.), so the ticket prices will be much lower.
I'll happily pay for a ticket to a women's SR game, provided it's not at Sky Stadium prices.
Not sure that statement is true. Worst case scenerio is that the standard is exactly the same, because you are assuming that the consolidation of talent will have the same effect as it does in the men's team.
Not sure there is any evidence of that, as it's really early days. Are they training full time like the men? Or this semi-pro still? If semi-pro then it leans more towards the standard being the same.
Has anybody done any research if there is a market for women's rugby? Will women watch it? Will men?
I know that there was alot of talk about the potential ratings for High School rugby, that didn't eventuate either. At the end of the day, there are so many choices for sports fans, you have to have a really good product to steal away eyeballs.
I'm a rugby tragic and find it hard to get through a woman's match, standard is not great and it's like watching rugby in slow motion. Woman's sevens is a bit better, that's reasonably fun to watch.
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@bovidae said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@bovidae said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
Reading an article today, planning is well advanced for a 4-team competition to start in March next year. Teams based in Auckland, Hamilton, Wellington and Christchurch. A round-robin and final.
...wait...so i'd have to support the crusaders?...i thought they were trying to attract new fans....
They've taken the best Otago players already.
ive got lots of ties to chch..but i just dont think i can do it
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@kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@bovidae said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@kiwiwomble said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@bovidae said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
Reading an article today, planning is well advanced for a 4-team competition to start in March next year. Teams based in Auckland, Hamilton, Wellington and Christchurch. A round-robin and final.
...wait...so i'd have to support the crusaders?...i thought they were trying to attract new fans....
They've taken the best Otago players already.
ive got lots of ties to chch..but i just dont think i can do it
I know a lot of Otago-ites that feel the same. Best option is to have a different name for the one SI team. Base it in Chch but take games to Nelson, Dunedin etc when they can.
" Southern Pounamu" or something like that might get around the fact that everyone else hates the Crusaders name. -
@kirwan said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
@stargazer said in Super Rugby Women's Competition:
Men's Super Rugby is of a much higher standard than NPC, so women's SR will also be of a much higher standard than FPC.
If these games are stand-alone games, they'll be played at small grounds (e.g. Jerry Collins stadium instead of Sky Stadium; Rugby Park, instead of Christchurch Stadium etc.), so the ticket prices will be much lower.
I'll happily pay for a ticket to a women's SR game, provided it's not at Sky Stadium prices.
Not sure that statement is true. Worst case scenerio is that the standard is exactly the same, because you are assuming that the consolidation of talent will have the same effect as it does in the men's team.
Not sure there is any evidence of that, as it's really early days. Are they training full time like the men? Or this semi-pro still? If semi-pro then it leans more towards the standard being the same.
Has anybody done any research if there is a market for women's rugby? Will women watch it? Will men?
I know that there was alot of talk about the potential ratings for High School rugby, that didn't eventuate either. At the end of the day, there are so many choices for sports fans, you have to have a really good product to steal away eyeballs.
I'm a rugby tragic and find it hard to get through a woman's match, standard is not great and it's like watching rugby in slow motion. Woman's sevens is a bit better, that's reasonably fun to watch.
I get the argument that this may be moving too fast but I see it as increasing experience levels which will, in turn, increase skills.
The biggest problem with women's rugby is the amount of games available to get experience. School and Club comps have few teams so players are moving up a level to FPC with very little experience.
Growing the game in visibility will, in turn, increase participation etc etc.
Our top level 7s players show that if you play a often and gain experience you can produce high quality entertainment.
