Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November
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@canefan said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@junior said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@canefan said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@junior said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@westcoastie said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
I missed the game on Saturday - what happened?
Was there even a game?I'm not going to read back through these posts. Its too depressing. For a long time, I felt our performance in the Lions First test was our template moving forward, now it looks more and more like an aberration. It now seems that we really can't look at in all the recent losses since the BIL & Chicago in isolation, because a pattern has formed, and we really have come back to the pack - which is great for World Rugby, shit for us.
Foster has to go.
RM is not the next Dan Carter, in fact, I think its probably been shown that BB is better behind a poor pack. RM has and does go missing when its not working in front of him. We have some issues, not just RM, but right through the whole team & culture. Time for change.
I hope Razor can fix them.RM is a big time downhill skier and he's shown that quite amply over the past couple of months. No ability or even willingness to try and impact the game when it's not being served up on a platter. I also wonder if he has a good enough kicking game to be steering this team around the park. This team is going to get beaten upfront fairly regularly it seems, so we need a 10 who can actually kick a ball in a way that's going to relieve pressure. I don't see that he has this ability.
He is one of many issues. After the Summer of rugby we've had from Henry and Hansen, this Winter is going to be cold and gloomy
Agreed, and I'm not saying that he is solely to blame for where the team currently sits. I'm just saying, with where this team is currently at, he might not actually be the best guy to be steering them around the park (and he's not even steering them to be accurate).
BB runs hot and cold too, not helped by being played at 15 by the Blues and ABs. Legitimate question, who would you pick?
I would pick BB there, TBH. I know he has his issues, but he is the best available option. He is probably our best player and so needs the ball in his hands more. He has a somewhat proven combination with A Smith. Also, he's clearly one of the leaders and decision-makers - he therefore needs to be in a position to effect these decisions. At the moment, I'm not sure we are getting that from RM.
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@junior said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@canefan said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@junior said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@canefan said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@junior said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@westcoastie said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
I missed the game on Saturday - what happened?
Was there even a game?I'm not going to read back through these posts. Its too depressing. For a long time, I felt our performance in the Lions First test was our template moving forward, now it looks more and more like an aberration. It now seems that we really can't look at in all the recent losses since the BIL & Chicago in isolation, because a pattern has formed, and we really have come back to the pack - which is great for World Rugby, shit for us.
Foster has to go.
RM is not the next Dan Carter, in fact, I think its probably been shown that BB is better behind a poor pack. RM has and does go missing when its not working in front of him. We have some issues, not just RM, but right through the whole team & culture. Time for change.
I hope Razor can fix them.RM is a big time downhill skier and he's shown that quite amply over the past couple of months. No ability or even willingness to try and impact the game when it's not being served up on a platter. I also wonder if he has a good enough kicking game to be steering this team around the park. This team is going to get beaten upfront fairly regularly it seems, so we need a 10 who can actually kick a ball in a way that's going to relieve pressure. I don't see that he has this ability.
He is one of many issues. After the Summer of rugby we've had from Henry and Hansen, this Winter is going to be cold and gloomy
Agreed, and I'm not saying that he is solely to blame for where the team currently sits. I'm just saying, with where this team is currently at, he might not actually be the best guy to be steering them around the park (and he's not even steering them to be accurate).
BB runs hot and cold too, not helped by being played at 15 by the Blues and ABs. Legitimate question, who would you pick?
I would pick BB there, TBH. I know he has his issues, but he is the best available option. He is probably our best player and so needs the ball in his hands more. He has a somewhat proven combination with A Smith. Also, he's clearly one of the leaders and decision-makers - he therefore needs to be in a position to effect these decisions. At the moment, I'm not sure we are getting that from RM.
I agree. Offers more leadership
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No potential for Josh Ioane at 10 in the next couple of years?
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J. Moody
C. Taylor
N. Laulala
S. Whitelock
Q. Strange
S. Barrett
T. Chief
C. Grace
T. Lander
R. Mo’unga
S. Reece
J. Goodhue
A. Lienart-Brown
G. Bridge
W. Jordan -
@BerniesCorner said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
He use to play 13 so not technically a Cullen
What you smoking bro? That would be exactly like Cullen. Can't say I've ever heard BB played 13 though.
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@junior said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@westcoastie said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
I missed the game on Saturday - what happened?
Was there even a game?I'm not going to read back through these posts. Its too depressing. For a long time, I felt our performance in the Lions First test was our template moving forward, now it looks more and more like an aberration. It now seems that we really can't look at in all the recent losses since the BIL & Chicago in isolation, because a pattern has formed, and we really have come back to the pack - which is great for World Rugby, shit for us.
Foster has to go.
RM is not the next Dan Carter, in fact, I think its probably been shown that BB is better behind a poor pack. RM has and does go missing when its not working in front of him. We have some issues, not just RM, but right through the whole team & culture. Time for change.
I hope Razor can fix them.RM is a big time downhill skier and he's shown that quite amply over the past couple of months. No ability or even willingness to try and impact the game when it's not being served up on a platter. I also wonder if he has a good enough kicking game to be steering this team around the park. This team is going to get beaten upfront fairly regularly it seems, so we need a 10 who can actually kick a ball in a way that's going to relieve pressure. I don't see that he has this ability.
Yeah, I think what makes it worse, other than his propensity to disappear into the shadows when the going gets tough, is he just doesn't have a "basics" game to fall back on. Or if he does, he doesn't see it's required.
How often does he mess up a penalty kick for touch? The one yesterday was a fucken easy kick and was the perfect moment for the ABs to take a breath, push down the field, hold the ball and apply some pressure. And he shanks it so badly it wasn't even close. Then doesn't atone, because he can't.
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@kev said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@hydro11 the running game is about creating space. We were not moving ball into space and when we did Reiko dropped it.
This a thousand times
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@hydro11 said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@Marty said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
World has been reeling AB's in since 2015, this was sadly inevitable. Feel bad for Cane.
It's because we haven't addressed our weaknesses.
This also a thousand times
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@Bones said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@junior said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
@westcoastie said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
I missed the game on Saturday - what happened?
Was there even a game?I'm not going to read back through these posts. Its too depressing. For a long time, I felt our performance in the Lions First test was our template moving forward, now it looks more and more like an aberration. It now seems that we really can't look at in all the recent losses since the BIL & Chicago in isolation, because a pattern has formed, and we really have come back to the pack - which is great for World Rugby, shit for us.
Foster has to go.
RM is not the next Dan Carter, in fact, I think its probably been shown that BB is better behind a poor pack. RM has and does go missing when its not working in front of him. We have some issues, not just RM, but right through the whole team & culture. Time for change.
I hope Razor can fix them.RM is a big time downhill skier and he's shown that quite amply over the past couple of months. No ability or even willingness to try and impact the game when it's not being served up on a platter. I also wonder if he has a good enough kicking game to be steering this team around the park. This team is going to get beaten upfront fairly regularly it seems, so we need a 10 who can actually kick a ball in a way that's going to relieve pressure. I don't see that he has this ability.
Yeah, I think what makes it worse, other than his propensity to disappear into the shadows when the going gets tough, is he just doesn't have a "basics" game to fall back on. Or if he does, he doesn't see it's required.
How often does he mess up a penalty kick for touch? The one yesterday was a fucken easy kick and was the perfect moment for the ABs to take a breath, push down the field, hold the ball and apply some pressure. And he shanks it so badly it wasn't even close. Then doesn't atone, because he can't.
Yeah it’s like if he can’t do something freakish / flashy he literally has no impact on the game.
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No chance Foster will drop Mo;unga in the final game , it would stink of panic stations if he did and it would be a stupid decision imho. Still believe that Ritchie is the better 10 but I don't think its too much to ask that we get at least parity upfront. Collectively the backs were dissappointing but I don't think there are any material changes to be made for next game. We just have to see how they respond.
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EMBARRASSING. From start to finish. As someone else said, we'd be lucky to make it out of our pool in the next WC on this evidence.
Pinetree, BJ Lochore , Fred Allen and Kel Tremain to name but a few would be absolutely disgusted with that performance. Shame on this crop of "All Blacks" you dishonour the jersey and memory of those before you who wore it with pride and earned respect worldwide. -
@Jailbreak7 said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
EMBARRASSING. From start to finish. As someone else said, we'd be lucky to make it out of our pool in the next WC on this evidence.
Pinetree, BJ Lochore , Fred Allen and Kel Tremain to name but a few would be absolutely disgusted with that performance. Shame on this crop of "All Blacks" you dishonour the jersey and memory of those before you who wore it with pride and earned respect worldwide.😂 You aren't @sparky's twin brother are you? How well did you know the guys in bold?
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Ok, last 30 rewatch.
Again, better than I expected, but SO annoying.
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50-53 Some good lineout work -- Savea!! -- and two good mauls lead to try. 10 - 19.
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BUT THEN After good Smith kick off return to halfway, Clarke marks poor Puma box kick, but, rather than tap and pass to BB/RM, kicks himself and gains 3m. From lineout one phase then Mo'unga is stupidly standing on 22 when ruck is 2m inside. ACTUAL offside line. In front. 10 -22 after 57.
That is very important because Pumas leaked plenty of penalties in their 22 in last 20. At 10 - 19 we take kick and one try to win. But now need two tries.
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At the 60 Pumas penalised on 22. Kick means lineout 10m out. UK coverage missed lineout but we lost it?
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Soon after a short kick from RM advances us to 22.
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At 63 JG off for DMac and Roane to 13. Play develops and Pumas knock on. Excellent scrum and Sotutu advances to 22, good ruck and overlap (photo to follow). RM-ALB-Roane, who drops ball with Clarke unmarked and one covering Puma to beat. Sure JG would have nailed that assist.
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Now 66 and good AB scrum. We regain possession and ALB makes good ground angling back close to ruck. Has another similar good dab shortly after RM grubber straight to Puma. Another penalty 40m out.
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71 ANOTHER penalty right in front of sticks Good scrum, excellent Sotutu break and pass which if it hits Dmac is try and if converted real chance of win. But if Sotutu had kept running also probably try, but easier conversion.
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73.30 ANOTHING FARKING PENALTY right in front. Scrum? No. Weber taps (tip from TJP?), turnover, kicked to halfway, dubious penalty from maul??, Sanchez kicks it. 10-25. GAME OVER.
In 15 minutes (58-73) we had at least two try scoring opportunites, numerous penalties in Puma half (some in 22), score NOTHING, and they get to halfway ONCE and steal 3!!!!
ABs did a lot right, but if chances aren't taken matches are lost.
Still not going just to blame Foster.
Some observations:
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ABs made chances and Puma gaps were exposed, despite mood of thread.
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Sotutu transformed ABs in loose.
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Savea good lineout option and seemed better at breakdown once Sotutu on.
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AB scrum with Moody/Taylor/Laulala in front row had edge on Puma starters.
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ALB footwork at 12 unlocked Puma defence. Pity JG couldn't have just swapped with him at the 68 mark!!!
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DMac added some spice.
I'm backing ABs to rebound very strongly in a fortnight...
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@pakman said in Argentina One: Parramatta, 14 November:
I'm backing ABs to rebound very strongly in a fortnight...
There will likely be some careers depending on it
