Possible All Blacks 2020
-
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
-
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
-
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
we did dump Ma'a, and he came back a much better player.
There is a huge difference between "not good enough now" and "should never play tests again" and i don't get how on here saying one automatically means the other. J Barrett has all the talent in the world, and should still have a good test career, but i am not sure he should be in the team yet.
-
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
we did dump Ma'a, and he came back a much better player.
There is a huge difference between "not good enough now" and "should never play tests again" and i don't get how on here saying one automatically means the other. J Barrett has all the talent in the world, and should still have a good test career, but i am not sure he should be in the team yet.
And we have done the same for Jordie, yet he gets used as punch line here quite often. Quite seperate from how he's actually performing.
That happens to a few players, you get a Fern reputation then it just gets repeated ad nauseum.
-
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
we did dump Ma'a, and he came back a much better player.
There is a huge difference between "not good enough now" and "should never play tests again" and i don't get how on here saying one automatically means the other. J Barrett has all the talent in the world, and should still have a good test career, but i am not sure he should be in the team yet.
And we have done the same for Jordie, yet he gets used as punch line here quite often. Quite seperate from how he's actually performing.
That happens to a few players, you get a Fern reputation then it just gets repeated ad nauseum.
oh i freely admit to going waaaay over the top with that, it's become a thing
but in my admittedly feeble defense, it's as a reaction to the over the top hype the kid gets, and the rating compared to performance.
This place is getting boring enough with the constant bringing up of facts rather than just allowing a discussion to generate. Over the top discussions about players is all we have left. I rag on the Barretts, others see everything named Ioane as being dogshit. Let us have some pub discussions, or we may as well just turn this place in to google.
"just refer to the front page"
-
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
we did dump Ma'a, and he came back a much better player.
There is a huge difference between "not good enough now" and "should never play tests again" and i don't get how on here saying one automatically means the other. J Barrett has all the talent in the world, and should still have a good test career, but i am not sure he should be in the team yet.
And we have done the same for Jordie, yet he gets used as punch line here quite often. Quite seperate from how he's actually performing.
That happens to a few players, you get a Fern reputation then it just gets repeated ad nauseum.
Jordie didn't get dumped, he got taken to the RWC and selected for the big matches despite not having the form to warrant it. Nonu got dumped from a RWC squad when he was closer to a starting selection on pure form than Jordie has ever been.
As @mariner4life notes no one is completely shutting the door on Jordie but it's fanciful to suggest he hasn't had a charmed run in the ABs that doesn't really reflect the performances he's put in over the past couple of years.
He's started very well this year though.
-
@KiwiMurph said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
Aso vs Rieko this weekend should be a good one to keep an eye on.
With them being cousins, it makes it even more interesting.
-
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
we did dump Ma'a, and he came back a much better player.
There is a huge difference between "not good enough now" and "should never play tests again" and i don't get how on here saying one automatically means the other. J Barrett has all the talent in the world, and should still have a good test career, but i am not sure he should be in the team yet.
And we have done the same for Jordie, yet he gets used as punch line here quite often. Quite seperate from how he's actually performing.
That happens to a few players, you get a Fern reputation then it just gets repeated ad nauseum.
oh i freely admit to going waaaay over the top with that, it's become a thing
but in my admittedly feeble defense, it's as a reaction to the over the top hype the kid gets, and the rating compared to performance.
This place is getting boring enough with the constant bringing up of facts rather than just allowing a discussion to generate. Over the top discussions about players is all we have left. I rag on the Barretts, others see everything named Ioane as being dogshit. Let us have some pub discussions, or we may as well just turn this place in to google.
"just refer to the front page"
Conversations on a forum are more interesting when there is more depth than "He sucks". Over and over again.
Or the Akira is fat jokes.
Especially when players like Jordie are actually playing well this year. Things change.
-
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
we did dump Ma'a, and he came back a much better player.
There is a huge difference between "not good enough now" and "should never play tests again" and i don't get how on here saying one automatically means the other. J Barrett has all the talent in the world, and should still have a good test career, but i am not sure he should be in the team yet.
And we have done the same for Jordie, yet he gets used as punch line here quite often. Quite seperate from how he's actually performing.
That happens to a few players, you get a Fern reputation then it just gets repeated ad nauseum.
oh i freely admit to going waaaay over the top with that, it's become a thing
but in my admittedly feeble defense, it's as a reaction to the over the top hype the kid gets, and the rating compared to performance.
This place is getting boring enough with the constant bringing up of facts rather than just allowing a discussion to generate. Over the top discussions about players is all we have left. I rag on the Barretts, others see everything named Ioane as being dogshit. Let us have some pub discussions, or we may as well just turn this place in to google.
"just refer to the front page"
Conversations on a forum are more interesting when there is more depth than "He sucks". Over and over again.
Or the Akira is fat jokes.
Especially when players like Jordie are actually playing well this year. Things change.
fair comment
-
It’s really difficult change the initial perception of a player
It happened with Nonu, to a lesser extent it happened with Crockett. But it is rare.
I think Tuipulotu might be doing this now.
Jordie probably needs a season as a starter for things to change. So it may not happen at all
-
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
we did dump Ma'a, and he came back a much better player.
There is a huge difference between "not good enough now" and "should never play tests again" and i don't get how on here saying one automatically means the other. J Barrett has all the talent in the world, and should still have a good test career, but i am not sure he should be in the team yet.
And we have done the same for Jordie, yet he gets used as punch line here quite often. Quite seperate from how he's actually performing.
That happens to a few players, you get a Fern reputation then it just gets repeated ad nauseum.
oh i freely admit to going waaaay over the top with that, it's become a thing
but in my admittedly feeble defense, it's as a reaction to the over the top hype the kid gets, and the rating compared to performance.
This place is getting boring enough with the constant bringing up of facts rather than just allowing a discussion to generate. Over the top discussions about players is all we have left. I rag on the Barretts, others see everything named Ioane as being dogshit. Let us have some pub discussions, or we may as well just turn this place in to google.
"just refer to the front page"
Conversations on a forum are more interesting when there is more depth than "He sucks". Over and over again.
Or the Akira is fat jokes.
Especially when players like Jordie are actually playing well this year. Things change.
fair comment
Agreement.
Fuck it's getting boring on here...
-
Interesting article it puts this stupid AB rest scenario in perspective
[link text](link url)https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/all-blacks/120029168/super-rugby-all-blacks-rest-plans-reach-absurd-levels-as-braydon-ennor-misses-out
-
@broughie said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Victor-Meldrew While I agree Cane should have been selected he would not have made the difference. We were man handled in the forwards and this has been an ongoing weakness exposed by Oz in Perth. Mariner has it right that we have too many fit buggers and not enough mongrel and size.
I disagree because Cane tackles better than anyone in rugby. His presence is immense - our issue is he can't do it alone. We need a lock who does it (and Pat is looking good there) and a blindside like we've had during our golden period.
-
@sparky said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
Akira Ioane.
Watching the way England, France and RSA have just battered their opposition into submission at various stages over the last 12 months have highlighted just how valuable a bruiser like Akira is likely to be for us. This is particularly the case where we are without Retallick (our hard man) and there are already concerns about our lack of physicality in the big matches.
-
@Duluth said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
Tuipulotu can provide some of that. He’s dominating collisions and maintaining standards over 80mins.
I agree with that and I suspect we will not just him to perform that role but also A. N. Other. Part of the reason why England, RSA etc. are having so much success with their bludgeoning approach is because they have so many bludgeons - they are not reliant on one person to provide that extra physicality
-
@booboo said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@mariner4life said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Kirwan said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@Stargazer said in Possible All Blacks 2020:
@cgrant I'm still on the fence. Rieko Ioane has to improve a lot to come into the ABs midfield (other than as an emergency injury cover). He was terrible against the Stormers, but it's early days. He needs to play there consistently to improve, so give him time.
I didn't name Aso, yet, for the same reason (e.g. not quite there, yet), but IMO he's ahead of Ioane at the moment for a spot in the ABs midfield.
He was far from terrible, that's not accurate at all. Also, he's player centre a few times for the All Blacks already.
but he's behind proven midfield test players like Jordie Barrett...
I don't get the Jordie hate either, very useful to have a player that can play 15,wing,12 and 10 at a pinch. Not mention his goalkicking.
If we had dumped Nonu when he was at the same stage of his career making all his mistakes we'd have missed out on one of the greats. These players are in their early 20s!
we did dump Ma'a, and he came back a much better player.
There is a huge difference between "not good enough now" and "should never play tests again" and i don't get how on here saying one automatically means the other. J Barrett has all the talent in the world, and should still have a good test career, but i am not sure he should be in the team yet.
And we have done the same for Jordie, yet he gets used as punch line here quite often. Quite seperate from how he's actually performing.
That happens to a few players, you get a Fern reputation then it just gets repeated ad nauseum.
oh i freely admit to going waaaay over the top with that, it's become a thing
but in my admittedly feeble defense, it's as a reaction to the over the top hype the kid gets, and the rating compared to performance.
This place is getting boring enough with the constant bringing up of facts rather than just allowing a discussion to generate. Over the top discussions about players is all we have left. I rag on the Barretts, others see everything named Ioane as being dogshit. Let us have some pub discussions, or we may as well just turn this place in to google.
"just refer to the front page"
Conversations on a forum are more interesting when there is more depth than "He sucks". Over and over again.
Or the Akira is fat jokes.
Especially when players like Jordie are actually playing well this year. Things change.
fair comment
Agreement.
Fuck it's getting boring on here...
Like you even know what they were arguing about...
