Exodus
-
@muddyriver Could certainly be a big shot in the arm for the NPC if they made it a recquirement to play in that comp for qualification to All Black selection. This year is going to rely on our youngsters really stepping up in the Super comp.
-
@muddyriver said in Exodus:
@Crucial I think NZ Needs to start selecting form overseas.
Super Rugby is losing a whole squad (-30) of Starting players this year. The Conveyer belt isnt big enough. The Highlanders can hardly get a full squad this year and alot of squads already contain 'Future" players.
Overseas comps have got better, the best coaches are in those comps. It would reduce NZ rugbys overheads (smaller all black contracts). Soccer is a professional model tried and tested. the bigger economies rule the roost with club comps.
Some major negatives go with that though.
- our best players all go where the money is meaning that the 'future' players are all we have for our product/income
- those 'future' players no longer get to test themselves against/ train with the best players
- we lose control over availability. look how well the WR availability rules work for the PI nations
I agree that hard and fast selection rules dont take into account senior players on sabbaticals or overseas contracts and making them effectively 're-apply' can be silly.
The Giteau rule hasnt really worked out for Oz. -
@Steven-Harris said in Exodus:
Hearing that both Tom Robinson and Shaun Stephenson are heading offshore after the super rugby season ,Robinson to Japan .
Stephenson came very close to signing an NRL contract ,Super Rugby form could be the game changer if not I think we can expect it will the last we see of him in NZ Rugby .They're genuinely two guys who could, probably should in Big Red's case, have been ABs. Bad luck for Big Red probably due to injury I think but Stephenson seems to be untrendy unfortunately. It seems Chiefs wings with booming boots aren't valued in NZ rugby.
Let's be realistic regarding Stevenson though. He (along with others) didn't demand selection at Super last season even when he wasnt injured. He did come back firing post Super though and he looks like continuing that form.
His problem now is the ABs finding room for him in a RWC year where the squad composition is usually light on the back three. -
@Crucial The vast Majority of income all comes from the All Blacks anyway. The PI nations also offer no considerable income for their players, The All Blacks payments would still be a significant portion of a players earnings
Domestic comps in traditional soccer countries still perform very well despite not being tier one comps.
Aussie struggles becuase they are Competing and losing with league for telent.
South Africa won the world cup with even looser rules than Aus.
-
@muddyriver said in Exodus:
@Crucial The vast Majority of income all comes from the All Blacks anyway. The PI nations also offer no considerable income for their players, The All Blacks payments would still be a significant portion of a players earnings
Domestic comps in traditional soccer countries still perform very well despite not being tier one comps.
Aussie struggles becuase they are Competing and losing with league for telent.
South Africa won the world cup with even looser rules than Aus.
All valid points but we also depend on Super Rugby income in our books. We have already seen how SA are no longer an attraction for multi-national comps and Oz find it hard to justify equal split of revenue.
I'm not sure that devaluing the NZ supplied product is the answer to a problem which is devaluing our product.
Soccer is not a similar product in any shape. It is well established as a tribal sport first and foremost and quality/player roster is not the biggest driver of public support. We all know dedicated football fans that watch their team and spend money despite how good/shit they are or where the players come from.
I think that a good case could be made for opening our franchises up to other international players in Oz/NZ and PI in the not too distant future. -
@muddyriver said in Exodus:
@Crucial I think NZ Needs to start selecting form overseas.
Super Rugby is losing a whole squad (-30) of Starting players this year. The Conveyer belt isnt big enough. The Highlanders can hardly get a full squad this year and alot of squads already contain 'Future" players.
Overseas comps have got better, the best coaches are in those comps. It would reduce NZ rugbys overheads (smaller all black contracts). Soccer is a professional model tried and tested. the bigger economies rule the roost with club comps.
Only as a last resort. NZ are currently in a difficult position I know but hope they can sort things out. I can't see an answer to it myself but I wouldn't like for say the 10 top players in the ABs to play for overseas team not NZ SRP teams. Esp if say Savea and Barrett were 2 to go.
One advantage might be to weaken NZ teams so that Aust were more competitive.
-
@Winger I think the Aussie teams will be stronger this year anyway. Really don't like the idea of dumming down our comp to make the Aussies look good. It is not like they don't already rely on a significant amount of our coaching and players to prop up their comp.
-
@muddyriver said in Exodus:
@Crucial I think NZ Needs to start selecting form overseas.
Super Rugby is losing a whole squad (-30) of Starting players this year. The Conveyer belt isnt big enough. The Highlanders can hardly get a full squad this year and alot of squads already contain 'Future" players.
Overseas comps have got better, the best coaches are in those comps. It would reduce NZ rugbys overheads (smaller all black contracts). Soccer is a professional model tried and tested. the bigger economies rule the roost with club comps.
Rugby isn't soccer, it's not comparing apples wth apples. The ABs can't just throw teams together pre-tournament/tour from players all over the globe and expect success. The sports are different, that's why even some NH teams restrict their players from even playing in a competition a few hours away.
Every time this is brought up we look at the overseas players and conclude there's barely any who would realistically make the team anyway.
-
@muddyriver said in Exodus:
@Crucial I think NZ Needs to start selecting form overseas.
Super Rugby is losing a whole squad (-30) of Starting players this year. The Conveyer belt isnt big enough. The Highlanders can hardly get a full squad this year and alot of squads already contain 'Future" players.
Overseas comps have got better, the best coaches are in those comps. It would reduce NZ rugbys overheads (smaller all black contracts). Soccer is a professional model tried and tested. the bigger economies rule the roost with club comps.
Rugby isn't soccer, it's not comparing apples wth apples. The ABs can't just throw teams together pre-tournament/tour from players all over the globe and expect success. The sports are different, that's why even some NH teams restrict their players from even playing in a competition a few hours away.
Every time this is brought up we look at the overseas players and conclude there's barely any who would realistically make the team anyway.
Yep totally agree I would hate to see us select from overseas and it would become a free for all.
-
-
lol fuck he's barely good enough now let alone in 4 years.
-
Lol Beauden was on a downward trajectory when he finished up at the Canes. I just can't imagine what he'll be like in four years, both parties need to move on after the WC IMO, there's plenty of talent coming through.
-
@Tim well hopefully it is an appropriate remuneration for where I expect he will be in 4 years...I mean if he sticks around, he still has alot to offer, particularly at super and npc (cos really post '24 I don't think he will be an AB still, i mean post RWC will be a stretch) so if it is a kinda mapped out exit from international rugby when he is no longer contributing in black, but the final 2 years of his contract are to 'give back'...
-
@mariner4life said in Exodus:
lol fuck he's barely good enough now let alone in 4 years.
Beauden has invoked the Codie Taylor clause. Lendrum must be an easy touch in the contract negotiations.
-
Plumtree is poised to return to Sharks as head coach | SuperSport
John Plumtee could shorty be back working out of HollywoodBets Kings Park as the Durban franchise looks to shake up its coaching structures going forward.
-
@Machpants looks here to me
-
D Duluth referenced this topic on
-
S Stargazer referenced this topic on
-
@bayimports said in Exodus:
@Machpants looks here to me
Yep, search fail...
Anyway Big Red off to Japan
Revealed: Blues star latest to leave NZ as Steve Hansen lures players to Japan
Influential forward signs to join Beauden Barrett and Aaron Smith at Steve Hansen's team.
-
@Machpants yuck terrible news
