Ukraine
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Lots of assumptions going on on this thread about what I think. My post had two points, the disturbing stuff was the videos I saw of the terrorists attack and their subsequent capture and torture. (I missed one guy being made to eat his ear thankfully )
As for the Ukraine link, I equally disbelieve the US and Kremlin’s accounts. I believe that someone paid some lackeys that were happy to kill Russians. Whether that was Russia itself, the CIA or Ukraine nobody knows at this point.
It’s interesting the US had intel about this two weeks before and warned Americans in Moscow to avoid concert halls.
That raised my eyebrows.
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Lots of assumptions going on on this thread about what I think. My post had two points, the disturbing stuff was the videos I saw of the terrorists attack and their subsequent capture and torture. (I missed one guy being made to eat his ear thankfully )
As for the Ukraine link, I equally disbelieve the US and Kremlin’s accounts. I believe that someone paid some lackeys that were happy to kill Russians. Whether that was Russia itself, the CIA or Ukraine nobody knows at this point.
It’s interesting the US had intel about this two weeks before and warned Americans in Moscow to avoid concert halls.
That raised my eyebrows.
Why would the Ukrainians do this? Just use your brain. Their goal is to win the war and liberate their country. How on earth does a terrorist attack on a downtown Moscow theatre in any way advance those aims? Honestly some people are so gullible.
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@Billy-Tell said in Ukraine:
Why would the Ukrainians do this?
Maybe because they were told to (why would ISIS do it) I'm not saying it is them but the Ukrainians seem to be just following orders.
And do you really believe the Ukrainian leaders are acting in the countries or people's interests. They have destroyed the country and sacrificed many lives. And for what? Money most likely. War is a profitable business. By selling weapons, corrupt leaders stuffing money in their back pocket and then the corporations dividing up the country when it's all over.
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@MajorRage said in Ukraine:
ISIS claimed it, posted videos of it on their channels and the videos of the arrested are wearing Isis regalia.
That’s enough for me.
There is a difference between fleeing for Ukraine and Ukraine allowing them in.
Maybe wait until the Russians conclude their investigation. Putin and Russia have no reason to lie and claim Ukraine is involved if they aren't. It's not as if they need an excuse to justify war.
Breaking News: #VladimirPutin has suggested that #Ukraine may have aided the #terrorists responsible for the attack on the #Moscow Concert Hall. According to Putin, all four individuals directly involved in the attack, which resulted in the tragic loss of life, have been captured. He mentioned that the perpetrators were heading towards the Ukrainian border, with intelligence indicating that they were likely being facilitated to enter Ukraine by certain individuals within the country.
Putin emphasized that Russian military, emergency services, and investigators are diligently working to uncover the masterminds behind the terrorist assault. Their focus is on identifying those responsible for providing the attackers with transport, weaponry, and any other support they may have received.
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why would ISIS do it
Because Islamic State Khorasan Province (ISKP), who have claimed credit and posted videos, declared Russia a mortal enemy after Putin supported President Bashar al-Assad against them in Syria. They also bombed the St Petersburg metro in 2017 killing 15 people, and the attack in Iran that killed 100 people in Jan of this year.
They have also targeted US interests in Afghanistan and the Middle East - the idea that ISKP is some off-shoot or actor for Ukraine or the evil CIA just doesn't hold water.
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This post is deleted!
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@MajorRage said in Ukraine:
ISIS claimed it, posted videos of it on their channels and the videos of the arrested are wearing Isis regalia.
That’s enough for me.
There is a difference between fleeing for Ukraine and Ukraine allowing them in.
Maybe wait until the Russians conclude their investigation. Putin and Russia have no reason to lie and claim Ukraine is involved if they aren't. It's not as if they need an excuse to justify war.
Breaking News: #VladimirPutin has suggested that #Ukraine may have aided the #terrorists responsible for the attack on the #Moscow Concert Hall. According to Putin, all four individuals directly involved in the attack, which resulted in the tragic loss of life, have been captured. He mentioned that the perpetrators were heading towards the Ukrainian border, with intelligence indicating that they were likely being facilitated to enter Ukraine by certain individuals within the country.
Putin emphasized that Russian military, emergency services, and investigators are
diligently working to uncover the masterminds behind the terrorist assault. creating false evidence to blame the attack on Ukraine. Their focus is on identifying those responsible for providing the attackers with transport, weaponry, and any other support they may have received.Really? The guy who imprisons any one who speaks out against the war in Ukraine, the guy who silences any opposing political rivals..has no reason to lie...
umm how about any opportunity to spread propaganda and lies to excuse their illegal invasion of Ukraine? -
So everything else Russia have claimed is also true
When have I ever said this.
I don't (anymore) see everything based on an ingrained assumption that Russia and Putin (or the Wests promoted enemy) are evil liars. And the West are saint-like and only truth tellers. I wait for the evidence and then try and work it out fairly. As hard as this is.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in Ukraine:
why would ISIS do it
Because Islamic State Khorasan Province (ISKP), who have claimed credit and posted videos, declared Russia a mortal enemy after Putin supported President Bashar al-Assad against them in Syria. They also bombed the St Petersburg metro in 2017 killing 15 people, and the attack in Iran that killed 100 people in Jan of this year.
They have also targeted US interests in Afghanistan and the Middle East - the idea that ISKP is some off-shoot or actor for Ukraine or the evil CIA just doesn't hold water.
But there are counters to this too. I will wait for the evidence.
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@Winger I quoted the post where you said Putin has no reason to lie. So why would he lie anything else?
Putin and Russia have no reason to lie
Why would he lie in this situation. Maybe he would but it seems unlikely.
Putin's just won a massive election victory so has a mandate to do just about anything. And the West are pushing for war (now with troops on the ground in Ukraine) so a Russian false flag in this situation is unlikely. My view in this situation Putin's more likely to want to get to the truth and let the people know.
I will wait for the evidence. Luckily, we can still read both sides too. (this may not last though).
One example
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@Victor-Meldrew said in Ukraine:
I wait for the evidence and then try and work it out fairly. As hard as this is.
It's not hard to work out Putin is a liar, it really isn't.
Western leaders lie too
And sometimes during war its necessary