All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test
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@Crucial said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Crucial said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@mariner4life got some evidence to back that up Mr Smarty-Gif-Mouth
back what up? my reply to your absolute fucking guess that has no fucking basis at all?
Get over yourself
You seem to be guessing that Sotutu is a far more physically dominant player than Savea yourself. I am asking where that assumption comes from.
Nothing to get over. It's one of those fern myths that get said enough times they become true and this one paints a picture of a lightweight 8 that lacks physicality.Not a myth. Great player, but he is a bit underpowered in big physical games, and at the start of games against bigger guys with fresh legs. Often shines late in the game. Probably won't go well against the Saffas, because they are large, and they have pretty much a whole forward pack on the bench. He's like the anti-Samisoni, but for some reason we're using the wrong one of those two from the bench.
Sotutu isn't massively physical either - but he may turn into that, he has been improving. He has a real point of difference with his passing / ball skills.
As for Read not being physical, um what? Sure he was very average for the last few years, but in his early days he was far more powerful a tackler and ball runner than Ardie has ever been or will ever be. Used to absolutely hurl himself into contact. -
@Chris-B said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
It's not really about individuals, it's about the balance of the team.
Rugby is a game of physical dominance and winning the collisions. Up to a point, big men help you do that in every position (for obvious reasons you're not going to play Ben Tameifuna on the wing). If you have too many little men - even in the backs - you're likely to start losing too many collisions - and worst of all losing consecutive collisions.
Same deal applies - according to my theory of rugby - in the loose forwards. You end up with too many collisions where it's big man on medium-sized man - and the medium-sized man doesn't quite have the angle to get his shoulder in perfectly to make his trademark big hit and he loses an extra few inches.
And you keep doing this enough times in the game - eventually the opposition is going to score.
And it's not just in general play. You're giving away a few kgs in the scrum and the maul, you're giving away a few inches at the lineout. And it all matters in the game of inches.
It's why the AB coaches are regularly trying to pack a few more kgs onto their players (to the absolute tipping point where it starts to compromise their performance elsewhere). Those few extra kgs matter.
Our gold standard loose forward trio is Kaino, McCaw, Read. They solved the problems that beset Collins McCaw and Rodney (especially in the lineout - our hookers didn't suddenly learn to throw, we gave them better targets).
I don't believe we're setting a new fashion. I don't believe anyone would pick this new fashion over our gold standard.
We just don't have players of gold standard dimensions (at 6 & 8 ) who are of proven gold standard quality. We re doing the best we can with what we have.
I'll tell you what I do like, though - is Papali'i is pretty close to gold standard quality at 7 - and he's significantly bigger than McCaw!
Go to it!!!
Could he be our?
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I might be a bit dumb but I cannot quite see the concern regarding Dalton at 6.
He Ãs 6' 4" and weighs 113 kg so not a lightweight.
Kaino was 6' 5"and weighed 110 kg
Collins was 6' 3"and weighed 112 kg
Jerry and Jerome were our best two blindsides for many a moon and I know it is how you use your physical attributes in a game as we have seen way too many gifted athletes who disappoint but I reckon Dalton is going to be good. -
@gt12 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
It's not really about individuals, it's about the balance of the team.
Rugby is a game of physical dominance and winning the collisions. Up to a point, big men help you do that in every position (for obvious reasons you're not going to play Ben Tameifuna on the wing). If you have too many little men - even in the backs - you're likely to start losing too many collisions - and worst of all losing consecutive collisions.
Same deal applies - according to my theory of rugby - in the loose forwards. You end up with too many collisions where it's big man on medium-sized man - and the medium-sized man doesn't quite have the angle to get his shoulder in perfectly to make his trademark big hit and he loses an extra few inches.
And you keep doing this enough times in the game - eventually the opposition is going to score.
And it's not just in general play. You're giving away a few kgs in the scrum and the maul, you're giving away a few inches at the lineout. And it all matters in the game of inches.
It's why the AB coaches are regularly trying to pack a few more kgs onto their players (to the absolute tipping point where it starts to compromise their performance elsewhere). Those few extra kgs matter.
Our gold standard loose forward trio is Kaino, McCaw, Read. They solved the problems that beset Collins McCaw and Rodney (especially in the lineout - our hookers didn't suddenly learn to throw, we gave them better targets).
I don't believe we're setting a new fashion. I don't believe anyone would pick this new fashion over our gold standard.
We just don't have players of gold standard dimensions (at 6 & 8 ) who are of proven gold standard quality. We re doing the best we can with what we have.
I'll tell you what I do like, though - is Papali'i is pretty close to gold standard quality at 7 - and he's significantly bigger than McCaw!
Go to it!!!
Could he be our?
that's ridiculously high praise
this dude is one of the best rugby players i have ever seen
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@gt12 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
It's not really about individuals, it's about the balance of the team.
Rugby is a game of physical dominance and winning the collisions. Up to a point, big men help you do that in every position (for obvious reasons you're not going to play Ben Tameifuna on the wing). If you have too many little men - even in the backs - you're likely to start losing too many collisions - and worst of all losing consecutive collisions.
Same deal applies - according to my theory of rugby - in the loose forwards. You end up with too many collisions where it's big man on medium-sized man - and the medium-sized man doesn't quite have the angle to get his shoulder in perfectly to make his trademark big hit and he loses an extra few inches.
And you keep doing this enough times in the game - eventually the opposition is going to score.
And it's not just in general play. You're giving away a few kgs in the scrum and the maul, you're giving away a few inches at the lineout. And it all matters in the game of inches.
It's why the AB coaches are regularly trying to pack a few more kgs onto their players (to the absolute tipping point where it starts to compromise their performance elsewhere). Those few extra kgs matter.
Our gold standard loose forward trio is Kaino, McCaw, Read. They solved the problems that beset Collins McCaw and Rodney (especially in the lineout - our hookers didn't suddenly learn to throw, we gave them better targets).
I don't believe we're setting a new fashion. I don't believe anyone would pick this new fashion over our gold standard.
We just don't have players of gold standard dimensions (at 6 & 8 ) who are of proven gold standard quality. We re doing the best we can with what we have.
I'll tell you what I do like, though - is Papali'i is pretty close to gold standard quality at 7 - and he's significantly bigger than McCaw!
Go to it!!!
Could he be our?
that's ridiculously high praise
this dude is one of the best rugby players i have ever seen
I don't know if Dalton has quite that potential, and is a more traditional 7, but fuck it, I'll take any opportunity to post a photo of this guy and remind the world that some of the absolute best didn't wear black jerseys.
My absolute favorite non-AB player ever.
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@gt12 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@gt12 said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
It's not really about individuals, it's about the balance of the team.
Rugby is a game of physical dominance and winning the collisions. Up to a point, big men help you do that in every position (for obvious reasons you're not going to play Ben Tameifuna on the wing). If you have too many little men - even in the backs - you're likely to start losing too many collisions - and worst of all losing consecutive collisions.
Same deal applies - according to my theory of rugby - in the loose forwards. You end up with too many collisions where it's big man on medium-sized man - and the medium-sized man doesn't quite have the angle to get his shoulder in perfectly to make his trademark big hit and he loses an extra few inches.
And you keep doing this enough times in the game - eventually the opposition is going to score.
And it's not just in general play. You're giving away a few kgs in the scrum and the maul, you're giving away a few inches at the lineout. And it all matters in the game of inches.
It's why the AB coaches are regularly trying to pack a few more kgs onto their players (to the absolute tipping point where it starts to compromise their performance elsewhere). Those few extra kgs matter.
Our gold standard loose forward trio is Kaino, McCaw, Read. They solved the problems that beset Collins McCaw and Rodney (especially in the lineout - our hookers didn't suddenly learn to throw, we gave them better targets).
I don't believe we're setting a new fashion. I don't believe anyone would pick this new fashion over our gold standard.
We just don't have players of gold standard dimensions (at 6 & 8 ) who are of proven gold standard quality. We re doing the best we can with what we have.
I'll tell you what I do like, though - is Papali'i is pretty close to gold standard quality at 7 - and he's significantly bigger than McCaw!
Go to it!!!
Could he be our?
that's ridiculously high praise
this dude is one of the best rugby players i have ever seen
I don't know if Dalton has quite that potential, and is a more traditional 7, but fuck it, I'll take any opportunity to post a photo of this guy and remind the world that some of the absolute best didn't wear black jerseys.
My absolute favorite non-AB player ever.
absolute weapon. starts at 6 in my All Time XV
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@Jimmy-Jimmy said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
I might be a bit dumb but I cannot quite see the concern regarding Dalton at 6.
He Ãs 6' 4" and weighs 113 kg so not a lightweight.
Kaino was 6' 5"and weighed 110 kg
Collins was 6' 3"and weighed 112 kg
Jerry and Jerome were our best two blindsides for many a moon and I know it is how you use your physical attributes in a game as we have seen way too many gifted athletes who disappoint but I reckon Dalton is going to be good.i dont think there is concern about DP at 6 in isolation, more just the balance with the others and the idea of playing 3 guys who's choice choice is / was 7
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@Duluth said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Not going to lie, I'm quite pleased with that given the unavailable list. An opportunity for 80% of the tight five to go again. Dalton to get a deserved start so that's two people with a huge defensive workrate and effectiveness. Ardie to do what he does in the second half. Possibility of another card for Scott. A settled backline that will thrive in dry conditions although I suspect that's a more a reflection of forced selections rather than the brains trust opting to not change what clearly worked well at Eden Park.
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@mariner4life who the fuck is he? Yes, I can be ignorant to non ABs.
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@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@mariner4life who the fuck is he? Yes, I can be ignorant to non ABs.
dude
Juan Smith
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Crazy-Horse said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@mariner4life who the fuck is he? Yes, I can be ignorant to non ABs.
dude
Juan Smith
At least I recognise the name!
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@Donsteppa said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
I'm slightly surprised that they haven't gone with Cane at 6 and Papalii at 7, but my brain is probably too old school on that one.
They could end up playing more left and right (particularly from scrums) than openside/blindside.
Papalii is bigger and taller than O’Mahony.
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Ireland: Hugo Keenan, Mack Hansen, Garry Ringrose, Robbie Henshaw, James Lowe, Johnny Sexton (c), Jamison Gibson-Park; Caelan Doris, Josh van der Flier, Peter O’Mahony, James Ryan, Tadhg Beirne, Tadhg Furlong, Dan Sheehan, Andrew Porter. Reserves: Rob Herring, Cian Healy, Finlay Bealham, Kieran Treadwell, Jack Conan, Conor Murray, Joey Carbery, Bundee Aki.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/international/129206299/ireland-captain-johnny-sexton-named-to-start-second-all-blacks-test-despite-concussion-controversy -
@Daffy-Jaffy said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Ireland: Hugo Keenan, Mack Hansen, Garry Ringrose, Robbie Henshaw, James Lowe, Johnny Sexton (c), Jamison Gibson-Park; Caelan Doris, Josh van der Flier, Peter O’Mahony, James Ryan, Tadhg Beirne, Tadhg Furlong, Dan Sheehan, Andrew Porter. Reserves: Rob Herring, Cian Healy, Finlay Bealham, Kieran Treadwell, Jack Conan, Conor Murray, Joey Carbery, Bundee Aki.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/international/129206299/ireland-captain-johnny-sexton-named-to-start-second-all-blacks-test-despite-concussion-controversyI'm way too lazy, any changes?
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@chimoaus said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
@Daffy-Jaffy said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
Ireland: Hugo Keenan, Mack Hansen, Garry Ringrose, Robbie Henshaw, James Lowe, Johnny Sexton (c), Jamison Gibson-Park; Caelan Doris, Josh van der Flier, Peter O’Mahony, James Ryan, Tadhg Beirne, Tadhg Furlong, Dan Sheehan, Andrew Porter. Reserves: Rob Herring, Cian Healy, Finlay Bealham, Kieran Treadwell, Jack Conan, Conor Murray, Joey Carbery, Bundee Aki.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/international/129206299/ireland-captain-johnny-sexton-named-to-start-second-all-blacks-test-despite-concussion-controversyI'm way too lazy, any changes?
Only 3 changes - wing (Hansen), reserve hooker (Herring) and reserve prop (Bealham)
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@nzzp said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
How the hell do you play someone who came off for an HIA?
Ireland are not covering themselves in head-injury glory on this tour.
It seems a bit confusing but from my understanding they have 3 HIA tests, the first one in the changing rooms which he apears to have failed. But on subsequent tests 2 and 3 he passed so is deemed a non-concussion? And therefore, can play. I think most teams give players a stand down regardless but that is what I picked up from the interview with Farrell.
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@Jimmy-Jimmy said in All Blacks v Ireland - 2nd Test:
I might be a bit dumb but I cannot quite see the concern regarding Dalton at 6.
He Ãs 6' 4" and weighs 113 kg so not a lightweight.
Kaino was 6' 5"and weighed 110 kg
Collins was 6' 3"and weighed 112 kg
Jerry and Jerome were our best two blindsides for many a moon and I know it is how you use your physical attributes in a game as we have seen way too many gifted athletes who disappoint but I reckon Dalton is going to be good.There's no way peak Jerome Kaino was 110kg. We picked him as a lock - you can't have a guy who weighs the same as a decent sized openside flanker locking an AB scrum. As it turned out, you can't even have Jerome.
As above the Jerry, Rodney Richie trio lacked some height and throughout that era our lineout was a bit vulnerable. .
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I’m expecting Ireland to target our line out. Are Dalton & Ardie genuine options at this level??
