AB Props
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@booboo Yes, that 2017 U20 team was very good. Captained by Jacobson. The other starting loose forwards were Papalii and Mikaele-Tu'u. Clarke scored tries for fun.
The same exercise for U20 props:
2021 - Joe Gavigan, Sione Ahio, Jack Sexton, Luca Inch, Josh Fusitua
2020 - Hamdahn Tuipulotu, Benet Kumeroa, Finlay Brewis, Tamaiti Williams, Fletcher Newell, Thomas Edwards, Jimmy Roots, Saula Mau
2019 - George Dyer, Fletcher Newell, Ollie Norris, Kaliopasi Uluilakepa, Tamaiti Williams
2018 - Sione Asi, Rob Cobb, Tevita Mafileo, Xavier Numia, Kaliopasi Uluilakepa
2017 - Ryan Coxon, Tim Farrell, Alex Fidow, Ezekiel Lindenmuth, Pouri Rakete-Stones, (Harry Allen)
2016 - Ayden Johnstone, Shaun Stodart, Sean Paranihi, Alex Fidow, Sosefo KautaiAs with the 1st 5s, only a wider training squad was selected in 2020.
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I just don't understand the buzz around Newell. He was rated behind Olli Jager in the Canterbury starting XV and when he was on the field, he did not set the world on fire.
Williams, on the other hand, was powerful in the loose but struggled at scrum time when he was used on the tight head side. Looks a specialist LH IMO.
You must field very big props against the best nations. At least, they can compete physically in the loose.
For the next RWC, I'd like to see a combination of De Groot (or Hodgman) - Taukei'aho - Lomax. ST is already ready, Hodgman and Lomax have to step up significantly next year.I’m not quite on the bandwagon, but there are some very good technical things Newell does which is a positive sign for the future. Not surprising that he was behind Jager given Jager’s experience and all round play.
Sami has long term AB written all over him. Size, skill and temperament. I think we need to see more of DeGroot before making a proper assessment. There is a good base for Hodgman to springboard from.
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@booboo Yes, that 2017 U20 team was very good. Captained by Jacobson. The other starting loose forwards were Papalii and Mikaele-Tu'u. Clarke scored tries for fun.
The same exercise for U20 props:
2021 - Joe Gavigan, Sione Ahio, Jack Sexton, Luca Inch, Josh Fusitua
2020 - Hamdahn Tuipulotu, Benet Kumeroa, Finlay Brewis, Tamaiti Williams, Fletcher Newell, Thomas Edwards, Jimmy Roots, Saula Mau
2019 - George Dyer, Fletcher Newell, Ollie Norris, Kaliopasi Uluilakepa, Tamaiti Williams
2018 - Sione Asi, Rob Cobb, Tevita Mafileo, Xavier Numia, Kaliopasi Uluilakepa
2017 - Ryan Coxon, Tim Farrell, Alex Fidow, Ezekiel Lindenmuth, Pouri Rakete-Stones, (Harry Allen)
2016 - Ayden Johnstone, Shaun Stodart, Sean Paranihi, Alex Fidow, Sosefo KautaiAs with the 1st 5s, only a wider training squad was selected in 2020.
Three years there where basically none of them have gone on to do anything. A few of them are at the Canes but hardly making waves.
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@chimoaus I feel that the best ball running props end up at hooker, providing they can throw (at least to some degree). Then you have guys like Tupou who are natural props but have that explosive running game.
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What's the word on the new Highlander's prop Saula Ma'u?
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Jeez I hope Tosi comes along further at prop, a beast with ball in hand, still raw and young, if he ever did become a hooker it would be Aleki Lutui style
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Is Karl T really 135kg? He doesn't look that much heavier than De Groot there (supposedly 122kg)?
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@paekakboyz said in AB Props:
@chimoaus I feel that the best ball running props end up at hooker, providing they can throw (at least to some degree). Then you have guys like Tupou who are natural props but have that explosive running game.
by natural prop do you mean his body shape? As Tupou was always an explosive runner, I understand, I thought his propping was (least a few years ago) a work in progress..
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Oh, now they have to do it.
How about a few years ago?Geez I didn’t think Owen Franks mediocrity around the field would ever be topped but here we are.
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@nostrildamus a mix of body shape and having that scrummaging attitude
I know hookers are a key part of the front row but there is just something about propping ha ha. It's a lot of fun if you can match the other fulla in strength and technique. Even better if you are ahead on one or both! -
@nostrildamus conversely, Laulala who looks similar is supposedly only 116kg....De Groot looks a bit more an athlete in that pic though, taller and more muscular.
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@machpants said in AB Props:
I just watched second test versus Wales in 2016, the props there passed it otherwise made use of the ball in open play more times in a half than the '21 versions did all year. Even Owen Frank's acted often at first receiver
It was an effective game plan. Using one of our tight forwards in that role.
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Please may we rename this AB Porps?
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I can't see the ABs winning the next RWC with the current starting props. Moody and Laulala have been great servants of NZ rugby but the game has evolved and they are clearly past it. The only solution is to keep faith in De Groot and Tyrell Lomax, and give thme the starting spots in every important AB game for the next two years before the RWC. They are still young and have the required qualities to develop into world class props. I hope Atu Moli will be back soon as he could be in the mix too.
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I can't see the ABs winning the next RWC with the current starting props. Moody and Laulala have been great servants of NZ rugby but the game has evolved and they are clearly past it. The only solution is to keep faith in De Groot and Tyrell Lomax, and give thme the starting spots in every important AB game for the next two years before the RWC. They are still young and have the required qualities to develop into world class props. I hope Atu Moli will be back soon as he could be in the mix too.
I don't think the game has evolved for props as much as they've devolved, moody had great hands at the 2015 RWC. They've gone backwards and everyone else is up to where our props used to be
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@nostrildamus said in AB Props:
Is Karl T really 135kg? He doesn't look that much heavier than De Groot there (supposedly 122kg)?
this has shades of Ardie's height all over again
