Other Cricket
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@mn5 said in Other Cricket:
More than enough to skittle our pathetic line up though, Christ on a bike what dark days those were.
Once Crowe and Cairns went down after the first test that batting order became mighty short.
The pop gun pace attack sticks out for me; Watson, Su'a, de Grown, early Simon Doull all getting a run that series.
We the came home and legends like Michael Owens, Heath David and Kerry Walmsley fill in while Cairns and Nash are in and out with injury.
Hard times.
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@rotated said in Other Cricket:
@mn5 said in Other Cricket:
More than enough to skittle our pathetic line up though, Christ on a bike what dark days those were.
Once Crowe and Cairns went down after the first test that batting order became mighty short.
The pop gun pace attack sticks out for me; Watson, Su'a, de Grown, early Simon Doull all getting a run that series.
We the came home and legends like Michael Owens, Heath David and Kerry Walmsley fill in while Cairns and Nash are in and out with injury.
Hard times.
Very harsh assessment on the bowlers. The batsmen got off easy !
Jones stands out like Bradman compared to those turkeys. Him and Doull were about the only ones remotely near the top echelon of top NZ players. Greatbatch and Morrison were decent in patches, the rest were absolute journeymen.
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@godder said in Other Cricket:
Harris was the epitome of the phenomenon who just couldn't make it in test cricket. One of our greatest ODI players and fielders, and he was putting up monster first class 4 day batting figures, but he just couldn't do it in tests.
Yeah his first class batting stats indicate that he should have done considerably better at test level. But then again he was a bit of a “here and there” all rounder at ODI level too.
Terrific fielder but that alone doesn’t make you a legend.
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@mn5 said in Other Cricket:
@godder said in Other Cricket:
Harris was the epitome of the phenomenon who just couldn't make it in test cricket. One of our greatest ODI players and fielders, and he was putting up monster first class 4 day batting figures, but he just couldn't do it in tests.
Yeah his first class batting stats indicate that he should have done considerably better at test level. But then again he was a bit of a “here and there” all rounder at ODI level too.
Terrific fielder but that alone doesn’t make you a legend.
I don't understand the "but" in regards to how it relates to the first sentence? What are you meaning?
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@rapido said in Other Cricket:
@mn5 said in Other Cricket:
@godder said in Other Cricket:
Harris was the epitome of the phenomenon who just couldn't make it in test cricket. One of our greatest ODI players and fielders, and he was putting up monster first class 4 day batting figures, but he just couldn't do it in tests.
Yeah his first class batting stats indicate that he should have done considerably better at test level. But then again he was a bit of a “here and there” all rounder at ODI level too.
Terrific fielder but that alone doesn’t make you a legend.
I don't understand the "but" in regards to how it relates to the first sentence? What are you meaning?
Fuck knows, it pays not to analyse my posts on here too much.
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4th Test underway between England and India at the Oval. I keep expecting India to relent and include Ashwin, but as the Cricinfo preview and then S K Warne put it:
Once is a mistake. Twice is a choice. Three times is a habit. Will India really leave R Ashwin out for the fourth Test in a row?
Ishant Sharma is left out and Ashwin continues to miss out. "Stubborn," is Warne's assessment. "I would have played Ashwin. You don't pick a side just for the first innings - it will turn - and he's got five Test hundreds."
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Recently retired Dale Steyn was certainly some bowler and an absolute all time great. That average was as good as anyone’s in an era where batting averages of 50+ were far more common. He looked like an unhinged psycho too which always helps.
Top ten fast bowlers of all time ? Yeah I’d say so. Others ( purely off the top of my head and factoring ability/longevity ) include our own Paddles, Marshall, Ambrose, Akram, Younis, Imran……Lillee……McGrath…..
Any glaring omissions ?
Really good bowlers like Walsh, Anderson, Donald, Garner, Holding, Roberts, Croft, Bishop might miss out, just not as good or in some cases their careers weren’t long enough.
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Good to see England remembering that they’re actually not a very good team
Jadeja batting five….interesting, decent enough average but just the one hundred and as a bowler his record speaks for itself.
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You’re right. We are actually not very good. Our batting line up consists of Joe Root and we keep picking “samey” bowlers (Anderson aside), that look good in the right conditions but without any help from the pitch or some swing, are little more than trundlers. Oh and we manage to drop a fuck tonne of catches too.
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@catogrande said in Other Cricket:
You’re right. We are actually not very good. Our batting line up consists of Joe Root and we keep picking “samey” bowlers (Anderson aside), that look good in the right conditions but without any help from the pitch or some swing, are little more than trundlers. Oh and we manage to drop a fuck tonne of catches too.
Do you reckon England’s recent obsession with the “hundred” is to blame ? As you say Joe Root aside ( who’s form of late has been incredible ) who is a genuine test class batsman ? There’s no one even close to such fine recent players like Cook, Collingwood, Bell etc to dig them out if Root fails which he will every now and again. But then this is exactly what could happen to the BCs in a few years so I’m enjoying our success which as a long suffering fan I have earnt.
I genuinely think Australia are a good chance to hammer them 5-0 in the Ashes this year.
Here’s an interesting stat for you all, our boy Dan Vettori has taken more test wickets than any English spinner. Quite amazing when you look at our history compared to Englands.
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@mn5 said in Other Cricket:
Recently retired Dale Steyn was certainly some bowler and an absolute all time great. That average was as good as anyone’s in an era where batting averages of 50+ were far more common. He looked like an unhinged psycho too which always helps.
Top ten fast bowlers of all time ? Yeah I’d say so. Others ( purely off the top of my head and factoring ability/longevity ) include our own Paddles, Marshall, Ambrose, Akram, Younis, Imran……Lillee……McGrath…..
Any glaring omissions ?
Really good bowlers like Walsh, Anderson, Donald, Garner, Holding, Roberts, Croft, Bishop might miss out, just not as good or in some cases their careers weren’t long enough.
To take the other side of the rugby conversation
- there's a bunch of guys prior to Lillee - Sid Barnes, Fred Trueman, Frank Tyson, Ray Lindwall, Keith Miller.Jeff Thomson probably fits into the bunch of really good guys who might miss out, but at his peak he would have been as tough to face as anyone and might have been the fastest.
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@chris-b said in Other Cricket:
@mn5 said in Other Cricket:
Recently retired Dale Steyn was certainly some bowler and an absolute all time great. That average was as good as anyone’s in an era where batting averages of 50+ were far more common. He looked like an unhinged psycho too which always helps.
Top ten fast bowlers of all time ? Yeah I’d say so. Others ( purely off the top of my head and factoring ability/longevity ) include our own Paddles, Marshall, Ambrose, Akram, Younis, Imran……Lillee……McGrath…..
Any glaring omissions ?
Really good bowlers like Walsh, Anderson, Donald, Garner, Holding, Roberts, Croft, Bishop might miss out, just not as good or in some cases their careers weren’t long enough.
To take the other side of the rugby conversation
- there's a bunch of guys prior to Lillee - Sid Barnes, Fred Trueman, Frank Tyson, Ray Lindwall, Keith Miller.Jeff Thomson probably fits into the bunch of really good guys who might miss out, but at his peak he would have been as tough to face as anyone and might have been the fastest.
Yeah all those real old timers had bloody good records, add Millers batting in as well and you’ve got a sensational player. One of the GOAT.
Thomson’s aura definitely exceeds his record, I think once he slowed down he became much easier to handle. 200 wickets at 28.00 isn’t that incredible for someone being talked of in this conversation. Our own Southee and Boult have taken considerably more wickets at around the same average and whilst they’re both kiwi greats no one is gonna mention them amongst the best of their generation.
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@chris-b said in Other Cricket:
@mn5 Yeah -Thommo was never the same after he injured his shoulder (colliding with a teammate), so his peak was probably only a couple of years - and really maybe just one series against England.
Same thing with Andrew Flintoff, Amazing in an Ashes series or two but otherwise kinda ordinary.
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@mn5 said in Other Cricket:
@chris-b said in Other Cricket:
@mn5 Yeah -Thommo was never the same after he injured his shoulder (colliding with a teammate), so his peak was probably only a couple of years - and really maybe just one series against England.
Same thing with Andrew Flintoff, Amazing in an Ashes series or two but otherwise kinda ordinary.
Good point. Both had their moments when they were sensational but either not consistent enough or durable enough.
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All out for 17 in a World Cup qualification international. Is that a new world international record set? Did New Zealand finally lose their longstanding record tonight? Could have been touch and go when the number 9 got into stride and scored 3. The rest of the team only scored 4 between them. Some Immaculate bowling it seems.
