Michael Jones
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@snowy said in Michael Jones:
@no-quarter said in Michael Jones:
Never saw Jones play live
You missed out.
@no-quarter said in Michael Jones:
there's no doubt in my mind McCaw was the superior player
Why? Not having a go, but why no doubt? Jones was way ahead of his time as was Richie. Richie was prone to mis-handle at times, MJ not so much. Both read the game superbly and and were in the right places when they needed to be.
I'm intrigued as to the reasoning? One player you saw a lot of the other not so much?
You took my comment too seriously grumpy old man, tongue firmly in cheek 🙂
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this thread is hilarious. Michael Jones is one of the very best rugby players NZ has ever produced. Any comment to the negative is clearly tongue in cheek. There is just nothing you can say about a guy who changed the game in one position. And then was fucking awesome in another playing a different way
wait, yes, there is one thing. If you played on Sundays we win the '91 World Cup. Poor form Michael.
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@no-quarter said in Michael Jones:
Never saw Jones play live but there's no doubt in my mind McCaw was the superior player
Saw them both play live lots and there’s no doubt in my mind MJ was the superior player. McCaw greater AB though no question.
I’m with @mariner4life MJ definitely loses points for his no Sundays stance.
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@taniwharugby said in Michael Jones:
@snowy I think they were different players, obviously different eras too, and I've never been a fan of comparing players spanning eras.
MJ was supremely talented
McCaw was so incredibly focussed and hard workingBoth outstanding players that sit at the top of the tree as some of the best ever, if I had to choose, I'd probably lean to McCaw.
Yeah, I said much the same thing earlier re their individual attributes and differences. McCaw also was a leader and Captain, MJ was a pretty quiet bloke (he seems to have come out of his shell now) but could have been a bit different on the field with his team mates.
MJ solely as a player which is why I was questioning @No-Quarter 's reasoning. Just straight out catching, passing, running, defense, pilfers, etc. Mj edges it for me.
Hmmm, decisions, decisions. McCaw due to longevity (well, tests played in total) and leadership.
Oh @No-Quarter I don't take anything a millennial says seriously, absolutely nothing to be gained.
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@mariner4life said in Michael Jones:
wait, yes, there is one thing. If you played on Sundays we win the '91 World Cup. Poor form Michael.
That could sway opinions.
(we weren't that good in '91 though)
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@snowy said in Michael Jones:
@taniwharugby said in Michael Jones:
@snowy I think they were different players, obviously different eras too, and I've never been a fan of comparing players spanning eras.
MJ was supremely talented
McCaw was so incredibly focussed and hard workingBoth outstanding players that sit at the top of the tree as some of the best ever, if I had to choose, I'd probably lean to McCaw.
Yeah, I said much the same thing earlier re their individual attributes and differences. McCaw also was a leader and Captain, MJ was a pretty quiet bloke (he seems to have come out of his shell now) but could have been a bit different on the field with his team mates.
MJ solely as a player which is why I was questioning @No-Quarter 's reasoning. Just straight out catching, passing, running, defense, pilfers, etc. Mj edges it for me.
Hmmm, decisions, decisions. McCaw due to longevity (well, tests played in total) and leadership.
Oh @No-Quarter I don't take anything a millennial says seriously, absolutely nothing to be gained.
That's where I sit as well. Skills wise MJ is one of a kind.
McCaw has the greatest will of any player I've seen play. He started with weaknesses (mainly handling) but turned that into a strength, to the degree he was taking kickoffs.
Add in his leadership, he's one of the first players you'd put on a Greatest AB team. We got wins from him refusing to lose.
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who is on the "AB Mt Rushmore" could be a good thread
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@mariner4life said in Michael Jones:
who is on the "AB Mt Rushmore" could be a good thread
Oh,oh,oh. Shit fight.
Actually both of these guys probably make it with Meads and Carter.
I've missed out heaps.
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@snowy said in Michael Jones:
@mariner4life said in Michael Jones:
who is on the "AB Mt Rushmore" could be a good thread
Oh,oh,oh. Shit fight.
Actually both of these guys probably make it with Meads and Carter.
I've missed out heaps.
the old fuckers here will come for us hard
I reckon only Richie and Meads are locked in, everyone else will be a fucking shitfight.
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@mariner4life said in Michael Jones:
@snowy said in Michael Jones:
@mariner4life said in Michael Jones:
who is on the "AB Mt Rushmore" could be a good thread
Oh,oh,oh. Shit fight.
Actually both of these guys probably make it with Meads and Carter.
I've missed out heaps.
the old fuckers here will come for us hard
I reckon only Richie and Meads are locked in, everyone else will be a fucking shitfight.
Carter and Jones are easily locked in too. Same with Lomu.
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@billy-tell said in Michael Jones:
[edit -split fromt he Highlanders thread]
Dunno why, as medical treatment has improved, but I remain scarred by Michael jones vs Argentina. Each time there is a knee injury I think « career in jeopardy ». Jones came back but he was never as good.
Was playing really well at 9 imo. Gutted and I’m not even a highlanders fan.
It's chalk and cheese honestly, tearing your ACL in the 90s was basically a career ender. The (public) knowledge back when Jones did his knee injury was such that I don't think they even reported which ligament it was! It was just a "knee injury". The advancement of sports medicine has been phenomenal.
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@frye said in Michael Jones:
@billy-tell said in Michael Jones:
[edit -split fromt he Highlanders thread]
Dunno why, as medical treatment has improved, but I remain scarred by Michael jones vs Argentina. Each time there is a knee injury I think « career in jeopardy ». Jones came back but he was never as good.
Was playing really well at 9 imo. Gutted and I’m not even a highlanders fan.
It's chalk and cheese honestly, tearing your ACL in the 90s was basically a career ender. The (public) knowledge back when Jones did his knee injury was such that I don't think they even reported which ligament it was! It was just a "knee injury". The advancement of sports medicine has been phenomenal.
I believe they mentioned at the time (this is my memory of it) that his knee was so badly injured it was bending left to right as well. It was a big deal he came back so quickly, over his career he recovered from injuries in super quick time.
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@kirwan said in Michael Jones:
@mariner4life said in Michael Jones:
@snowy said in Michael Jones:
@mariner4life said in Michael Jones:
who is on the "AB Mt Rushmore" could be a good thread
Oh,oh,oh. Shit fight.
Actually both of these guys probably make it with Meads and Carter.
I've missed out heaps.
the old fuckers here will come for us hard
I reckon only Richie and Meads are locked in, everyone else will be a fucking shitfight.
Carter and Jones are easily locked in too. Same with Lomu.
there are like 4 faces on Rushmore. You are already at 5.
Nepia, Whineray, Lochore there are some black and white dudes that deserve serious consideration
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@mariner4life said in Michael Jones:
who is on the "AB Mt Rushmore" could be a good thread
Gallaher, Meads, Lomu, McCaw IMHO.
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@mariner4life it would be a cliff profile of loosies and a couple of locks..(Jonah would have his own rockface)..
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@nostrildamus said in Michael Jones:
loosies and a couple of locks
because they are the only real players on the whole paddock
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@mariner4life only prob is we need a prop at either end!
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@bovidae said in Michael Jones:
Gallaher or Nepia for the pre-WWII ABs.
Apparently Maurice Brownlue was the Meads of his day so he would be in contention.
Re: MJ, I saw him play his worst game ever live. It was at Wanganui for the NZXV, can’t quite remember the opposition, but he was straight up terrible. Missed tackles, missed line outs, had hands like Kronfeld etc etc. That was the day I realised he was human and not a god (uh, he’d hate me saying he was godlike due to sky fairy beliefs).
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@paekakboyz said in Michael Jones:
@victor-meldrew so dare I say it... a bit of an Ardie? or more accurately is Ardie a bit of a Jones?
I reckon a modern day MJ would resemble an even better version of Ardie.
I started playing rugby in 1987 and as a flanker MJ was my hero. He just seemed to be everywhere and scored some amazing tries by being the ultimate support player. I think that’s why I don’t rate Pocock, because MJ showed that a great flanker should be able to be everywhere and do anything- not just steal pill.
I didn’t think he would be surpassed but imho McCaw was just on another level. It’s probably the different eras and probably impossible to compare players but McCaw just seemed to have a greater impact on the game. He obviously didn’t have the athleticism of MJ but his involvement in games was ridiculous. I’ve been watching some Bledisloe games on Stan recently that I missed while overseas. This is during the rather shitty era of 2008-2009. All I can say is that McCaw was an absolute freak and without him we would have been even more farked.
Despite the Sunday thing infuriating me at the time and still finding it rather ridiculous, I feel it says a lot about MJs character. I bet it hurt bad watching all those tests from the stands but he made a promise and stuck to it. Respect for that.
