Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?
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@canefan said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
I think we've won two world cups since the Blues made the playoffs?
Ha ha! You may have the makings of a good conspiracy theory there...
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@DaGrubster said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
The NZR should remove the international coaching requirement/nice to have as it has contributed to the coaching drain, which is hurting as just as much, if not more, than the player drain. Bar robertson and Handsen, all the best NZ coaches are overseas now.
Isn't this year the perfect example of why the NZRU supports coaches doing extended OEs?
Gatland and Schmidt are turning down big dollar extensions with top 5 test playing nations to return to NZ with 11 and 8 years of international coaching experience between them. Neither were remotely close to an AB coaching candidate prior to leaving, and now both are viable options.
Very happy for these guys to take their lumps elsewhere .
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@rotated said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
@DaGrubster said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
The NZR should remove the international coaching requirement/nice to have as it has contributed to the coaching drain, which is hurting as just as much, if not more, than the player drain. Bar robertson and Handsen, all the best NZ coaches are overseas now.
Isn't this year the perfect example of why the NZRU supports coaches doing extended OEs?
Gatland and Schmidt are turning down big dollar extensions with top 5 test playing nations to return to NZ with 11 and 8 years of international coaching experience between them. Neither were remotely close to an AB coaching candidate prior to leaving, and now both are viable options.
Very happy for these guys to take their lumps elsewhere .
Whilst not being "remotely close" 11 and 8 years ago who knows what they may have achieved if they had stayed in NZ rugby and had success at Super and NPC level.
Gatland has been in the conversation for a looong time. Schmidt probably only the last two years.
This introduction to "the conversation" may have been amplified by being in the international eye. But if they had had the same success as Razor at domestic level I'm sure they'd be being talked about anyway.
Coukd live with either. Preference perhaps Gats, even if the rest of the world hates us enough already. But I really kinda like tge idea of Razor.
He's got to get a haircut though. It's turning into a combover.
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@booboo said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
Whilst not being "remotely close" 11 and 8 years ago who knows what they may have achieved if they had stayed in NZ rugby and had success at Super and NPC level.
Hard getting coaching gigs here - you're up against former all black bias (JK, Hammett, Tana). Not convinced they'll get a fair crack necessarily
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@nzzp said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
@booboo said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
Whilst not being "remotely close" 11 and 8 years ago who knows what they may have achieved if they had stayed in NZ rugby and had success at Super and NPC level.
Hard getting coaching gigs here - you're up against former all black bias (JK, Hammett, Tana). Not convinced they'll get a fair crack necessarily
You can't tell me they couldn't do as a good a job or better than those three, Cooper or MacDonald to date
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@Chris-B said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
@Nepia If they're going to change the Crusaders' name, I wonder if they'd consider "The Hammers"?
The psychological advantage would be worth two wins a season over the Hurricanes!
The Hammers with Hammeteur at the helm - you've heard of the fall of the Roman empire right? It's all falling it to place.
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@nzzp said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
@booboo said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
Whilst not being "remotely close" 11 and 8 years ago who knows what they may have achieved if they had stayed in NZ rugby and had success at Super and NPC level.
Hard getting coaching gigs here - you're up against former all black bias (JK, Hammett, Tana). Not convinced they'll get a fair crack necessarily
That shouldn't hinder Gats then.
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@nzzp Gatland was an AB
@booboo You've omitted Gatland's time coaching Ireland so over 13 seasons in total plus two Lions tours. I doubt there has ever been a more experienced candidate for AB coach.
How have ex Wales coaches gone before?
I think Foster will get the gig barring a meltdown in Japan.
How do he and Gatland get along?
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@dogmeat hopefully well.
Being a former AB certainly gets your foot in the door much further than if you were not.
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@taniwharugby yet in the professional era there have been 5 RWC cycles only one of which (Smith/Mitchell) had an ex AB in charge. Non AB's have led us to two World Cups and a first ever series win in SA
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sorry, I meant just in general, not specifically the top job...I mean look at how often former ABs are fast tracked at M10/Super level, although I think NZR may have seen this isnt ideal and most are following a path through M10, U21, super now....
Some still work thier way up through the ranks (Razor is a good example) but those who have not been ABs have to prove thier worth just that bit more.
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@nzzp said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
@booboo said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
Whilst not being "remotely close" 11 and 8 years ago who knows what they may have achieved if they had stayed in NZ rugby and had success at Super and NPC level.
Hard getting coaching gigs here - you're up against former all black bias (JK, Hammett, Tana). Not convinced they'll get a fair crack necessarily
Warren Gatland ...
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@dogmeat said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
@nzzp Gatland was an AB
@booboo You've omitted Gatland's time coaching Ireland so over 13 seasons in total plus two Lions tours. I doubt there has ever been a more experienced candidate for AB coach.
How have ex Wales coaches gone before?
I think Foster will get the gig barring a meltdown in Japan.
How do he and Gatland get along?
I was referencing the qwuoted post as correct.
What? You want me to check my facts?
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@dogmeat said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
@taniwharugby yet in the professional era there have been 5 RWC cycles only one of which (Smith/Mitchell) had an ex AB in charge. Non AB's have led us to two World Cups and a first ever series win in SA
One (I'm pretty sure ... I'm not checking) wasn't even a first class player.
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@dogmeat said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
@taniwharugby yet in the professional era there have been 5 RWC cycles only one of which (Smith/Mitchell) had an ex AB in charge. Non AB's have led us to two World Cups and a first ever series win in SA
What does that tell you about the wisdom of picking ex-players and ignoring coaches that have worked their way up through the ranks? Out of Super rugby winning NZ coaches of recent times, there have been as many non ABs (Rennie, Boyd) as ABs (Razor, Jamie Joseph). Lots of ex-ABs have coached and flopped in the meantime
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@Nepia said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
@Chris-B said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
@Nepia If they're going to change the Crusaders' name, I wonder if they'd consider "The Hammers"?
The psychological advantage would be worth two wins a season over the Hurricanes!
The Hammers with Hammeteur at the helm - you've heard of the fall of the Roman empire right? It's all falling it to place.
We'll never get Hammer now that the Chiefs and the ABs have him in their sights!
We could also run with the Toddies - should be good for an IRB subsidy or two!
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@taniwharugby said in Who does TSF want to be the next AB coach?:
sorry, I meant just in general, not specifically the top job...I mean look at how often former ABs are fast tracked at M10/Super level, although I think NZR may have seen this isnt ideal and most are following a path through M10, U21, super now....
Some still work thier way up through the ranks (Razor is a good example) but those who have not been ABs have to prove thier worth just that bit more.
Is he though? Rob Penny had a similar resume over longer and got absolutely nowhere near a Super role. Rennie, had a slightly different path but again was made to wait for far too long.
That is not to say that these ex-ABs didn't have solid resumes worthy of appointment (including Umaga and Kirwan) I can't think of a single Super Rugby coaching role where a tie-breaker hasn't gone with an ex-AB, up to and including Coventry vs MacDonald.
This hasn't happened for a while with the ABs because the stakes are too high to pick on anything but (perceived) merit - which is what makes this next appointment interesting.
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@rotated Razor is a good example of someone who has worked his way up and through the system as opposed to say Hammett...
