Ireland vs All Blacks (2018)
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@dk said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
What a game, well played Ireland, never let us have a sniff.
Lots of work ons (don’t you love cliches), blindside flanker, midfield, Beaudies inabaility to get the backline running, inability to deal with flat agreesive defence, breakdown, BFA has to play fullback. Few players looking tired, Read, A.Smith, Whitelock. Uncharacteristic errors from a few others, looking at you BBBR.
Will fortify myself for a second viewing.
Is Ireland playing the blue print for World Cup finals rugby? They shaded us in the Scrum and kicking game, beat us up on the defensive line, and took there chance for the try, where we bombed our one chance
We bombed at least 3 by my count
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Just watched the game.
Firstly well done Ireland. Bestest us in every facet today. Absolutey no other way to say it but we gave it everything and lost to the better side. And thanks to both teams for the best game of rugby i have watched in ages. Loved it.
Toner or van de flier for best on ground, although O'Mahoney was fucking good too.
Great test, deserved result.
Oh and i thought Barnes was really really good too.
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@rocky-rockbottom said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
test out another captain
This. On field leadership is one of the keys to success - it's not all about the coach.
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@booboo said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@crazy-horse said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@rancid-schnitzel that's why I pondered whether it was a conincidence. None of us will really know. We only saw Goodhue taking the ball on the run once and having enough time to pass to Ioane, and that was from a decent Mo'unga pass.
I am not a Barrett hater before anyone accuses me of being one. I am not convinced he is a world cup winning 10.
Well we know he can kick drop goals at least 😉.
But why?
Free reign to have a crack with ball in hand, always coming back for the penalty if we fucked up ... so un-All Black
Exactly. Don't know why he has been receiving so much of praise over the last two weeks for his droppies. To me he threw away a couple of free plays. Dumb.
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Congrats Ireland. Well deserved. Can't really find anything to whinge about (other than your godawful commentators - you should bbbt e embarrassed!). Two teams going hard. Could gave gone either way. Ireland ever so slightly better for longer.
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@booboo yes, those two drop goals were under advantage. Opportunity missed. Reads decision to take 3 when we needed a try to be able to win game. Those last few minutes when we had guys everywhere - in pods, out of pods, running lines, standing still - but we went side to side with nothing happening. Those endless box kicks which left us defending in our own half. Those 3 instances in the second half with running front foot attack ball and the player chose to grubber. In each case we hand the ball over. Something is wrong with our mindset.
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Good match by Ireland deserving of the win. I usually don't like the old cliche "that was the loss we needed to have" etc, but I think this one might actually do us good going forward.
Haven't done my read back through the thread, to the tell the truth I'm a bit scared.
Can't think of any who had really good games, there were a lot of some good and some bad. Even BBBR made a few critical errors.
Man I wish we could create space for Ioane ... he always beat the first man but always got the ball with three defenders on him.
So annoying that we only have Italy left on this tour.
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@booboo said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@crazy-horse said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@rancid-schnitzel that's why I pondered whether it was a conincidence. None of us will really know. We only saw Goodhue taking the ball on the run once and having enough time to pass to Ioane, and that was from a decent Mo'unga pass.
I am not a Barrett hater before anyone accuses me of being one. I am not convinced he is a world cup winning 10.
Well we know he can kick drop goals at least 😉.
But why?
Free reign to have a crack with ball in hand, always coming back for the penalty if we fucked up ... so un-All Black
For sure, but I think that has to be tactical looking forward. Give him a chance to practice during a game. Doesn't help much if it comes down to a dg situation in a game and we find out he can't land them. Anyone can bang them over at practice.
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@snowy guess the thing with today was, Read (as were a number of our leaders) wasnt playing well, so I guess from that perspective it makes it harder for them to see what changes they need to make for the team when they are struggling with thier own shit.
I'd like to say we would unlikely see so many of our top players in that sort of form again, but many of our top players are not playing well in Black.
Given many of them will be given a lighter load in Super rugby next year, there really is little scope for someone else to force thier way in through excellence cos we know they wont drop someone who is out of form if they havent been playing.
For me, the most frustrating aspect was the apparent lack of a cohesive gameplan (although the fact everyone thought kicking was cool, that was obviously a tactic, often regardless of game situation and while if all kicks were on point, maybe it mighta worked, but pretty much every single one was either to a player or needed to go through the hands)
The Irish on the other hand, were all on the same page, thier defence was up quickly and together, but not overcomiting to ruck or tackle situations, and every time they got a big turn over or got us into touch or beat us in a critical moment, they all celebrated, knowing the importance of those moments, whereas we, were flat.
Saying some of our lads are tired, probably has some truth, but as @Steven-Harris points out, isnt this why half of NZ came on this tour, to ensure players were as best prepared physically and mentally? Didnt look that way.
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@booboo said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Congrats Ireland. Well deserved. Can't really find anything to whinge about (other than your godawful commentators - you should bbbt e embarrassed!). Two teams going hard. Could gave gone either way. Ireland ever so slightly better for longer.
Yes those comms made me desperate for Marshall (although not Kearns, fat cnut). I cut the audio fairly early.
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Also, before I forget (and I'm sure it's mentioned in the thread), I'm bloody surprised that Kearney stayed on the field after colliding with Ioane in the air.
Now, I'm happy he did stay on the field but it goes against how the NH have been ruling those in the last few years - players have been red carded for that.
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We need to think about how we play the game vs Ireland, SA, England and Scotland (Not Wales). These teams have figured out a plan to beat us although Ireland/SA have the cattle to do it. We cannot play with 35% of the ball against these well organised teams! I have mentioned it before but I dont think our defence is the biggest issue considering how little ball we have (Same against SA, England) but we do not look like scoring points let alone tries against these structures.
Our attack has issues. Except first test against BIL when we hit hard flat runners off 9 we have really struggled and have been physically dominated- as we were today.
I do not even want to say I know the answers but I feel we are being to predictable in our structure. What is glaring is we hardly ever get quick go forward ball when teams play us like this.
my two cents- I think we need to simplify our launch plays as when we go more than one pass we are inevitably hit behind the gain line and never recover. When we used Reiko once of the lineout move he almost scored. We have powerful dangerous wingers and they (Ireland) game plan is to denying them the ball. Straight from set phase let them get go forward and play off that. This is why I like Naholo as with him and Reiko they will always go forward. (Maybe Laumape is option?). I know these seem simple but I get frustrated watching our attack game, when we play other teams ok, but when we play these teams we need to think different.
add this to the millions of other opinions -
@steven-harris said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Outplayed and out coached by the Irish on the day,no real complaints from me.
Not the end of the world, but I have seen plenty of evidence to suggest signs of staleness within this coaching group.No question it was a points decision to Joe Schmidt after this mornings match and that what’s worrying me
We have the players,but is this coaching group getting the best of out of this group..?I guess it all depends on if you believe Hansen, that we're trying new things and they're taking time to bed in (along with the powder dry theory) or if this is currently all we've got and the best we can hope for is a few players freshening up and some marginal improvements from the likes of Moody and Cane coming back (seemed like Ireland were missing more key players than us?).
Really we could easily have lost four games this year and something that seems to have changed in recent weeks (since the loss to SA) is that we've been kicking the ball a lot more. Understandable in the wet against England, but it hasn't worked for us.
What might prove to be a bit of a mistake is is Hansen's sticking too rigidly to his idea that you don't lose your place through injury. I'm inclined to think George Bridge should have been picked for TRC instead of NMS and maybe we would have discovered that our best back three is Ioane, Bridge and Smith. (Since Squire is apparently broken, I'd put him on a plane home and replace him with Bridge - and play George).
Other one is SBW. They've tried playing him into form when maybe he should have been sent to M10 Cup and Laumape been given a chance. Today's backline configuration seems to lack a really big munter who can punch holes in the line. Which is why I can see why they've been keen to retain SBW, but maybe they should have backed Laumape.
All in all, we seem to have quite a few problems in the backs. We also have some potential solutions, but those solutions are green as grass and I'm pretty convinced Hansen will stick with experience unless his hand is forced through injury.
In the forwards, I'd like to think it's just a matter of fine-tuning, freshening up and bringing back a few key players. We won the lineouts today, bounced back in the scrums and it wasn't the forwards (very often) who wastefully kicked possession away and forced us to defend for most of the first 60 minutes.
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@nepia the irish comms were so biased it was crazy. They were calling for a yellow card on the new suitcase's supposedly high tackle which was actually not even a high tackle. Then ignored BBBR getting a shoulder to the chin and called it a good front on tackle. All after us a "very cynical side" calling Irish comms are the worst. Just blatant cheerleading and not anywhere near close to an impartial call.
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@act-crusader said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
Is that you Enoka?
I’d love to know when theses so called generations started and ended, because all of them have lost tight games and won tight ones as well.
I'd say the three eras were pretty clear, lining up approximately with the captaincies of Umaga, McCaw and Read. The first group that effected the culture change and restored the meritocracy out of the ashes of the '03 World Cup - most left after 2007 or shortly after. The second group were their replacements many of who were 'complicated' players who blossomed in the new culture/environment many of whom had been discarded at international level previously (Nonu, SBW, Weepu, Kaino, even Thorn). The third generation is essentially the class of 2012.
Because Hansen and Read are still around and Barrett/Smith/Brodie won a RWC with the old guard there is a natural inclination to draw a line between the whole Henry/Hansen era. But the truth is no one in this side has lost a World Cup and Read is the only one who played more than a handful of tests with the World Cup hoodoo hanging over the team. The dark shit that fueled the two RWC wins is gone and we are left with a side of players and coaches who were born on third base and think they hit a triple.
Hansen has often said something along the lines of the team always looking to add to the AB legacy. What has been added since 2016? Historic losses to Ireland and couldn't close out a Lions series.
Forget the RWC. This side needs to start thinking about how they could be the ones to give the Bledisloe back.
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@nevorian said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@snowy I haven't seen the match, what happened, did we hold the ball too much and our backs actually can't do anything?
There was an element of that that, but kicked a lot away initially. We actually looked clueless on attack but the penalties, some justified, some not, at the breakdown in the first half killed us.
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@raznomore said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@nepia the irish comms were so biased it was crazy. They were calling for a yellow card on the new suitcase's supposedly high tackle which was actually not even a high tackle. Then ignored BBBR getting a shoulder to the chin and called it a good front on tackle. All after us a "very cynical side" calling Irish comms are the worst. Just blatant cheerleading and not anywhere near close to an impartial call.
Yeah, it was so nuts I felt the need to create my first thread since we changed over to the new software (as I'm such a noob that I it took me longer than it should to figure out I needed to pick a section to post it in).
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@raznomore said in Ireland Vs All Blacks:
@nepia the irish comms were so biased it was crazy. They were calling for a yellow card on the new suitcase's supposedly high tackle which was actually not even a high tackle.
Not sure why Squire's getting a hard time over this game. He was a bit anonymous vs England, but in this game he seemed to be pretty busy to me. Plenty of carries in the tight and I'm pretty sure it was him under Stander when the Irish drove over the line. Only blemish was the high tackle penalty.
