Cycling/ Cheating etc
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My take is that Froome and Wiggins attempt to stick within the letter of the law.
They will use every possible trick within that letter, including pretending to be asthmatic and have hay fever. They will push every angle, and take anything not formally prohibited.
I think all "therapeutic use exemptions" need to be fully publicised, to try to cut down on this legalised cheating.
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@stockcar86 So if I'm reading that right, that would be theoretically using up a 200 dose Ventolin inhaler roughly once a week to get to that level of Salbutamol?
... and if I'm in the right ballpark... sheesh!
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What annoys me is Froome continually states 'I haven't broken any rules' which is something that hasn't been decided yet.
The rules are not how often you can use your inhaler they are 'how much of the drug are you carrying in you'.
Tests have shown that he had too much onboard his body so, if the tests are correct, he has broken the rule.
All that remains is the explanation of why this is which could mitigate the issue.I tend to agree that this is Sky pushing the limits and getting caught out. WADA rules basically say that if you have a condition that requires taking this drug you can do so up to a point but if you need to take more than that, then sorry, you will need to withdraw on health reasons as you will otherwise be mixing with cheats.
I was prescribed this drug once myself as a got a particularly bad reaction after stacking hay in a barn and inhaling a lot of hay dust. For a while whenever I got hayfever I needed to take a puff or two to free up my breathing. Now, it may be because I was not a regular user but to me it always felt like having the effects of a massive caffeine hit. It gave you a great short term rush. (Just the type of feeling that I imagine would help chasing down a breakaway on a hill climb) -
Quite an interesting article here
Paul Kimmage: The greatest ever or just another drug cheat? After all the bullshit, why should we care?
'Chris Froome's secret battle: Eight doctors, six clinics, four countries and five different illnesses . . . the remarkable personal struggle of Great Bri...
An excerpt
*"Given the list and nature of his ailments, it is no surprise that supplements are his friend: protein drinks and fish oils, beetroot juice and energizer greens. He has used Tramadol but only for back pain, an anti-histamine called Loratadine for an allergy to sun creams; Fluticasone, a preventative spray for asthma, and Ventolin (Salbutamol) when he's racing and about to make an effort.
"Is that not using the inhaler to boost your performance?" I asked him once.
"I eat breakfast before a long race," he replied. "Is that not boosting my performance? If I don't eat I won't have any energy; if I don't have my inhaler before a really big effort I'm probably not going to be able to breathe very well. I know I'm not going to breathe very well."
"But is that (health) not the essence of competition?" I suggested."Inhalers are not performance-enhancing," he said. "If any normal person who doesn't have asthma takes an inhaler, they're not going to ride any faster. Their lungs are not going to open any larger than they were before. But someone who does have asthma, the airways are going to close up and that inhaler just helps them to close less. It just helps me to be more normal and I definitely don't see that as an unfair advantage."
But that depends, obviously, on how much is used."*
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@crucial He's clearly doping. I said it from the beginning. The ludicrous argument that Team Sky wouldn't for blah fucking blah - the same shit US Postal tried. Sign number one: Nobody comes out of nowhere in a short time to become a world beater.
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@chester-draws said in Cycling/ Cheating etc:
I think all "therapeutic use exemptions" need to be fully publicised, to try to cut down on this legalised cheating.
World Rugby has a pretty liberal TUE policy, most sports do until they get the public eye is on them.
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@crucial it's salbutamol right? Ventolin?
I'm asthmatic and can't say I've ever felt like it's a caffeine hit at all. I used to accidentally take too much when younger too and it puts you completely out of kilter and dizzy, can't say it'd help my cycling! That's inhaling it though.
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@bones said in Cycling/ Cheating etc:
@crucial it's salbutamol right? Ventolin?
I'm asthmatic and can't say I've ever felt like it's a caffeine hit at all. I used to accidentally take too much when younger too and it puts you completely out of kilter and dizzy, can't say it'd help my cycling! That's inhaling it though.
I'm only going by my experience, I guess it affects different people slightly differently. If the side effects Froome has help him then no doubt Sky would use it as an advantage.
"Common side effects include shakiness, headache, fast heart rate, dizziness, and feeling anxious."
You get a bit of shakiness, I get a bit of fast heart rate. What does Froome get?
I have no idea what benefit he may actually get but there is a good chance that if it was detrimental his usage would be minimal. The fact that they are happy to boost his intake to high levels points to it being beneficial to him.
He claims it only ever brings him back to a level playing field.
There is a study here on use by non-asthmatic athletes http://thorax.bmj.com/content/56/9/675 but they don't seem to administer in the range that Froome was.
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I have a very simplified view on TUE's.
They are bullshit and competitors shouldn't be allowed to compete on them.
If you are sick, and require medication, then you aren't going to be fit or strong enough to win the Tour De France - so why should you then be able to take a banned substance to make yourself not sick? Being sick / getting injured is part of life / sport.
In my world, lets just say for whatever reason you need to take a banned substance to help with health. At that point you then declare it to the governing agency, who tell you h ow long your mandatory stand-down from the sport is.
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@majorrage so can't play premier rugby if you're asthmatic?
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@bones said in Cycling/ Cheating etc:
@majorrage so can't play premier rugby if you're asthmatic?
salbutamol doesn't require a TUE.
It just means that you need to take it at 'normal' levels and not massive amounts.
I think what @dogmeat is getting at is that if you need to take a banned substance in order to compete because of illness then you shouldn't be competing at all.
Plenty of rugby players don't play when the have a bad cold rather than dosing up on codeine and pseodoephidrene.
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I'm an asthmatic and all I can say is that if you need to use up an inhaler in just one week then no farking way you'll be able to cycle up a hill let alone compete in the Tour de France.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Cycling/ Cheating etc:
I'm an asthmatic and all I can say is that if you need to use up an inhaler in just one week then no farking way you'll be able to cycle up a hill let alone compete in the TSF.
Need really really good drugs for that.
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@booboo said in Cycling/ Cheating etc:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Cycling/ Cheating etc:
I'm an asthmatic and all I can say is that if you need to use up an inhaler in just one week then no farking way you'll be able to cycle up a hill let alone compete in the TSF.
Need really really good drugs for that.
Especially in the politics forum
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@booboo said in Cycling/ Cheating etc:
@rancid-schnitzel said in Cycling/ Cheating etc:
I'm an asthmatic and all I can say is that if you need to use up an inhaler in just one week then no farking way you'll be able to cycle up a hill let alone compete in the TSF.
Need really really good drugs for that.
Bloody autocorrect.
Wheeze (takes 200 shots of ventolin).
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@majorrage said in Cycling/ Cheating etc:
I have a very simplified view on TUE's.
They are bullshit and competitors shouldn't be allowed to compete on them.
If you are sick, and require medication, then you aren't going to be fit or strong enough to win the Tour De France - so why should you then be able to take a banned substance to make yourself not sick? Being sick / getting injured is part of life / sport.
In my world, lets just say for whatever reason you need to take a banned substance to help with health. At that point you then declare it to the governing agency, who tell you h ow long your mandatory stand-down from the sport is.
Fuck me there's a lot of vitriol being spewed around this.
Tom Fordyce balances things out here:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cycling/42350159 -
Nah, that's bullshit Scribe.
Exactly, exactly the same bullshit was written to exonerate Lance Amstrong.
He's been caught. People don't want to believe he's been caught.
