Springboks v All Blacks
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@Nepia said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
@broughie said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
So Dagg is a lock at 14? While I appreciate his aerial skills and that he fits the Jane/Skudder mould of FB/Winger. he is not the winger you want scoring in the corner. Funny how one of his best attributes, his boot, is wasted on the wing. I'd break with conventional wisdom and have Savea and Naholo play.
Have you not seen Savea play recently? He doesn't have aerial skills, he doesn't have a boot, and on recent evidence he is not the winger you want scoring in the corner. How long do we wait for him to come right?
Liam Napier clearly was watching old tapes of Savea. He had one run in space and was tackled by the first defender he came to - he used to have power, strength and guile, sadly used to are the operative words.
I don't think he played badly Saturday. He did not have much space and he had the ball in his wrong arm. Not sure this is the norm for him. Given the same circumstances Dagg would not have come close to scoring. Not homing for Savea. I think Nahalo has been the form winger outside of fielding high balls. I just think that when teams are game planning they are more likely to put a circle around Savea, at least as an offensive threat. Poise under a high ball a liability. At least Savea does not have that God awful goose step that Dagg persists with.
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@MajorRage said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
@Nepia He hasn't done bad this RC, has he? Yeah, he's not the star performer, but he's picked up a few tries, made some decent runs and played ok.
We already have 2 fullbacks in the back 3, I think the balance back there is ok.
@broughie The Savea of old would have scored that try easily and there was clearly space - he just fluffed it and the ball in the wrong hand shouldn't be dismissed off hand.
I think that Savea gets held to a different standard to most players. I don't think he's been the best wing in the country for over 12 months now but he keeps getting selected on his past glories and the hope he'll come right. He's had one standout game in this RC and one in the World Cup but other than that he's just taking up space.
He's awesome when in form, but I stop kidding myself he was (in form) a long time ago.
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@Nepia you seem to be on a bit of crusade to prove Savea is shit or god knows what. I call bullshit. He has easily justified his selection this RC with some very good games and some good tries that were very similar to the one he didn't get in this game. Funnily enough Dagg got bundled into touch on the other wing too. They aren't the first and won't be the last to not score a tight one or carry the ball in the wrong hand.
The other point is that Savea hasn't been selected because there is some conspiracy. He has been selected because the guys who are challenging him for his spot keep getting broken.
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@Bones said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
Wow, Savea a waste of space? Going on his form in the RC I wholeheartedly disagree.
Edit: And to think that, you've either got something against him or you've lost the plot. Or both.
I didn't say waste, I said taking up.
I have got something against him - I've just outlined it over two posts, he's a shadow of his former self, he's slower, less agile and misses chances he'd have walked in a couple of seasons ago. His form is barely better than when his franchise coach dropped him for the crucial matches of their best ever season.
@pukunui I'm not on a crusade, I just don't think he's been playing very well. I'm not going to pretend I think any different because you and MR think different and Bones thinks I've lost the plot. I also never said there was a conspiracy, Hansen clearly likes him and he backs players he likes.
I'm actually genuinely surprised how many people are going to the mattresses for Savea as he's hardly been a standout performer in a long time. You'd think I have issues with Ben Smith such is the white knighting that's going on here.
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@Nepia Here you go, some stats for this guy who's only taking up space.
Currently tied 1st for tries, equal with Ben Smith and Crotty.
Shockingly, he's way down at 8th on the carries list with only 42. Oh but that's odd as he tops the metres list with 378 (next best is Isa with 361).
Top on clean breaks with 11, (Ben Smith 10, Isa, 8 ).
4th in Defenders beaten with 16 (Smith 20, Isa 19, Barrett 17).
This stats are from the Herald, so not sure how accurate, but hey, seem to paint a picture of a guy doing something right, even if he's not in the form which might get him compared to Jonah.
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I can remember off the top of my head 4 very strong runs from Savea in the last game, 3 times bumping off the first defender and the other time clean stepping him. He's there to do a job and he's doing it well. It's hardly a surprising that ALB and Crotty had plenty of space when Savea is standing on the wing. Hell part of the reason Crotty made the break that led to the breakout try was because the Argie defense was hell bent on cutting down space for Savea outside him.
He draws defenders and runs strongly. And that's when he's not at his best. There is daylight between him and the next best 11 right now. Unless you're still fluffing Lowe?
No white-knighting. Just calling out an obvious bias from someone determined to ignore anything positive he does.
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@Bones said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
@Nepia Here you go, some stats for this guy who's only taking up space.
Currently tied 1st for tries, equal with Ben Smith and Crotty.
Shockingly, he's way down at 8th on the carries list with only 42. Oh but that's odd as he tops the metres list with 378 (next best is Isa with 361).
Top on clean breaks with 11, (Ben Smith 10, Isa, 8 ).
4th in Defenders beaten with 16 (Smith 20, Isa 19, Barrett 17).
This stats are from the Herald, so not sure how accurate, but hey, seem to paint a picture of a guy doing something right, even if he's not in the form which might get him compared to Jonah.
Good post but who is Isa?
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@Siam said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
@Bones said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
@Nepia Here you go, some stats for this guy who's only taking up space.
Currently tied 1st for tries, equal with Ben Smith and Crotty.
Shockingly, he's way down at 8th on the carries list with only 42. Oh but that's odd as he tops the metres list with 378 (next best is Isa with 361).
Top on clean breaks with 11, (Ben Smith 10, Isa, 8 ).
4th in Defenders beaten with 16 (Smith 20, Isa 19, Barrett 17).
This stats are from the Herald, so not sure how accurate, but hey, seem to paint a picture of a guy doing something right, even if he's not in the form which might get him compared to Jonah.
Good post but who is Isa?
Argies Number 8. Absolute weapon of a player.
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@MajorRage
Thanks rage. Yeah he's a gun, very impressive -
@Siam said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
@MajorRage
Thanks rage. Yeah he's a gun, very impressiveYeah, love watching him play, close to my favourite player to watch at the moment.
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@Frank said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
I'd say NMS, Naholo and Ben Smith are our best wingers.
I honestly think George Moala would be better than Julian Savea as well.Agree re: NMS and Ben Smith. However Ben Smith according to you is a fullback and NMS is a right winger.
Naholo is largely unproven at test level. Well, he's proven he has tits for hands thus far.
Moala even more unproven and is a centre.
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@No-Quarter said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
@Frank said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
I'd say NMS, Naholo and Ben Smith are our best wingers.
I honestly think George Moala would be better than Julian Savea as well.Agree re: NMS and Ben Smith. However Ben Smith according to you is a fullback and NMS is a right winger.
Naholo is largely unproven at test level. Well, he's proven he has tits for hands thus far.
Moala even more unproven and is a centre.
Ben Smith, if needed, is a better winger.
Did you see Naholo tear it up in the first Aussie game?? Upside is huge with him. Far more dangerous and quicker than Savea.
On Moala you might be right. -
Does it matter?
Naholo seems to break every 5 mins, Moala too and NMS has been broken for months.Have that debate when all the contenders are fit. Right now it is Savea, a rookie or move a midfielder/fullback there. I'll take Savea out of those options thanks.
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@Frank said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
@No-Quarter said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
@Frank said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
I'd say NMS, Naholo and Ben Smith are our best wingers.
I honestly think George Moala would be better than Julian Savea as well.Agree re: NMS and Ben Smith. However Ben Smith according to you is a fullback and NMS is a right winger.
Naholo is largely unproven at test level. Well, he's proven he has tits for hands thus far.
Moala even more unproven and is a centre.
Ben Smith, if needed, is a better winger.
Did you see Naholo tear it up in the first Aussie game?? Upside is huge with him. Far more dangerous and quicker than Savea.
On Moala you might be right.I agree that Naholo has massive upside. He is a weapon with ball in hand, but is far from the complete package at test level. Long term I think he will usurp Savea but he's not there yet.
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@Frank said in Springboks v All Blacks, whos in?:
Did you see Naholo tear it up in the first Aussie game?? Upside is huge with him. Far more dangerous and quicker than Savea.
It was only Australia....
