All Blacks v France
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@junior said in All Blacks v France:
@sparky said in All Blacks v France:
@Machpants I've always thought TJP was reasonable at finishing out a game. Ratima seems a bit low on confidence. Hotham IMHO is our second best half back at the moment, but he is with the ABs XV.
Hotham?! The guy who can’t pass
He's TJP mk II. I don't get it.
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@Machpants just regarding Amua the game against Ireland was his 3rd start in a row I would be reluctant to change him out for Cody Taylor given his great form but I sense the coaches will bring Taylor back in
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@Steven-Harris said in All Blacks v France:
@Machpants just regarding Amua the game against Ireland was his 3rd start in a row I would be reluctant to change him out for Cody Taylor given his great form but I sense the coaches will bring Taylor back in
I'd have Aumua starting again if his body pulls up well - and I'd be telling him to go hard for 50 minutes. Would love for us to have the luxury of bringing a fit Codie off the bench for 30mins.
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@Bones said in All Blacks v France:
@junior said in All Blacks v France:
@sparky said in All Blacks v France:
@Machpants I've always thought TJP was reasonable at finishing out a game. Ratima seems a bit low on confidence. Hotham IMHO is our second best half back at the moment, but he is with the ABs XV.
Hotham?! The guy who can’t pass
He's TJP mk II. I don't get it.
Coz Canty homer coz
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@voodoo said in All Blacks v France:
@Steven-Harris said in All Blacks v France:
@Machpants just regarding Amua the game against Ireland was his 3rd start in a row I would be reluctant to change him out for Cody Taylor given his great form but I sense the coaches will bring Taylor back in
I'd have Aumua starting again if his body pulls up well - and I'd be telling him to go hard for 50 minutes. Would love for us to have the luxury of bring a fit Codie off the bench for 30mins.
If Aumua continues to play to his undoubted potential the idea of a one two punch of him and Sami T is a terrifying prospect for any opposition
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@MN5
Our forward pack is starting to look rather fearsome.
How the heck did we make it to here. -
@MN5 said in All Blacks v France:
@voodoo said in All Blacks v France:
@Steven-Harris said in All Blacks v France:
@Machpants just regarding Amua the game against Ireland was his 3rd start in a row I would be reluctant to change him out for Cody Taylor given his great form but I sense the coaches will bring Taylor back in
I'd have Aumua starting again if his body pulls up well - and I'd be telling him to go hard for 50 minutes. Would love for us to have the luxury of bring a fit Codie off the bench for 30mins.
If Aumua continues to play to his undoubted potential the idea of a one two punch of him and Sami T is a terrifying prospect for any opposition
Aumua made me forget about Sami for a minute. That says a fair bit
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@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks v France:
@MN5
Our forward pack is starting to look rather fearsome.
How the heck did we make it to here.I'm not sure I'd go quite that far. We look solid in the front row at set piece, but not dominant (he says having never been in a scrum in his life) - and ball running from the props is hardly devastating (maybe Tosi aside). Locks we have Vaií playing well, and Barrett looked better last night - but neither is truly world class in the air or around the park. And we still have a pretty unbalanced back row. Sititi has been a massive find, but Cane is in his twilight and Ardie has been average all season.
I really wouldn't call it fearsome. What we genuinely seem to have developed however (probably by accident as much as anything), is depth in most positions. Bench props and hooker come on, we don't miss a beat. Patrick at lock, uptick in power and energy to close. Finau on and a reshuffle with Cane off - better balance and nothing lost.
It's progress!
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@voodoo said in All Blacks v France:
@MN5 said in All Blacks v France:
@voodoo said in All Blacks v France:
@Steven-Harris said in All Blacks v France:
@Machpants just regarding Amua the game against Ireland was his 3rd start in a row I would be reluctant to change him out for Cody Taylor given his great form but I sense the coaches will bring Taylor back in
I'd have Aumua starting again if his body pulls up well - and I'd be telling him to go hard for 50 minutes. Would love for us to have the luxury of bring a fit Codie off the bench for 30mins.
If Aumua continues to play to his undoubted potential the idea of a one two punch of him and Sami T is a terrifying prospect for any opposition
Aumua made me forget about Sami for a minute. That says a fair bit
Yeah dealing with one for 50 odd minutes and then having the other come on and wreck havoc is a daunting prospect.
I say this wondering how long Taylor has left, not that he’s doing anything wrong, his form resurgence in the last couple of years has been exceptional
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@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks v France:
@MN5
Our forward pack is starting to look rather fearsome.
How the heck did we make it to here.Injury certainly helped selection....
Gradual improvement, Razor has settled on an effective team that now has impact off the bench, our tactics have tightened up a lot
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@cgrant 100% predictable I think, if you look at a guy who is not established as a member of the 23 (only there because of ST injury), and then you start subbing him on really late against top teams when our team performances have already been going to shit - that's a huge amount of pressure to put on an inexperienced test player, and he understandably had nerves and fucked up a few throws. it's bad coaching, and i was harping on about giving him a start prior to taylor's injury, because the bloke can play.
Once he's got confidence that he belongs - and the last two games will have done wonders for that - if you sub him on at 50 minutes instead of at 70 when we're fucked, he'll probably go fine off the bench - but I do think the better order is Taylor to finish at the moment. Aumua has more grunt in close, and Taylor is the more reliable thrower and experienced head. -
@BerniesCorner Iike many I thought the loss of Whitelock & Retallick would be very difficult to replace
I have always rated Scott Barrett as someone who could step up discipline aside but the way Tupou Vai has stepped up has been staggering and it’s fair to say I haven’t always been a fan of Patty T but I will gladly eat humble pie on that take
Throw in Sam Darry who has also come on big time ,Josh Lord and Fabian Holland in the wings things a looking very rosy
How good is it gonna be watching these guys battle it out at Super level for test spots moving forward .?
Love the look of the propping stocks ,genuine competition for places , 3 quality hookers when Taukeiaho gets back on the field and the loose forward mix options are looking strong
Who would have thought that at the top of the year? , I think sometimes we under estimate the ability and quality of players developed through NPC and Super Rugby .
PS imagine some of the players in the NZ XV who walk into other international teams ?…maybe not your top 3 or 4 but definitely into other teams -
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks v France:
@MN5
Our forward pack is starting to look rather fearsome.
How the heck did we make it to here.It was always going that way once we got a better props in De Groot and Lomax. The fact that we have real depth now at prop is a great foundation to build a pack on. With Sititi coming out of nowhere and Holland on the horizon, the AB pack can become outstanding over the next 12-18 months
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@DaGrubster said in All Blacks v France:
@BerniesCorner said in All Blacks v France:
@MN5
Our forward pack is starting to look rather fearsome.
How the heck did we make it to here.It was always going that way once we got a better props in De Groot and Lomax. The fact that we have real depth now at prop is a great foundation to build a pack on. With Sititi coming out of nowhere and Holland on the horizon, the AB pack can become outstanding over the next 12-18 months
Add in Lakai for Cane and if he can make strides as fast as Wallace, we could be young and dynamic very quickly
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@Steven-Harris said in All Blacks v France:
@BerniesCorner
How good is it gonna be watching these guys battle it out at Super level for test spots moving forward .?It'll be awesome, as long as they have to... Something I've been thinking about is the sabbatical and guys coming in from Japan or wherever having not played Super. I think it's really unfair on the young guys coming through - they can have a storming super season and then not be picked because a guy who they don't even get a chance to measure themselves against is gifted a spot based on year ago form. All players go downhill at some point, and some very rapidly (Rodney So'oialo, NMS).
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@reprobate Sititi is an example of someone I doubt many would have picked pre super rugby so the opportunity for someone to come out of nowhere is still a very real possibility but I would also hope that some that have fallen down the pecking order ..Eg Quinn Tupaea or Hoskins Sotutu for example can still force their way back in although in the case of Hoskins it would take something extra special to convince Ryan
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@reprobate said in All Blacks v France:
@Steven-Harris said in All Blacks v France:
@BerniesCorner
How good is it gonna be watching these guys battle it out at Super level for test spots moving forward .?It'll be awesome, as long as they have to... Something I've been thinking about is the sabbatical and guys coming in from Japan or wherever having not played Super. I think it's really unfair on the young guys coming through - they can have a storming super season and then not be picked because a guy who they don't even get a chance to measure themselves against is gifted a spot based on year ago form. All players go downhill at some point, and some very rapidly (Rodney So'oialo, NMS).
Why do you think some of us were so incensed by Sotutu's omission? Whether he would have made an impact or not, we can't know. Those who point to his earlier time in black as an indication that he'll never be up to it only have to look at how Patty T is playing right now. What can't be argued is that Hoskins deserved a call up. And I can say this and I'm not even a Blues fan!
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Some thoughts on the French after their game against Japan:
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I know it’s only Japan so it’s probably hard to get excited by that game as a French player but I thought the whole team still looked incredibly discouraged. Heads down, lack of communication, nobody smiling after the game. It was the same during the Six Nations, so it seems they’re still in a funk after the loss in the quarter-final. They’ll be targeting this game against the All Blacks as a way to get out of it.
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Antoine Dupont was remarkably loose in this game: passes hitting the ground, flip passes around the back to unexpecting players, going quickly after a penalty when it wasn’t on. After a penalty was reversed in favour of France, he took the ball and kicked quickly to catch the Japanese off guard, only for him to completely miss touch, leading to a Japanese counter-attack. Very different to the player of a couple of years ago, who could go 5 games in a row without making a single mistake. I don’t think the constant hype is really helping him.
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The breakdown is going to be crucial. The French are relentless in attacking the ball, and they have loads of players who can successfully poach. The ABs are going to have to prioritize securing their own ball first, before playing expansively, as the French backline with Dupont, Bielle-Biarrey, Penaud (who didn’t play this week but will be next) and Ramos are deadly on the counter-attack.
So the French are still in a post-World Cup rut but will be looking to get out of it against the ABs. Should be another great game in what has already been a terrific series of November internationals.
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@Steven-Harris said in All Blacks v France:
@reprobate Sititi is an example of someone I doubt many would have picked pre super rugby so the opportunity for someone to come out of nowhere is still a very real possibility but I would also hope that some that have fallen down the pecking order ..Eg Quinn Tupaea or Hoskins Sotutu for example can still force their way back in although in the case of Hoskins it would take something extra special to convince Ryan
Can only hope that it leads to changes in selection. We're seeing clear evidence that super rugby form really matters.
