Your 4 midfielders for the Lions
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@gollum said in Your 4 midfielders for the Lions:
@Crucial said in Your 4 midfielders for the Lions:
Should we add Kenny Rogers to the contenders list?
I reckon he's got a similar chance of starting v the Lions as Procter, Laumape & Reiko
They'll be time enough for counting when the selection's done.
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Am I the only person a little bit underwhelmed by Proctor?
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@Billy-Tell said in Your 4 midfielders for the Lions:
Am I the only person a little bit underwhelmed by Proctor?
He'll likely have 2 opportunities vs the Lions (Maori and Canes) so let's see how he goes in those games first. Proctor has talent but the list of midfielders ahead of him (in the selectors eyes) is long.
I don't see Laumape anywhere near AB selection. Sure, he's playing better this year than last year, but he's still one-dimensional to me - partly due to his RL background. I'd want to see some signs he can distribute the ball and take the right options. Laumape's greatest strength is running over defenders but that trick isn't so easy against better quality players.
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No point even debating whether Crotty, ALB or SBW will make it in, they're dead certs at this point. The only question mark for me is Fekitoa in the fourth spot because he's been in the team for years and yet is still far from the finished product. But I get the feeling he's being viewed as a long term project, like Nonu was before him.
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You'd have to think they feel they can get Fekitoa's attack sorted, eventually, cos on defence the guy is a beast.
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@Billy-Tell said in Your 4 midfielders for the Lions:
Am I the only person a little bit underwhelmed by Proctor?
He's playing well, but jeez I'm sick of every commentator, journalist and several on here always referring to him as "underrated".
He's not, everyone has noticed how well he's playing... even Mark Hammett described him a s future all black years ago
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@SammyC said in Your 4 midfielders for the Lions:
@Billy-Tell said in Your 4 midfielders for the Lions:
Am I the only person a little bit underwhelmed by Proctor?
He's playing well, but jeez I'm sick of every commentator, journalist and several on here always referring to him as "underrated".
He's not, everyone has noticed how well he's playing... even Mark Hammett described him a s future all black years ago
That's his career FUBAR then....
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@SammyC Sam Whitelock still gets called under-rated in some quarters....
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@taniwharugby said in Your 4 midfielders for the Lions:
@SammyC Sam Whitelock still gets called under-rated in some quarters....
Gregan called Brodie Retallick under rated a few weeks ago.
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@taniwharugby said in Your 4 midfielders for the Lions:
@SammyC Sam Whitelock still gets called under-rated in some quarters....
Hugely underrated. Everything from his messy hair and his epic beard to the fact that he's white and plays lock, he's the perfect specimen of All Black and I'd like to see that acknowledged on a more regular basis.
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@gollum said in Your 4 midfielders for the Lions:
Most of our centres have not tended to be x-factor creators, they've tended to be rock solid positional guys who defend well, read plays well & know when to pass & when to hold. Super Rugby sure, its x-factor as far as the eye can see, but as soon as the tests roll round the selectors select guys a mile from the X Factor template.
We dont create tries with x-factor, we create tries because 15 guys can catch & pass at the right time, or know to throw a skip. A huge number of our tries are were we create a yard of space out wide & 4 guys pass fast & accutately to each other to hit it. That happens 10-1 v SBW throwing one behind his back.
I can see Proctor getting a chance later this year as he has that "does the basics well" vibe. But more often than not the most outrageously talented guys available haven't had much of a sniff, not just recently, but way back too - Eroni Clarke, Norm Berryman, Rene Ranger, Regan KIng, they lost out at times to, on the face of it, some pretty bland guys who were outstanding at the basics. When Nonu was passing off the deck every 5 seconds he got dropped, as a great he just ran hard & threw very good passes. Then they replaced him with Crotty. The definition of "does the basics well"
That's why I reckon Buckman will get selected. At test level you want a guy who has a great rugby brain, low error rate and excellent decision-making. Despite looking like something you'd find sleeping on a park bench, Buckman has all those qualities. Plenty of competition though. I'd be very surprised if Proctor was selected.
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@gollum said in Your 4 midfielders for the Lions:
Most of our centres have not tended to be x-factor creators, they've tended to be rock solid positional guys who defend well, read plays well & know when to pass & when to hold. Super Rugby sure, its x-factor as far as the eye can see, but as soon as the tests roll round the selectors select guys a mile from the X Factor template.
We dont create tries with x-factor, we create tries because 15 guys can catch & pass at the right time, or know to throw a skip. A huge number of our tries are were we create a yard of space out wide & 4 guys pass fast & accutately to each other to hit it. That happens 10-1 v SBW throwing one behind his back.
I can see Proctor getting a chance later this year as he has that "does the basics well" vibe. But more often than not the most outrageously talented guys available haven't had much of a sniff, not just recently, but way back too - Eroni Clarke, Norm Berryman, Rene Ranger, Regan KIng, they lost out at times to, on the face of it, some pretty bland guys who were outstanding at the basics. When Nonu was passing off the deck every 5 seconds he got dropped, as a great he just ran hard & threw very good passes. Then they replaced him with Crotty. The definition of "does the basics well"
I agree with you. The X-factor I was referring to was concerning the bench only. ALB, SBW and Crotty are obvious selections for me.
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X-Factor is overrated.
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Has Fekitoa signed for next year ?
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@kiwiinmelb I don't think so.
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@ACT-Crusader said in Your 4 midfielders for the Lions:
X-Factor is overrated.
Settle down Domehead.
Anyway, most players considered not to have x factor have massive x factor and guys who are considered to have x factor get their steadyness downplayed even when they're steady.
@SammyC I think the comments from Billy Tell might suggest Proctor is underrated.
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@ACT-Crusader Ability to break the advantage line isn't.
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@Nepia said in Your 4 midfielders for the Lions:
@ACT-Crusader said in Your 4 midfielders for the Lions:
X-Factor is overrated.
Settle down Domehead.
Anyway, most players considered not to have x factor have massive x factor and guys who are considered to have x factor get their steadyness downplayed even when they're steady.
@SammyC I think the comments from Billy Tell might suggest Proctor is underrated.
I always read X factor as "this guy is shithouse, but I really like him"
IE if a guy is great defensively, has great hands, can kick, is good under the high ball, can flat pass both ways, has a good motor, has good pace, people say "Ben Smith guy is great defensively, has great hands, can kick, is good under the high ball, can flat pass both ways, has a good motor, has good pace!" when justifying picking him.
If a guy has the brain of a fricking headless chook, rushes up in D, drops half his passes & tosses every second offload to the opposition or the ground but once a Super game breaks 5 tackles before throwing it into touch so gets the crowd up on their feet they say "He's an X-Factor player!" to justify picking him.
Unless you are Justin Marshall & someone goes "do you like him Justin?" & you go "Whooom-PAH! X-Factor! Nisbo! BOOMPF!". Which means "I have watched him play & made a detailed study I lack the words to express, but yes"
