NPC Crowds
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@MN5 said in NPC Crowds:
Wellington couldn’t even sell out Jerry Collin’s stadium.
It’s a far cry from a full house at the stadium with Jonah, Cully, Tana etc running wild and winning the championship.
Those were the best times, those are the games I grew up on, the Tin was absolutely pumping.
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@reprobate said in NPC Crowds:
If I could rock up with the young blokes to a grass bank and BYO my own kai and a few cans at $15 I'd go every week.
For $30 and another $30 on shit beer and $10 for a shitty cup of chips no thanks.yeah, the current version of the NPC needs to be played in grounds with one main stand and then a grass embankment (rugby verison of hagley park), "everyone" with 20-30k stadiums is just to expensive and frankly full on
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Well I a gold member at the Naki, costs me $80 (gold card etc) but that gets me into the 5 games , free parking and even a free pint of beer (someone bought a couple when I there on weekend, they $11) at a local pub before the game.
I expecting price to go up next year with new stand open by then, and hopefully s bar etc.
Like all things we can find excuses to either go or stay home and watch it on TV, and have no problems with anyone's choice. I would very seriously doubt whether there would be bigger crowds at any club games. It can get a little tempting to stay home on some night fixtures when it's cold and raining, I got to drive for an hour to get there, as do a few from Hawera etc.
I agree in smaller stadiums could be good idea if it ok for tv etc.
The glory days of NPC 80s,90s etc had the advantage it was back in Amateur days, we didn't have pay tv etc.Mind you I not neutral on NPC, it is my favourite rugby comp, so I always talk it up anyway.
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@reprobate said in NPC Crowds:
If I could rock up with the young blokes to a grass bank and BYO my own kai and a few cans at $15 I'd go every week.
For $30 and another $30 on shit beer and $10 for a shitty cup of chips no thanks.Yeah mate, we all know that will never happen, a whole crowd of young fellas taking their own, I bet there would be too much trouble unfortunately.
I used to see it at Ballymore on club finals day in Brisbane, or even on embankment on rep days, whole lot of young fellas pissed, and surprise surprise there were punch ups. Unfortunately cheap piss doesn't work too often. I have seen it at super rugby too, usually younger fellas preloaded and then still getting into piss there. -
Just remembered, used to pay $5 to get into a club game in early 90s, and about $15 for a provincial game (and that was in the Horowhenua), so genuinely think prices as a rule are about same with inflation etc. That was amateur days too! One or 2 clubs in the Naki still have gate charges these days, but not here in Hawera .
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@reprobate said in NPC Crowds:
@Dan54 what's the difference between checking bags for zero alcohol, and checking them for anything more than a couple of beers?
No idea mate.Didn't think you could take in zero beers anyway. I don't know what they check for anything. I only saying what I have found, I am first to put up hand and say I used to go to games pissed, and try to sneak beers in. Then I got a bit older and wiser and figured it was waste of time, as I was wandering off for a slash during games etc. And I just go to watch rugby these days, it not a social occasion for me, but probably age thing. I do think NPC should go from stadiums as they cost too much to hire etc, but even at parks they still cost a fair bit to put on I imagine.
We live in different times and it seems it now mandatory to play music etc druing breaks in play etc, once again I don't like it but many younger ones do, so I live with it.
Just we look at crowds etc, when we used to have good crowds in 80s etc there was no beers sold at games and supposedly none taken in, just more seems we were watching games etc.
Same as price of piss at games? I know it pricey, but generally I never want it cheap as crowd behavour perhaps slips with it.
For all how hard we think we pay too much etc for games, at test and super level we pay less than I used to in Aus. -
The entertainment product of NPC died a very very long time ago and now only die hard support it onsite. That wanes every year a bit more
The fact that when the minnow type teams do splendidly and get the crowds, it suggests that maybe it should be played more provincially in smaller town stadiums.
When Waikato played a preseason shield game at Matamata, it was chocka. It suited the product
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@Hooroo said in NPC Crowds:
When Waikato played a preseason shield game at Matamata, it was chocka. It suited the product
I went to that game in Matamata, and another RS defence a long time ago in Tokoroa.
The ability to broadcast games on TV from these smaller grounds will be a consideration.
I also refuse to buy food/drink at the stadium due to the prices they charge and the quality. It's better to go to a restaurant or pub before/after the game.
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my football stadium in the UK only does drinks as they need to hold the liquor licence...they just roll in a whole lot of food trucks....obviously dont get the money from the food...but the trucks are also just charging "normal" prices and you get a variety....and dont have to handle all the admin of catering
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I do think we have to look at price of food or drinks at stadiums.
It is not set by rugby, but by the people who hire the food stalls or bars. Was talking to a fella who had s food outlet at Suncorp, he said he had to make prices higher than in his shop as the cost was so high to do it.
The rent per night was pricey, and you have to set up whole thing including prep etc on day, not like at shop where everything stays there.
I was at Yarrows Stadium on Saturday and women I spoke to while buying some food, said it was their first time there, and didn't know at that stage if they would be back until they looked at profit etc.
At local grounds , I think the use of local park is often almost nothing, and often a local club has clubrooms there to buy beers from , and food caravans are charged bugger all if anything. -
@Hooroo said in NPC Crowds:
The entertainment product of NPC died a very very long time ago and now only die hard support it onsite. That wanes every year a bit more
The fact that when the minnow type teams do splendidly and get the crowds, it suggests that maybe it should be played more provincially in smaller town stadiums.
When Waikato played a preseason shield game at Matamata, it was chocka. It suited the product
This. The issues about TV, food, booze etc discussed below can be solved - but if they want the product to get bums on seats this is the obvious way of doing it and getting better diversity in crowds.
You give out free tickets to any kid from the local rugby club(s) - but they need to attend with a paying adult.
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The issue is that it is being played while the All Blacks are playing and everyone including the players know it is completely irrelevant to the team. It doesn't matter how well any player plays in it will be written off as irrelevant. Over on the All Black thread someone said Narawa played well at centre over the weekend and immediately someone said 'it is only the NPC'. The All Blacks lost a test over the weekend but any poster would be ridiculed for arguing solutions to the loss lay in what they saw in the NPC.
The only relevance it now has in terms of high performance NZ rugby is giving established All Black contenders game time before returning. Not even sure it is that relevant to making Super rugby squads anymore to be honest as someone like Taha Kemara has a contract and Lincoln McClutchie does not.
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@tubbyj I think it got huge relevance for super rugby , even if players do go elsewhere like McClutchie etc . It a great stepping stone, I look in the Naki team at Daniel Rona, Josh Jacomb, Meiha Grindlay, Naholo ,Kneepkens in backline, they would be not playing at moment with no NPC. Forwards are exactly same. Even in backline . Good percentage of our forward pack is the same, Ricitelli,Slater, Boshier etc same thing.
I genuinely think NPC will be trimmed by a couple of teams, but god help us if the comp ever stopped, we would lose a hell of a lot more players overseas. And our Super teams would suffer big time in about 4-5 years time.I rerally think we have to realise the whole corwd thing isn't just a NPC thing. We have had posts of how wonderful it used to be when stadiums were full etc. That exact same thing is in Super rugby too, crowds aren't what they were. It is so easy to sit at home or in bar to watch rugby, or any sports.
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Not to go down this road again, but them playing is not a 'stepping stone' in that it helps them get discovered or acts as a bridge between Club rugby and Super - most of them were signed to a Super academy (or another academy) very early, so it's a place for them to play - we all agree that we need our next generation playing at a reasonable level of rugby going across the year. The question is of course, this disconnect between Super academy to NPC then back to Super, with NPC academies thrown in too.
I think Rona is the only example there of what you are talking about (i.e., using it as a stepping stone). The others were already in the system.
Josh Jacomb Auckland
Meihana Grindlay Blues
Kini Naholo Chiefs
Kneepkens Chiefs -
@gt12 yep mate I not meaning for finding players. But I genuinely believe the players in general need a playing stepping stone, and it's something Barnes the Naki coach talks about.
Not taking away from fact that academies find young players etc, but I truly believe they learn a hell of a lot more on the field playing a higher and more experienced players. In actual fact I don't think many NPC teams have academies as such, they just come through a general age grade system rep teams. so basically we agre on the need for higher level rugby.
But really this thread is discussing crowds more than the comp.
As I say I a real fan of NPC, think it a great comp, and like anything when we talking about crowds , I think we all will find excuse to go to the games or not go to games. As I said I comfortable with those who choose to stay home, as they find it easier, or more comfortable. -
@gt12 Just one other thing mate for stepping stones, I have a mate who's grandson was in Chiefs academy, didn't crack a NPC team on regular basis and so never made it into super squad. So really seems in general is a stepping stone between academy and super?
He is looking at perhaps USA or Europe to get contract (at 2nd tier etc) -
So, two potential issues here:
- he isn't good enough
- the current system doesn’t have sufficient alignment to develop talent
I know I agree with one of those.
Btw, you look at the Taranaki team and very few of their young stars (3/5 you mentioned I think) seem to actually be from Taranaki, so the NPC teams are just working as feeder clubs for the cities anyway.
Edit: I bring this up as one issue with crowds is that many of these guys in the competition are ring-ins from other places. The actual local connection is more and more frayed every year.
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@gt12 Rona, Grindlay and JRK are all Taranaki products.
As someone who sees a lot of 1st XV rugby, particularly Super 8 and CNI, I get to see a lot of the players who now play in the NPC (and SR and ABs). It's also one of the reasons I am happy to see PUs promote local talent instead of signing someone from Aust or Europe.
So for me there is a provincial connection. I acknowledge I will be in the minority.
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@Bovidae said in NPC Crowds:
@gt12 Rona, Grindlay and JRK are all Taranaki products.
As someone who sees a lot of 1st XV rugby, particularly Super 8 and CNI, I get to see a lot of the players who now play in the NPC (and SR and ABs). It's also one of the reasons I am happy to see PUs promote local talent instead of signing someone from Aust or Europe.
So for me there is a provincial connection. I acknowledge I will be in the minority.
Apologies, i didn’t realize Grindlay left and returned.
I like the idea of a ‘local’ connection, but this model just doesn’t work.
And now the gap between NPC > Super > International is getting wider.
I think the crowds will show up for the right product, but right now the product isn’t that. In the short term I think they can just address the location of games to give relevance, but the bigger issues remain.
