Super Rugby - The Future
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@gt12 said in NZR review:
@Chris said in NZR review:
@mariner4life said in NZR review:
as it should. make it a rep comp for club players. it will have genuine meaning again
Well it has to otherwise it is unsustainable to have so many pro teams in NZ.
NZ then will need another SR team to sustain the depth in mo.I can't see them winding up super rugby.
So, it seems pretty clear that Duluth's idea is the best here, make the NPC an amateur competition and split the Super sides roughly down the middle (Southland isn't getting one) so there are about 8-10 of them.
I doubt if NZ can afford more than 5 teams. Or have the quality of players to make up these extra teams
WE don't want to make the mistake that both Aust and SA made. Aust still haven't recovered from it
I believe NZ has an issue that there si no simple solution for. But the solution might be too
Stick with 5 NZ super rugby teams. But ensure all teams are quality
Use some NZ players to improve MP.
Aust reduce to 4 team max.
Start promoting SRP is a professional mannerReduce NPC somehow to 12 teams and reduce the salary cap for these teams
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@Winger said in NZR review:
@gt12 said in NZR review:
@Chris said in NZR review:
@mariner4life said in NZR review:
as it should. make it a rep comp for club players. it will have genuine meaning again
Well it has to otherwise it is unsustainable to have so many pro teams in NZ.
NZ then will need another SR team to sustain the depth in mo.I can't see them winding up super rugby.
So, it seems pretty clear that Duluth's idea is the best here, make the NPC an amateur competition and split the Super sides roughly down the middle (Southland isn't getting one) so there are about 8-10 of them.
I doubt if NZ can afford more than 5 teams. Or have the quality of players to make up these extra teams
WE don't want to make the mistake that both Aust and SA made. Aust still haven't recovered from it
I believe NZ has an issue that there si no simple solution for. But the solution might be too
Stick with 5 NZ super rugby teams. But ensure all teams are quality
Use some NZ players to improve MP.
Aust reduce to 4 team max.
Start promoting SRP is a professional mannerReduce NPC somehow to 12 teams and reduce the salary cap for these teams
I'm interested to know why you think they can't afford 3 more Super sides but can afford 12 NPC sides?
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@gt12 said in NZR review:
I'm interested to know why you think they can't afford 3 more Super sides but can afford 12 NPC sides?
The Salary is a lot more. NPC is just a top up for super rugby players. If super rugby was for a longer season the money would need to be higher still
And the likely of getting rid of the NPC or running it a no cost is so low it can be discounted. And would be a disaster for NZ rugby
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@Winger you think 12 NPC teams would be cheaper too run than 2-3 super teams?
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How long would a Super season ideally be and when should it run. I like the idea of about 20 weeks plus play offs. With an international window. Nine home games and a bye. May be a magic round at Owen Delaney Park. It'd also like to see it delayed until after cricket season starts. Super season starts around Daylight Saving. Club seasons should be aligned to finish prior to the provincial tournament finishing, giving the best opportunity for club teams to make bank at the end of club seasons.
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@Kiwiwomble said in NZR review:
@Winger you think 12 NPC teams would be cheaper too run than 2-3 super teams?
But you won't get rid of NPC. Or make it totally an amateur competition. All the good players would take off overseas
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@SouthernMann said in NZR review:
How long would a Super season ideally be and when should it run. I like the idea of about 20 weeks plus play offs. With an international window. Nine home games and a bye. May be a magic round at Owen Delaney Park. It'd also like to see it delayed until after cricket season starts. Super season starts around Daylight Saving. Club seasons should be aligned to finish prior to the provincial tournament finishing, giving the best opportunity for club teams to make bank at the end of club seasons.
You can hardly fit super rugby plus tests in now
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@Winger said in NZR review:
@Kiwiwomble said in NZR review:
@Winger you think 12 NPC teams would be cheaper too run than 2-3 super teams?
But you won't get rid of NPC. Or make it totally an amateur competition. All the good players would take off overseas
you've literally just said NZ doesnt have the depth for more than 5 super teams...so how "good" can those players be
there is also the point there isn't an infinite number of professional rugby teams overseas looking for players
2-3 super teams to pick up the next level of players...the finge super players...and the NPC is rep team for club level players
i say this as someone whos preference is to ditch super rugby and ramp up the NPC teams....but i realise thats not happening so have to do something
@Winger said in NZR review:
@SouthernMann said in NZR review:
How long would a Super season ideally be and when should it run. I like the idea of about 20 weeks plus play offs. With an international window. Nine home games and a bye. May be a magic round at Owen Delaney Park. It'd also like to see it delayed until after cricket season starts. Super season starts around Daylight Saving. Club seasons should be aligned to finish prior to the provincial tournament finishing, giving the best opportunity for club teams to make bank at the end of club seasons.
You can hardly fit super rugby plus tests in now
you will if it extends into what is now NPC, very few players if any will play both
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@Winger said in NZR review:
@SouthernMann said in NZR review:
How long would a Super season ideally be and when should it run. I like the idea of about 20 weeks plus play offs. With an international window. Nine home games and a bye. May be a magic round at Owen Delaney Park. It'd also like to see it delayed until after cricket season starts. Super season starts around Daylight Saving. Club seasons should be aligned to finish prior to the provincial tournament finishing, giving the best opportunity for club teams to make bank at the end of club seasons.
You can hardly fit super rugby plus tests in now
And that is an issue. We need to have a competition where it does feel like it is the focus. Can't be stuck where everyone who is outside the top 35 players sits with their thumbs up their bum during June and July. We need those guys getting footy in. How do we ensure there is rugby at a decent level for the guys above club footy and below international level.
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@Kiwiwomble said in NZR review:
ou've literally just said NZ doesnt have the depth for more than 5 super teams...so how "good" can those players be
NPC is certainly a level down from super rugby. Blackwell for example was fine at NPC level but clearly not SR level
But take out all of the super rugby players and it would hardly be worth watching. But 16 teams are still far too many.
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@Winger said in NZR review:
@Kiwiwomble said in NZR review:
ou've literally just said NZ doesnt have the depth for more than 5 super teams...so how "good" can those players be
NPC is certainly a level down from super rugby. Blackwell for example was fine at NPC level but clearly not SR level
But take out all of the super rugby players and it would hardly be worth watching. But 16 teams are still far too many.
NZ Rugby needs to be innovative with its provincial rugby approach. Play all games in a location over a weekend. Look at low cost options.
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@SouthernMann said in NZR review:
@mariner4life said in NZR review:
of Plenty
Slap in half-way inbetween and give the team the Taupo. That way the Bay's can have split ownership.
Whakarua Park in Ruatoria seems more appropriate.
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@Winger said in NZR review:
@Kiwiwomble said in NZR review:
ou've literally just said NZ doesnt have the depth for more than 5 super teams...so how "good" can those players be
NPC is certainly a level down from super rugby. Blackwell for example was fine at NPC level but clearly not SR level
But take out all of the super rugby players and it would hardly be worth watching. But 16 teams are still far too many.
too many in what way? they would no longer be funded by NZR...literally having to live within their means, reply on volunteers...so too many for what?
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@mariner4life said in NZR review:
as it should. make it a rep comp for club players. it will have genuine meaning again
The only probelm with that is union would want to win it and spend all their $ on it (and not developing the grass roots) as they are now.
So it doesn't really achieve much.
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From my point of view, it looks like we are making a new NPC starting from the Super franchises. If they get that to 8 (long term 10) and have one premier compeition and actually market it well, then we all get what we want.
A modern NPC with the All Blacks available, a longer season and more tribal afflilation based on region.
As a bonus, NZ Rugby doesn't go broke.
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@SouthernMann said in NZR review:
@gt12 said in NZR review:
@SouthernMann said in NZR review:
@mariner4life said in NZR review:
of Plenty
Slap in half-way inbetween and give the team the Taupo. That way the Bay's can have split ownership.
King Country leaps from Heartland to Super, I love it.
It would be beautiful to see the meltdown.
They play in orange and are called the Vikings.
you need to tag @Nepia whenever you mention the Vikings
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@Kirwan said in NZR review:
From my point of view, it looks like we are making a new NPC starting from the Super franchises. If they get that to 8 (long term 10) and have one premier compeition and actually market it well, then we all get what we want.
A modern NPC with the All Blacks available, a longer season and more tribal afflilation based on region.
As a bonus, NZ Rugby doesn't go broke.
Sounds great, but the fundamental role of a PU must change from trying to win the NPC to developing the grass roots.
This is a massive mindset change that isn't going to be achieved by swapping 3 members of a board.
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@Windows97 said in NZR review:
@Kirwan said in NZR review:
From my point of view, it looks like we are making a new NPC starting from the Super franchises. If they get that to 8 (long term 10) and have one premier compeition and actually market it well, then we all get what we want.
A modern NPC with the All Blacks available, a longer season and more tribal afflilation based on region.
As a bonus, NZ Rugby doesn't go broke.
Sounds great, but the fundamental role of a PU must change from trying to win the NPC to developing the grass roots.
This is a massive mindset change that isn't going to be achieved by swapping 3 members of a board.
Well, if they go to option 1 then no professional players will be in the NPC so if they don't develop grassroots they won't have any players.
Also, the funding is about to be drastically hit as it goes to an amateur comp.
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Which will cause massive numbers of players to leave NZ.
Heck even club players get paid these days, they're all probably going to leave as well.
It's like removing the middle class from society and leaving us with the very rich and very poor, I'm not sure that's going to work well.
(sorry above is my reply to Kirwin - too slow a typer)
