All Blacks 2024
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So, after a tight England series, thoughts?
Props: Scrum good. Defense good. Lineout work not good. Carrying not good. Overall look to be in a pretty good place, but shit we do need some yards out of these blokes.
Hookers. Taylor has been pretty good around the track defensively, still loves a dumb breakdown penalty. But threw poorly. Aumua looked good off the bench but i am not ready to chuck him the keys yet. Not our worst spot.
Locks. SBarrett got shown on Saturday what a real world class lock looks like. He's a trier Scott, but he lacks that bit of class to help separate us from other teams. Patty T was picked to carry, and didn't do it too well. Lineout was a bit shit. Vaa'i has added a bit off the bench in both games, has come a long was since last year. As a unit again not bad without being world beaters, obviously scrumming well but need to suss the fucking lineout.
The tight 5 is the least of our worries it seems. Not dominant, but pretty handy.Loosies. Disjointed is the best word i can come up with. Papali'i had an okay test and a good test. He is what he is, and when he's on like Saturday he's an asset. Sure to start going forward. Savea is a problem. All his weaknesses are really highlighted when the youtube reel shit isn't there to compensate. Two very quiet games, definitely beaten by his opposite. Finau barely fired a shot. Definitely looks hesitant where at the level below he's flat out. Could be instructions or it could be that the game is too quick. Needs to find something and quick. The other options aren't tall enough. If Finau isn't going to carry and hit like in Super season then the whole trio is too weak. Jacobson came on and worked, like he does, but he's no differnece maker at this level. Big area of improvement.
Halfbacks. At expectation. We got what we knew we already had because they are not new. TJ is TJ and will always be TJ. Christie slows the game down and has an average pass. Ratima looked better just because he got the ball out quick and let us play. In my mind decisions to be made, but the coaches may value the experience in South Africa which means the rest of the team will suffer. If our plan is fast and wide, then playing shitty passing halfbacks is an enormous handbrake.
- DMac was what we thought. At the heart of everything good we do. Incredible at getting others in to space, or finding mismatches by drawing players. We're obviously trying to get him the ball in wide channels to use his pace (like how the Crusaders used Mo'unga). Kicked from hand pretty well, brought back the wipers as well. When we get bogged down he battles, and definitely looks worse with ropey ball from 9. Tough as fuck in defense as well.
Midfield. Should be settled, probably isn't. I see the sentiment on here is still "play Reiko on the wing, he can't distribute" even though that is never happening. Looks to me like they are being asked to play narrow and straight to try and give DMac space to loop them and get out wide. Problem is, neither of our midfield are actually great passers of the ball. Jordie passes late, and often very inaccurately, putting everyone under pressure. Reiko is not a natural either. I still think this is our best combination, JB can really carry in traffic, and Reiko has pace. They just need to work out the new system. Defensively they are adequate, but neither rock solid.
Wingers: okay i guess. Reece is a livewire, happy to pin his ears, happy to stick his head over the ball. Telea beats tacklers for fun, but lacks top end pace, and defensively is pretty suspect. I am not sure either should be feeling confident about their place going forward.
Fullbacks: Hand up, very wrong about both these blokes. Perofeta went way better than i thought. Still put himself under pressure unnecessarily at times, but should have set up a try in both games, and looked quite lively in attack. Obviously my "BB is cooked" aged like milk. Ok in the first, but with the same shit we have whinged about for years. The 2nd had a ropey kick, and that skill/luck double kick. But he came on and added a lot. He and DMac always look like they play well together. Two good options. When Jordan comes back he's a wing again?
I don't really see what the plan is except to use DMacs passing to outflank the rush, or to loop him and get him in the wider spaces. Carrying needs work as the English rush defence was sitting guys down as soon as they got the ball. The way the Irish set up their forward runners compared to ours is night and day different.
Defence looks okay, but England got plenty of joy when they put pace on the game, and we are still quite passive. It looked to me like a huge focus on legs tackles rather than dominant hits, which is a big departure from previous years.Great to win 2-0. The Fiji game you would think makes it 3-0 to start. Plenty to work on before a big game in the Republic.
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oh, i just realised/found out we play Argentina at home twice before we play SA in like 7 weeks.
I feel a lot better about that trip now.
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I’m also happy to put my hand up about BB being past it. He looked great off the bench and I think that’s where he should stay - listening to his comments he sounded a bit Piri Weepu in that he was watching what was happening so could come on and tactically influence the game.
You are bang on about our locks, loosies, HBs, and wings. I feel like we have a few placeholders here though - waiting for Lord, Roigard, Jordan. That should mean that we’ll lose Pat T to the bench / competing with Vaii, one of TJ / Christie, and a big call between BB and Perofeta assuming Jordan goes to 15. If Jordan returns at 15, we might need a bigger boot 11/14 so a Narawa comes into play too.
The big area to me looks to be choosing our 6, and then backing them.
If we had Lord back, I can see value in trying Vaii but he’s doing well off the bench, so we give Finau time or go small. It’s just an area of weakness, again. God help us if Frizell is their answer.
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@gt12 said in All Blacks 2024:
If we had Lord back, I can see value in trying Vaii but he’s doing well off the bench, so we give Finau time or go small. It’s just an area of weakness, again. God help us if Frizell is their answer
perhaps playing 6 is far harder than we think, given the false starts here since 2017 (and even before that).
I still think Vaa'i is too slow to play 6. He's a lock, play lock.
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2024:
So, after a tight England series, thoughts?
Props: Scrum good. Defense good. Lineout work not good. Carrying not good.
I've been beating this drum forever. Despite what Ryan says our props offer nothing as ball-carriers, de Groot especially. With PT anonymous we had no go-forward in the tight five. When Slipper is more of a threat carrying the ball, we've got problems. We can't just be relying on the loose forwards to get over the advantage line.
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@Landers92 said in All Blacks 2024:
@Bovidae only 32 going I was told. Hoping to hear some names that aren’t going later today
Been told it’s the original 32 that were selected that are going minus TJ. Sounds like the 4 that were training with them aren’t going. Asked if Hotham was going but wasn’t sure, I would assume he is based off what happened at the position.
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@Bovidae said in All Blacks 2024:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2024:
So, after a tight England series, thoughts?
Props: Scrum good. Defense good. Lineout work not good. Carrying not good.
I've been beating this drum forever. Despite what Ryan says our props offer nothing as ball-carriers, de Groot especially. With PT anonymous we had no go-forward in the tight five. When Slipper is more of a threat carrying the ball, we've got problems. We can't just be relying on the loose forwards to get over the advantage line.
Hard for any ball runners to make the adv line after Christie has a cup of tea before clearing... It was noticeable how the runners were moving onto the ball and making meters, as soon as Ratima got on...
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@mariner4life Pretty fair assessment.
Big Tamaiti can carry - I've been a bit surprised he hasn't been the bench option, but maybe he's still getting up to speed.
Him, Sami T., and Tosi would make a pretty fearsome bomb squad!
Hopefully some further improvement to come from Scott Barrett. He hadn't played for several months. Next year, when we hopefully have Lord, Holland and Darry in the arsenal, we should have a taller and better lineout.
At 6, we really need a legitimate third lineout jumper. If not Finau, then Suafoa, Dunshea and Hannah are guys with the desired dimensions.
When Dunshea burst onto the scene it was playing number 8 vs the British and Irish Lions. Since then he's had a lot of injuries and now seems to have pushed into lock. Dunno whether he's still got the mobility to play 6.
Too early for Hannah, but I don't think he's tall enough to be a test lock.
Telea looks to have lost a yard of pace from last year, whether through injury or hitting the 27 years mark. He needs to re-find it, because we have plenty of good wings.
Rieko's also 27, so no way is he transitioning back to wing. We'll get to see what Proctor can do, but I don't expect him to push out Rieko this year, if at all.
I expect Jordan to return as a fullback. Whether he goes there immediately, or transitions, that's where his long term future will be IMO. This time next year, he'll be 27 as well.
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2024:
I still think this is our best combination,
Two limited passer is fine when the team plays a smash and base forward based game
But thats not what Robertson wants it seems. So, it a poor combination. Esp when we have the option of Proctor where passing is a strength
I also though Perofeta was good the first game. But poor the 2nd. He not a test FB and really needs to focus on 1st
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2024:
Rieko's also 27, so no way is he transitioning back to wing
Maybe on whether it depends on Robertson. Or 2 limited super rugby coaches
As the backline only started to function well when the the reserves came on.
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2024:
Telea looks to have lost a yard of pace from last year, whether through injury or hitting the 27 years mark. He needs to re-find it, because we have plenty of good wings.
Seemed to lose some speed mid season of Super Rugby.
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@Tim said in All Blacks 2024:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2024:
Telea looks to have lost a yard of pace from last year, whether through injury or hitting the 27 years mark. He needs to re-find it, because we have plenty of good wings.
Seemed to lose some speed mid season of Super Rugby.
Maybe he lost speed mid season I don't know, but the guy has always been on the slow side. I am not sure why people are surprised by this.
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@Winger said in All Blacks 2024:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2024:
I still think this is our best combination,
Two limited passer is fine when the team plays a smash and base forward based game
But thats not what Robertson wants it seems. So, it a poor combination. Esp when we have the option of Proctor where passing is a strength
I also though Perofeta was good the first game. But poor the 2nd. He not a test FB and really needs to focus on 1st
i havent had a chance to read through the match thread, was this the consensus for the second test?
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@Kiwiwomble said in All Blacks 2024:
@Winger said in All Blacks 2024:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2024:
I still think this is our best combination,
Two limited passer is fine when the team plays a smash and base forward based game
But thats not what Robertson wants it seems. So, it a poor combination. Esp when we have the option of Proctor where passing is a strength
I also though Perofeta was good the first game. But poor the 2nd. He not a test FB and really needs to focus on 1st
i havent had a chance to read through the match thread, was this the consensus for the second test?
It varies
But he cost a certain try. And his line clearing was poor = poor for me
He was also replaced at 48 minutes and this was the start of the backline transformation. With (almost*) everything going right for Barrett (* one poor clearing kick)
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@Tim said in All Blacks 2024:
@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2024:
Telea looks to have lost a yard of pace from last year, whether through injury or hitting the 27 years mark. He needs to re-find it, because we have plenty of good wings.
Seemed to lose some speed mid season of Super Rugby.
I thought that too ... Was there a niggle or something???
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2024:
Hopefully some further improvement to come from Scott Barrett.
Just rewatching the first half and he is in absolutely everying. Extraordinary motor - so many involvements. I'm very very impressed - missed it live but his workrate is off the charts.
