All Blacks 2024
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@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Machpants said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Windows97 Vai'i plays for the Crusaders? Because that is where your base of learning happens, day to day rugby, not the short sharp fine tuning that happens in limited times with national teams, IMO
Which entirely puts to bed the arguement that it'll be great to have him back so he can mentor the new players as he'll be no use what-so-ever in mentoring the AB locks - unless, per chance they happen to play for the Crusaders.
Good point. And Vai'i did have BBBR? SO what do I know haha
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@akan004 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
Ironical this statement as Vaai has already had years of "learning" off Whitelock and it hasn't really helped has it?
You can't polish a turd.
And if the concern is that "all our locks are turds" (Scooter and Lord aside) - what exactly is the point of bringing in someone specifically to polish them?
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@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@akan004 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
Ironical this statement as Vaai has already had years of "learning" off Whitelock and it hasn't really helped has it?
You can't polish a turd.
And if the concern is that "all our locks are turds" (Scooter and Lord aside) - what exactly is the point of bringing in someone specifically to polish them?
I don't think they are. I see far more potential in Lord, Holland, Beehre, Hannah etc than Vaai.
Vaai in all likelihood is playing to his potential but it's just not good enough for test rugby. He would probably be even worse than he is now if he hadn't been in the same environment as BBBR and SW.
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As far as I recall Razor was known at the Crusaders for leaving no stone unturned in his quest to win. I see his alleged sounding out of Whitelock, and his other moves that have twisted some panties, as a continuation of him turning over stones, seeing what is on offer and building from there.
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@Duluth said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Bovidae said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
NZR must be rolling in cash if they can buy-out these lucrative overseas contracts.
Yeah the details matter
If Pau lets him go out of the kindness of their heart (why would they?) and Whitelock signs to NZR for a lower contract than he was previously on (there's no way he's worth the same as his previous deal now) that's not a huge issue
If NZR was paying for him twice, or whatever break contract fee? Fuck that
That was my point. Whitelock would have been one of the highest earning ABs. It could be a costly transaction.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
This caused an obvious rupture between the incumbent and the incoming coach, to the point where Robertson wasn't even allowed to be present at the AB's games in the RWC...
I actually understood that and it made sense. I equally understand why Schmidt walked - NZR wanted to ditch continuity so we lost Schmidt. But if you want to take a punt and start afresh, you don't go back to 35 yr olds.
I hope this is just the rumour mill, I really do. Robertson has an opportunity to build a long-term team on the core of Foster's RWC finalists but in his own image with plenty of leeway for some cock-ups along the way. He should just get on with it,
This also isn't even true...
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@Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
I really hope these rumours about Robertson tapping up Mo'unga and Whitelock are just that - rumours and bullshit.
Because if a new, much-hyped, forward-looking AB coach at the start of a RWC cycle first instinct is to look to past glories, then we have been sold a fucking big pup.
How many reputations have been made on the back of great players?
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@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Chris said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Windows97 said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
Yeah you want your war horses in the RWC year - not in the year after the RWC.
Not the point more up sides to young players learning off Whitelock a real test lock than Vaai pretending to be one.
Short sighted not looking at the potential overall long term benefits.Ironical this statement as Vaai has already had years of "learning" off Whitelock and it hasn't really helped has it?
If Whitelock is to come back because he's simply better than everyone else playing and deserves to be there on merit that's fine, short sighted consdiering he defiently wont be there come the next RWC but ok.
If he's there with a transition into a coaching role then that's great.
I'm also not sure that the Whitelock we got at the RWC last year is going to be the same Whitelock we get back in 2024. He mentally checked out from the game at the top level to retire - history is littered with atheletes who retired, came back and were a shadow of their former selves.
It just seems to me that time and effort would be better spent on developing the talent we have here.
Vaa’i maybe he couldn’t learn off anyone because was never was up to it as a test player,you ever thought of that.
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@Bovidae said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Duluth said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@Bovidae said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
NZR must be rolling in cash if they can buy-out these lucrative overseas contracts.
Yeah the details matter
If Pau lets him go out of the kindness of their heart (why would they?) and Whitelock signs to NZR for a lower contract than he was previously on (there's no way he's worth the same as his previous deal now) that's not a huge issue
If NZR was paying for him twice, or whatever break contract fee? Fuck that
That was my point. Whitelock would have been one of the highest earning ABs. It could be a costly transaction.
According to the herald, his contact is one year with an option for a second. So no cost to NZR
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@booboo Yup, I see him playing 100+ tests. A true enforcer.
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Lock looks a real problem position for the ABs. We've got Scott Barrett, but beyond it's merely guys with potential.
Bending rules to pick a 36-year old Sam Whitelock at the start of a World Cup cycle would be insane.
Asking his opinion of what he makes of the younger guys and which could compete at Test level or asking if he would be willing to train alongside them for a couple of sessions would be sensible.
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@African-Monkey said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
@booboo Yup, I see him playing 100+ tests. A true enforcer.
Nah can't see him playing more than legends before him.... don't reckon he'll stick around long enough. Off to France in his late twenties...
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Yup, 15 tests this year. That’s nearly 4 months of test weeks alone 😳
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Barratt and Lord are my preferred starting locks but with 15 tests it’s going to be brutal.
God help us if we lose Scooter for any length of time!!
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@DaGrubster said in All Blacks 2024 - looking forward:
Barratt and Lord are my preferred starting locks but with 15 tests it’s going to be brutal.
God help us if we lose Scooter for any length of time!!
Yep, but we will have 4-5 locks in squad, at moment I would go along with Scooter and Lord, but will I think also have Vaai, Tuipoloto, and wonder if they will fill in other spot with a youngster. One I suspect willl be holding a spot until next year when Holland becomes available.
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Yeah, I would go along with that although it wouldn’t surprise me if Vai’i is dumped completely.
Just don’t see what he brings as a player.
If Darry get some game time maybe he is worth investing in. He has the right size that’s for sure.
