Foster, Robertson etc
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@Crucial yes your answer is exactly right.
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Randim recap of the last 2 weeks for me:
Still not 100% convinced by Foster as a coach but after Ellis Park really hope he and the team can kick on. His team has the cojones though.
But am impressed by the way he's carried himself and you can see why the players and coaching staff are incredibly loyal to him. That's a very good thing.
NZR have realized the mess they have made and have started to build bridges with the players. Another a good thing.
Signs the media feeding frenzy has ended.
There's now clarity and stability going forward. Good thing in many ways but just really hope there's a Plan B and risk assessment in place if it's needed.
(Writing this in the garden in Cornwall drinking a a Macon Village and watching shooting stars and talking about NZ rugby. Fuck, we live in a amazing world don't we? )
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Vic had some rain yet? First rain in donkeys in Slough. It's a beautiful thing. Got some red Saharan sand on the roof blown over across the Med What is the world coming to
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@chchfanatic said in Foster:
@Crucial yes your answer is exactly right.
So not shafted, just not eventuated. That, at least, is good management. No use firing Foster if there is no one to take over. And if he didn't get the offer, just a sounding, then no foul. Obviously NZR and Board are a bunch of rugby hating buffoons, by deciding one good game (plus 2 good quarters) out of 7 is a good thing, but at least in this case it was good management.
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@BerniesCorner said in Foster:
Vic had some rain yet? First rain in donkeys in Slough. It's a beautiful thing. Got some red Saharan sand on the roof blown over across the Med What is the world coming to
Loads of rain and spectacular thunderstorms. Waterspouts in Fowey harbour.
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Yep the weather is totally screwed
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Pretty Happy that Schmidt and Ryan will have a big influence going forward. At least they can see from the outside how shit it has been and make changes. The key is Foster listening and letting them make the necesarry changes.
Schmidt's involvement is Foster's idea. He's been trying to bring him on board for two years.
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@BerniesCorner said in Foster:
Vic had some rain yet? First rain in donkeys in Slough. It's a beautiful thing.
I have to assume you mean the rain and not Slough
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An oldie but a goodie. It's actually changing X rail and all that
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@Donsteppa said in Foster:
, in the same way that Brian Lochore arguably did for Laurie's shambolic 1994 All Blacks efforts leading in to the '95 RWC campaign
Forgot about this. Lochore was a great coach. He never really got the credit he deserved for the first RWC win. It sort-of went to Hart and Wylie. At least until neither won when it mattered most
He never really got the credit he deserved for the first RWC win.
Huh? I don't think that is true at all.
I'm with Neps here.
OK. My recollection is that the media was either big Hart or big Wylie fans. And it was having them on board was such a big factor. That only changed later on
But maybe I'm wrong
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@Victor-Meldrew You could have posted that earlier and saved me wading through 350 posts to catch up on this thread.
A thread I had avoided as I assumed it would be same same.
It was.
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@Victor-Meldrew yeah Schmidt had signalled his intentions to step away from Ireland and coaching for a period post 2019 didn't he, but I believe Fozzie still approached him, Brown and maybe another to form his team.
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@taniwharugby said in Foster:
@Victor-Meldrew yeah Schmidt had signalled his intentions to step away from Ireland and coaching for a period post 2019 didn't he, but I believe Fozzie still approached him, Brown and maybe another to form his team.
Yep and I believe NZR did too, well according to Hansen.
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@Rapido I wasn't in favour of Fozzies appointment, but given NZR's mismanagement think the outcome is the best, pragmatic result.
However without wanting to denigrate Razor's achievements or up Fosters this is the Chiefs team that made the 2009 Final
CHIEFS:
FB 15 Mils Muliaina
RW 14 Lelia Masaga
CT 13 Richard Kahui
SF 12 Callum Bruce
LW 11 Dwayne Sweeney
FF 10 Stephen Donald
HB 9 Toby Morland
N8 8 Sione Lauaki
OF 7 Tanerau Latimer
BF 6 Liam Messam
RL 5 Kevin O'Neill
LL 4 Craig Clarke
TP 3 James McGougan
HK 2 Aled de Malmanche
LP 1 Sona Taumalolo
Substitutions:
HK 16 Hika Elliot
LP 17 Joe Savage
RL 18 Toby Lynn
LF 19 Serge Lilo
HB 20 David Bason
FF 21 Mike Delany
RW 22 Sosene AnesiYou could argue he did bloody well to even get them there. Not a shite squad but not the cattle Robertson's had to work with either. The 2009 Bulls were also on a different level to any of the sides Sharky's Crusaders have faced.
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You could argue he did bloody well to even get them there. Not a shite squad but not the cattle Robertson's had to work with either. The 2009 Bulls were also on a different level to any of the sides Sharky's Crusaders have faced.
Yeah, this is where my BOP Mafia streak will come out, and undermine any of my serious points .....
Gotta ask why that squad was so weak. The Chiefs didn't appear to be treated as a serious team of the best talent in the franchise (with drafts to strengthen). It was team that divided rather than united it's franchise support base. A tool to drive playing and coaching talent away from their franchsie partners to retain Waikato's hegemony in their pond rather than Chiefs supremecy in their hemisphere. After 5 years of that treatment it looked like that 2009 squad ...
That old franchise ownership model with the NPC base being major shareholder, or whatever it was. You could say these guys were change makerss. They catalysed the change in franchise ownership, by being so cynically & myopically bad at seeing the greater good.
What was Foster's role in that, assuming the main culprit was the Waikato & Chiefs dual CEO, who I can't remember his name.
Anyway. It all seems so familiar. A fanbase divided. A CEO despised, a coach above his level & not even close to being the best coach in his catchment. Only thing missing is the Glen Jackson's, Colin Bourke's, Vern Cotter's and Joe Schmidt going overseas to gleeful cackles of the CEO as he weaken his near-enemy/partners. Only corresponding modern example would be Laumapae?
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To wind myself back from the conspiracy theory stuff ...
I my time being a rugby fan (since 1982). The succesful All Black coaches were the boring picks. The ones who were also absolutely dominant at NPC (and/or Super 12) level.
Alex Wylie
John Hart
Graham Henry
??? Scott Robertson ???The outliers were Steve Hansen & Brian Lochore.
Hansen - Based on so little head coach experience, but he was assistants at big and successful teams (All Blacks, Canterbury, Crusaders). We had out doubts on here. But, turned out good.
I guess the successful 'funky' pick based on head coaching experience was Brian Lochore. Based on getting huge results from limited talent. But, that isn't really the job description for an All Black coach. That should get you good attention from Scotland or Italy.
Mitchell, Mains - their eras were fun. But ..... based on too short a history, flashes in pan, not dominance, not base don years of winning games they were expected to win.
Smith. Wasn't fun. He found his niche eventually.
Rope, and someone earlier (Watson). I'm too young then to comment. But Rope's teams were quite dominant in 83 , actually 84 away to Aus was a bit ropey (ha, ha, no pun intended). I have no idea of their provincial records or even what provinces they were from.
