RIP Martin Crowe

Donsteppa

Cue MN5 finding another angle to downplay Crowe, before insisting that there's no way he's downplaying one of the best players we've ever had, you Internet Tough Guys.

Virgil

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Donsteppa" data-cid="563527" data-time="1457555809">Cue MN5 finding another angle to downplay Crowe, before insisting that there's no way he's downplaying one of the best players we've ever had, you Internet Tough Guys.</blockquote>
 
If Crowe was Scottish it would be different.

MN5

Shit, what an internet hiding, now I know how davidav and Paarlbok must have felt. Some of you had some very compelling arguments.
 
Without sounding like the ramblings of someone who's taken too many virtual punches and kicks do I dare mention that his test average is not even in the top 63 of all time ? ( I'd expand the stats more but cricinfo is playing up, it stops at 48 ) Is it in the top 100 ?
 
Did you fluffybunnys all miss the point I made when I said he's undeniably a kiwi great. Second name down on the team sheet. That's extremely high praise. 
 
Anyone going to his funeral or are you all playing golf instead ?

Donsteppa

Right on schedule!

dogmeat

Crowes average is 88th in an all time list of batsmen who have played 20 tests or more. Now personally top 100 over nearly 140 years of test cricket is a pretty compelling argument for greatness. Particularly when you accept that anything pre (an arbitrary) 1920 should probably be discounted as it was almost a different game. In addition there have been lots of arguments about the other reasons for Crowes elevation apart from just his average. You yourself MN5 said he's the greatest kiwi batsman of all time. Well not according to his average! Kane and Ross Taylor are both ahead of him and Rigors tucked in just behind. Man, Aquinas would love to have been able to contribute to this thread

MN5

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Donsteppa" data-cid="563579" data-time="1457567296">
<div>
Right on schedule!
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Would have done so a bit earlier but I was out and about, trying to think of something else to say.....ummmmmm he was heaps better than Jeff ?

Virgil

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="dogmeat" data-cid="563582" data-time="1457567730">Crowes average is 88th in an all time list of batsmen who have played 20 tests or more. 
Now personally top 100 over nearly 140 years of test cricket is a pretty compelling argument for greatness. 
Particularly when you accept that anything pre (an arbitrary) 1920 should probably be discounted as it was almost a different game. 
In addition there have been lots of arguments about the other reasons for Crowes elevation apart from just his average. 
You yourself MN5 said he's the greatest kiwi batsman of all time. Well not according to his average! Kane and Ross Taylor are both ahead of him and Rigors tucked in just behind. 
Man, Aquinas would love to have been able to contribute to this thread</blockquote>
 
I wonder how many of those 87 higher ranked test batsman faced Dennis Lillie and Jeff Thompson at age 19 in their maiden test series.

MN5

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Virgil" data-cid="563604" data-time="1457569970">
<div>
I wonder how many of those 87 higher ranked test batsman faced Dennis Lillie and Jeff Thompson at age 19 in their maiden test series.
</div>
</blockquote>
 
My mates wife faced a couple of balls ( amongst other things ) from Jeff Thomson back in the day. My mate is actually much prouder of that than she is and what went on tour stayed on tour......

dogmeat

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Virgil" data-cid="563604" data-time="1457569970">
<div>
I wonder how many of those 87 higher ranked test batsman faced Dennis Lillie and Jeff Thompson at age 19 in their maiden test series.
</div>
</blockquote>
 
 or faced Larwood and Voce bowling bodyline 
or a spofforth off break 
or a Bosanquet googly :huh:
 
I wonder how many of us considered Crowe an all time global great a month ago

MN5

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="dogmeat" data-cid="563607" data-time="1457570482">
<div>
 or faced Larwood and Voce bowling bodyline 
or a spofforth off break 
or a Bosanquet googly :huh:
 
I wonder how many of us considered Crowe an all time global great a month ago 

</div>
</blockquote>
 
An average over 40 in the 70's/80's/90's given the fast bowlers going around is very impressive, I'll freely admit that.

Rancid Schnitzel

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="563577" data-time="1457566662">
<div>
Shit, what an internet hiding, now I know how davidav and Paarlbok must have felt. Some of you had some very compelling arguments.
 
Without sounding like the ramblings of someone who's taken too many virtual punches and kicks do I dare mention that his test average is not even in the top 63 of all time ? ( I'd expand the stats more but cricinfo is playing up, it stops at 48 ) Is it in the top 100 ?
 
Did you fluffybunnys all miss the point I made when I said he's undeniably a kiwi great. Second name down on the team sheet. That's extremely high praise. 
 
Anyone going to his funeral or are you all playing golf instead ?
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Please reflect on those names in bold for a moment. One was a demented Seppo, the other a demented Saffa who believed the Cavaliers were much better than the 87 RWC team. That is the company you now keep.
 
You have only one option to redeem yourself. Apologize profusely for your sacrilege and then self-flagellation with a Martin Crowe signed Duncan Fearnley. Off you go heretic.

MN5

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Rancid Schnitzel" data-cid="563612" data-time="1457571185">
<div>
Please reflect on those names in bold for a moment. One was a demented Seppo, the other a demented Saffa who believed the Cavaliers were much better than the 87 RWC team. That is the company you now keep.
 
You have only one option to redeem yourself. Apologize profusely for your sacrilege and then self-flagellation with a Martin Crowe signed Duncan Fearnley. Off you go heretic.
</div>
</blockquote>
 
I just wanted you guys to like me......

Virgil

Think we have all said a few times averaging 50+ today is like 45+ in the 70s and 80s 
Which is why the stat of Crowe averaging higher than anyone else from 85 to 91 is relevant. 
A favourite stat of mine that MN5 loathes is that if you ignore Crowes early 7 tests ( when he was clearly not ready to face Lillie and Thompson) and his last 4 or 5 tests web he was literally hobbling on 1 leg, his average is over 50. 
Yes you can pick apart any player and make their stats look better. But Crowes circumstances are very much different, especially when you factor his compelling and utter World Class FC record. 15th best of all fucken time.

Donsteppa

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="dogmeat" data-cid="563607" data-time="1457570482">
<div>
 I wonder how many of us considered Crowe an all time global great a month ago
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Me.
 
Following that ABC grandstand interview I learned to reconcile Crowe the player/captain/writer, and Crowe the commentator as two different people.

Rancid Schnitzel

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="563613" data-time="1457571345">
<div>
I just wanted you guys to like me......
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Just imagine how you'd feel if someone told you that Chris Gayle was not a God. Well that's how we all feel right now.

Virgil

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Donsteppa" data-cid="563615" data-time="1457571596">Me. 
Following that ABC grandstand interview I learned to reconcile Crowe the player/captain/writer, and Crowe the commentator as two different people.</blockquote>
I've known Crowe is/was a great since I was 13 years old (1985)

MN5

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Virgil" data-cid="563614" data-time="1457571581">
<div>
Think we have all said a few times averaging 50+ today is like 45+ in the 70s and 80s 
Which is why the stat of Crowe averaging higher than anyone else from 85 to 91 is relevant. 
A favourite stat of mine that MN5 loathes is that if you ignore Crowes early 7 tests ( when he was clearly not ready to face Lillie and Thompson) and his last 4 or 5 tests web he was literally hobbling on 1 leg, his average is over 50. 
Yes you can pick apart any player and make their stats look better. But Crowes circumstances are very much different, especially when you factor his compelling and utter World Class FC record. 15th best of all fucken time.
</div>
</blockquote>
 
I remember the first five or six times you brought that one up. If you ignore all his other tests apart from when he scored 299 at home against a weak Sri Lankan attack his average is really high.

Donsteppa

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Virgil" data-cid="563619" data-time="1457572307">
<div>
I've known Crowe is/was a great since I was 13 years old (1985)
</div>
</blockquote>
 
I always knew, but I lost track briefly following HOLY COW HALF A DOZEN, the four stumps era within Cricket Max, and listening to too many people like MN5 :)

MN5

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Donsteppa" data-cid="563621" data-time="1457572539">
<div>
I always knew, but I lost track briefly following HOLY COW HALF A DOZEN, the four stumps era within Cricket Max, and listening to too many people like MN5 :)
</div>
</blockquote>
 
pffffft, you "like" it when I talk about police shit on the other thread. Don't hate on me cos of my opinion of Martin "the crowd'll tell ya" Crowe ( which is a high opinion all things considered ). 
 
I've NEVER said Gayle is a God much less anything other than a very decent test batsman.

Donsteppa

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="563626" data-time="1457572927">
<div>
pffffft, you "like" it when I talk about police shit on the other thread. Don't hate on me cos of my opinion of Martin "the crowd'll tell ya" Crowe ( which is a high opinion all things considered ). 
 
I've NEVER said Gayle is a God much less anything other than a very decent test batsman.
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Were you a gymnast in a pervious life? A contortionist, perhaps?

The Silver Fern

RIP Martin Crowe