All Blacks 2022
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@african-monkey said in All Blacks 2022:
@dan54 That was just further proof that he didn't give a shit about Super Rugby, making guys like Tevita Li look like world beaters.
Or maybe it's what everyone know? It is not really reasonable to expect players to be on top of game all year? Or simply that he was caught like Taylor and Whitelock going wrong way?
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my main takeaway from that article is
jesus NZ A would suck right now.
The problem is not just their age, it's how they play. Who in our entire tight 5 can sit a guy on his ass in a tackle, or run through him, at test level? I would pretty much say the probably #3 hooker can fucking run, and Ofa can hit (but gets far too many wrong). That's it.
you can extend that to the whole pack. Cane can hit. Not many others can. And not many can run over a bloke (at test level, not Super Rugby, don't fucking start). We have depowered our rugby to play this high tempo skill stuff.
Problem being our skills aren't there, and you don't get to play tempo just because you want to.
At least the last time this happened, Henry came in an took immediate steps. We haven't even started rectifying it. Because we appear to have lost out single-minded purpose as a rugby nation.
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@mariner4life The good news is our new coach identified this problem prior to being appointed.
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2022:
We have depowered our rugby to play this high tempo skill stuff.Problem being our skills aren't there, and you don't get to play tempo just because you want to.
I started typing something out yesterday along the same lines then deleted it because I couldn't be bothered. We are trying to play too fast and we don't have the skills to consistently pull it off.
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@antipodean said in All Blacks 2022:
@mariner4life The good news is our new coach identified this problem prior to being appointed.
remember when we didn't have a hooker so we went and built Dane Coles?
Dane Coles was a very ordinary player even at Super level that someone saw something in. He became a massive point of difference in one of the greatest teams of all time. That didn't happen by accident.
Areas of weakness were identified, and new players were built. Is there any evidence of that happening since 2016?
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2022:
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2022:
@mariner4life The good news is our new coach identified this problem prior to being appointed.
remember when we didn't have a hooker so we went and built Dane Coles?
Dane Coles was a very ordinary player even at Super level that someone saw something in. He became a massive point of difference in one of the greatest teams of all time. That didn't happen by accident.
Areas of weakness were identified, and new players were built. Is there any evidence of that happening since 2016?
Lack of distribution on the wing, and bridge
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2022:
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2022:
@mariner4life The good news is our new coach identified this problem prior to being appointed.
remember when we didn't have a hooker so we went and built Dane Coles?
Dane Coles was a very ordinary player even at Super level that someone saw something in. He became a massive point of difference in one of the greatest teams of all time. That didn't happen by accident.
Areas of weakness were identified, and new players were built. Is there any evidence of that happening since 2016?
Coles was never a very ordinary player - has always had excellent ball skills & a lot of pace, also good in the scrum... he use to have a couple of weaknesses though, for a fair while his lineout throwing was pretty poor & he use to lack discipline giving away too many silly penalties, once he got those things right he become an excellent all-round hooker.
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@nzbloke said in All Blacks 2022:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2022:
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2022:
@mariner4life The good news is our new coach identified this problem prior to being appointed.
remember when we didn't have a hooker so we went and built Dane Coles?
Dane Coles was a very ordinary player even at Super level that someone saw something in. He became a massive point of difference in one of the greatest teams of all time. That didn't happen by accident.
Areas of weakness were identified, and new players were built. Is there any evidence of that happening since 2016?
Coles was never a very ordinary player - has always had excellent ball skills & a lot of pace, also good in the scrum... he use to have a couple of weaknesses though, for a fair while his lineout throwing was pretty poor & he use to lack discipline giving away too many silly penalties, once he got those things right he become an excellent all-round hooker.
No he was too small, and coaches got him to bulk up, and gave him the time to get used to carrying the weight. They accepted he would have a worse year, but we're happy to play the long game. It was all from ABs coaches
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@machpants said in All Blacks 2022:
@nzbloke said in All Blacks 2022:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2022:
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2022:
@mariner4life The good news is our new coach identified this problem prior to being appointed.
remember when we didn't have a hooker so we went and built Dane Coles?
Dane Coles was a very ordinary player even at Super level that someone saw something in. He became a massive point of difference in one of the greatest teams of all time. That didn't happen by accident.
Areas of weakness were identified, and new players were built. Is there any evidence of that happening since 2016?
Coles was never a very ordinary player - has always had excellent ball skills & a lot of pace, also good in the scrum... he use to have a couple of weaknesses though, for a fair while his lineout throwing was pretty poor & he use to lack discipline giving away too many silly penalties, once he got those things right he become an excellent all-round hooker.
No he was too small, and coaches got him to bulk up, and gave him the time to get used to carrying the weight. They accepted he would have a worse year, but we're happy to play the long game. It was all from ABs coaches
Never thought he was too small before he started playing for the ABs, sure he did bulk up a bit, as a lot of players do throughout their careers... he couldn't have added too much weight though to his frame as he's always had the pace of a back, even though 35 now the bloke still shows how much speed he has off the mark.
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@nzbloke said in All Blacks 2022:
@machpants said in All Blacks 2022:
@nzbloke said in All Blacks 2022:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2022:
@antipodean said in All Blacks 2022:
@mariner4life The good news is our new coach identified this problem prior to being appointed.
remember when we didn't have a hooker so we went and built Dane Coles?
Dane Coles was a very ordinary player even at Super level that someone saw something in. He became a massive point of difference in one of the greatest teams of all time. That didn't happen by accident.
Areas of weakness were identified, and new players were built. Is there any evidence of that happening since 2016?
Coles was never a very ordinary player - has always had excellent ball skills & a lot of pace, also good in the scrum... he use to have a couple of weaknesses though, for a fair while his lineout throwing was pretty poor & he use to lack discipline giving away too many silly penalties, once he got those things right he become an excellent all-round hooker.
No he was too small, and coaches got him to bulk up, and gave him the time to get used to carrying the weight. They accepted he would have a worse year, but we're happy to play the long game. It was all from ABs coaches
Never thought he was too small before he started playing for the ABs, sure he did bulk up a bit, as a lot of players do throughout their careers... he couldn't have added too much weight though to his frame as he's always had the pace of a back, even though 35 now the bloke still shows how much speed he has off the mark.
He was too small, it was all up front at the time. ABs coaches and Coles talked about his off season increase. It was planned, and executed, to allow a specific gap too be covered in ABs. And they were happy to take the short term pain for long term gain
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2022:
my main takeaway from that article is
jesus NZ A would suck right now.
The problem is not just their age, it's how they play. Who in our entire tight 5 can sit a guy on his ass in a tackle, or run through him, at test level? I would pretty much say the probably #3 hooker can fucking run, and Ofa can hit (but gets far too many wrong). That's it.
you can extend that to the whole pack. Cane can hit. Not many others can. And not many can run over a bloke (at test level, not Super Rugby, don't fucking start). We have depowered our rugby to play this high tempo skill stuff.
Problem being our skills aren't there, and you don't get to play tempo just because you want to.
At least the last time this happened, Henry came in an took immediate steps. We haven't even started rectifying it. Because we appear to have lost out single-minded purpose as a rugby nation.
The Akira fanboys will be very triggered by this statement
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@crazy-horse said in All Blacks 2022:
We are trying to play too fast and we don't have the skills to consistently pull it off.
Maybe it isn't a lack of skills, per se, but not being able to perform/use those skills under pressure?
Biggest drop-off for me in the last 5 years has been lack of clear thnking under pressure.
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2022:
Areas of weakness were identified, and new players were built. Is there any evidence of that happening since 2016?
Reiko at 13 seems an ongoing project. Like to see him breakthrough in that position this year
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@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks 2022:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2022:
Areas of weakness were identified, and new players were built. Is there any evidence of that happening since 2016?
Reiko at 13 seems an ongoing project. Like to see him breakthrough in that position this year
I can see why they want it. A point of difference in the midfield (his speed) could be the break that unlocks a tight game. He does need to improve his passing (mainly his choice of when to pass and when not to).
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@gt12 said in All Blacks 2022:
@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks 2022:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2022:
Areas of weakness were identified, and new players were built. Is there any evidence of that happening since 2016?
Reiko at 13 seems an ongoing project. Like to see him breakthrough in that position this year
I can see why they want it. A point of difference in the midfield (his speed) could be the break that unlocks a tight game. He does need to improve his passing (mainly his choice of when to pass and when not to).
Yep, work to do there. But I thought his defence at 13 improved a lot as the season went on and he started to get vocal in midfield too.
Coaching staff have handled him and his confidence well
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@gt12 said in All Blacks 2022:
@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks 2022:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2022:
Areas of weakness were identified, and new players were built. Is there any evidence of that happening since 2016?
Reiko at 13 seems an ongoing project. Like to see him breakthrough in that position this year
I can see why they want it. A point of difference in the midfield (his speed) could be the break that unlocks a tight game. He does need to improve his passing (mainly his choice of when to pass and when not to).
Yup, the only reason why he hasn't spent more time there though, is because he's so much quicker and better than everyone else on the wing!
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@bones said in All Blacks 2022:
@gt12 said in All Blacks 2022:
@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks 2022:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2022:
Areas of weakness were identified, and new players were built. Is there any evidence of that happening since 2016?
Reiko at 13 seems an ongoing project. Like to see him breakthrough in that position this year
I can see why they want it. A point of difference in the midfield (his speed) could be the break that unlocks a tight game. He does need to improve his passing (mainly his choice of when to pass and when not to).
Yup, the only reason why he hasn't spent more time there though, is because he's so much quicker and better than everyone else on the wing!
You would assume he wants to play at 13, but the fact he can walk into the starting XV on the wing must be doing his confidence no harm at all.
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@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks 2022:
Biggest drop-off for me in the last 5 years has been lack of clear thnking under pressure.
Totally agree... also the forwards are not giving the backs good platforms to attack from, that all starts with the tight-five.
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@gt12 said in All Blacks 2022:
@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks 2022:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2022:
Areas of weakness were identified, and new players were built. Is there any evidence of that happening since 2016?
Reiko at 13 seems an ongoing project. Like to see him breakthrough in that position this year
I can see why they want it. A point of difference in the midfield (his speed) could be the break that unlocks a tight game. He does need to improve his passing (mainly his choice of when to pass and when not to).
It's not very often he's going to be able to use his speed in a very congested area like the midfield, especially against the better teams... he'll have more chances to use his outstanding pace on the wing, also looks more comfortable playing there.
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2022:
my main takeaway from that article is
jesus NZ A would suck right now.
The problem is not just their age, it's how they play. Who in our entire tight 5 can sit a guy on his ass in a tackle, or run through him, at test level? I would pretty much say the probably #3 hooker can fucking run, and Ofa can hit (but gets far too many wrong). That's it.
you can extend that to the whole pack. Cane can hit. Not many others can. And not many can run over a bloke (at test level, not Super Rugby, don't fucking start). We have depowered our rugby to play this high tempo skill stuff.
Problem being our skills aren't there, and you don't get to play tempo just because you want to.
At least the last time this happened, Henry came in an took immediate steps. We haven't even started rectifying it. Because we appear to have lost out single-minded purpose as a rugby nation.
This is it in a nutshell.
Now, just maybe our coaches realise this and are trying to find a way to play with the cattle we have?
Probably not but it is a possibility. If they can't find the forwards to play like that AND do the other skills necessary at test level then the issues lie either with selection or skills training.
I think we lost a lot when Mick Byrne left. He may have started as a kicking and handling skills coach but he was a great at analysing and coaching techniques.Anyone who has ever played the game at some level will remember a coach telling them that the biggest muscles in their body are their legs and the importance of leg drive in contact. Why don't we see that at the top? Is it a fear of being isolated at the breakdown that is making our coaches tell players to take the tackle and recycle?
The curiosity last year was seeing the type of player we need (Taukei'aho) get initially left out and the selectors not promoting him until injury forced them too
