Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?
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@pakman said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
OK. Let's solve this.
Assume conservative revenue base is $175m p.a..
Sell royalty over 12.5% revenue up to, say, $180m p.a. in a tax efficient fashion, perhaps via pension fund/listed vehicle.
That's $22.5m p.a. income. Let's assume 4.5% yield equals $500m.
Then set up jv with SL whereby SL gets royalty equal to 25% of revenue OVER $180m p.a.. Initial SL investment, say, $30m. Maybe NZR matches that.
NZR gets long term patient capital, significantly higher proceeds, and retains access to SL commercial expertise.
SL gets association with one of sport's greatest teams, reduced investment but enhanced share of the growth it helps to generate.
MUCH BETTER!
And if SL won't play ball it can only suggest there's more to it's existing deal than it's letting on.
Your structure is so much better. Think we have got greedy and don’t realise we are being tucked.
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Read not keen on SL, player's defintely see a different side to the selling of ownership than the 'suits'
From NZH Paywalled - There's a lot more https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/former-all-blacks-captain-kieran-read-reveals-concerns-with-the-silver-lake-deal/NAKNAZB7ECE7EAT7DLK3APYPSQ/
In an interview with Newstalk ZB, asked about the lay of the land in Japan and whether he thought the Olympic Games should go ahead as planned, the 35-year-old revealed he experienced a minor case of Covid-19.
"My club went through Covid – I had it," Read said. "We had a few weeks of isolation.
"It wasn't too bad - there was a day or so of feeling pretty bad and upset then I came good. Half our team got it and it went round quite a few of the clubs so they postponed the season.
"It was quite strange, you would expect us all to have the same strain but we didn't know what it was. Some guys lost taste and smell; some had fevers, some were quite mild, some guys it lasted for a week or so, it depended on the person. I was fine after a couple of days.
"The Japanese people are very compliant. I wore a mask for six months, everywhere I went, everyone does that.
"I've seen the New Zealand Inc proposal and from New Zealand's point of view you've got to seriously look into it and show a little bit of vulnerability and say perhaps there is another viable option, let's genuinely have a look at it because if we don't have a strong robust debate about the options then we're going to be stuck with one which potentially might not have been the best option," Read said.
"In a big decision you can't be shut off and think this is the one way to go. You've got to look at different perspectives. New Zealand Rugby definitely needs to look at this proposal genuinely not just with a grain of salt. The New Zealand public and fans just want it to be resolved in the best way possible that's going to help everyone in the game here.
"The thing that scares me around Silver Lake is that the 12.5 per cent is going to be given to them forever. That scares me a lot because I know they're looking to grow this game, which is what we want to do, then it's a big chunk of what we're making going into that.
"I look at the New Zealand Inc proposal and I personally like it because it's about Kiwis having a slice of the pie they really care about. Money is a big thing, but it's not the be all and end all. It's making sure we grow the game as best we can. There's only so much money can do. People in New Zealand are willing to do with the most they can with what's given to them."
The $387 million windfall aside, one of the arguments for the Silver Lake deal is the capability and established contracts the US firm is expected to bring in regards to potentially doubling NZ Rugby's annual revenue through monetising offshore fans.
Read, however, believes NZ Rugby could instead use the Players' Association proposal to hire that expertise.
"It's giving you a good chunk of money to go out and get these people who can have that reach around the world. That's what Silver Lake are going to do – they're not doing it themselves. They're going out and getting those people. We know how strong the All Blacks brand is, what it can do and the doors it can open, so if you go and leverage it you've got the money to have those conversations if need be."
Despite an extensive process which involved NZ Rugby engaging Jefferies banking group and commissioning an independent PWC report that was presented to the 26 provincial unions, who then voted unanimously in favour of the Silver Lake proposal at the recent AGM, Read believes alternatives were not thoroughly explored.
"The Players' Association probably don't think New Zealand Rugby did their full due diligence and looked at this proposal genuinely prior to signing with Silver Lake. New Zealand Rugby have decided this is going to give us the most money so go with this. The big thing here is making sure they sit down and trust each other to be honest. The only way to do it is sitting down and making sure you grind it out with each other. Hopefully that's going to happen."
At heart of the ugly, ongoing public standoff between NZ Rugby and the Players' Association is a feeling the players were not included early enough in the process.
"It's pretty easy to see that's how it should have been done," Read said. "That's how it's supposed to be done in terms of the collective and it would probably have stopped all this airing of the laundry out in the public and potentially offered New Zealand Rugby some genuine options they could have looked at before going down this pretty long tunnel of Silver Lake without all these different options that could have come their way."
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I’m sure it’s already been mentioned, but this part has me wondering whether it’s all Yank bullshit.
The $387 million windfall aside, one of the arguments for the Silver Lake deal is the capability and established contracts the US firm is expected to bring in regards to potentially doubling NZ Rugby's annual revenue through monetising offshore fans.
Apart from having those bs games in Boston that we love so much, how on earth are they suddenly going to double the revenue? What do these geniuses (who no doubt have a strong understanding and commitment to the sport of rugby) have up their sleeve that’s worth handing over 12.5% of revenue for. And I understand that’s in perpetuity right?
As other posters have already mentioned, with money so ridiculously cheap right now why not take out a loan if they do desperately need the cash. The interest would be far lower than handing over revenues until the end of time.
I could have my wires completely crossed here so feel free to have a kick, but this does seem like a pretty stupid deal. I keep coming back to what SL will actually be able to do for NZ rugby and whether they can actually increase revenues to such an extent that this deal makes sense.
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It's a dream deal isn't it? An eighth of all revenue (not profit!) for the rest of time for only $387 million upfront.
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@bovidae said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
Silver Lake are behind the UFC so I assume maximising the worldwide PPV audience is one of the main potential income streams.
As to taking out a loan, NZR has stated why that isn't possible - they have no assets to secure the loan against.
That all sounds good but how are they going to achieve that? UFC is a simple concept - two guys (or girls) beating each other in a cage. Not even the so-called experts understand rugby half the time yet apparently masses of people will suddenly be convinced to part with their hard earned to watch it? It’s not going to happen.
Fair enough on the loan thing, but we see that there are other ways of raising cash without handing over 12.5% of revenues forever. Still trying to get my head around how that can be a good deal.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
@bovidae said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
Silver Lake are behind the UFC so I assume maximising the worldwide PPV audience is one of the main potential income streams.
As to taking out a loan, NZR has stated why that isn't possible - they have no assets to secure the loan against.
That all sounds good but how are they going to achieve that? UFC is a simple concept - two guys (or girls) beating each other in a cage. Not even the so-called experts understand rugby half the time yet apparently masses of people will suddenly be convinced to part with their hard earned to watch it? It’s not going to happen.
Fair enough on the loan thing, but we see that there are other ways of raising cash without handing over 12.5% of revenues forever. Still trying to get my head around how that can be a good deal.
Oh god, if the longhaired tightly bollocked over-roided UCF 'style' came to rugby.. I shudder..
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@antipodean said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
It's a dream deal isn't it? An eighth of all revenue (not profit!) for the rest of time for only $387 million upfront.
@Bovidae Silver Lake are behind the UFC so I assume maximising the worldwide PPV audience is one of the main potential income streams.And if they can use their contacts (i.e. other businesses in which they invest) to help us do that, they'll get more revenue through getting those businesses to contribute to our costs, and they won't give a fuck whether we make 1% or 30% profit as long as we stay in business.
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@antipodean were all experts eh..only relaying what I was told …
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Another take on Reado's comments.
Maybe we didn't need to look for an ancient ex AB to try and talk sense into the parties. Just a newly retired one.
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@bovidae said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
Silver Lake are behind the UFC so I assume maximising the worldwide PPV audience is one of the main potential income streams.
As to taking out a loan, NZR has stated why that isn't possible - they have no assets to secure the loan against.
But why do they need $387m now. Putting money into reserves earns you nothing?
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@kev said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
@bovidae said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
Silver Lake are behind the UFC so I assume maximising the worldwide PPV audience is one of the main potential income streams.
As to taking out a loan, NZR has stated why that isn't possible - they have no assets to secure the loan against.
But why do they need $387m now. Putting money into reserves earns you nothing?
Didn't they used to earn money on reserves with investments in currency?
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@kirwan said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
@kev said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
@bovidae said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
Silver Lake are behind the UFC so I assume maximising the worldwide PPV audience is one of the main potential income streams.
As to taking out a loan, NZR has stated why that isn't possible - they have no assets to secure the loan against.
But why do they need $387m now. Putting money into reserves earns you nothing?
Didn't they used to earn money on reserves with investments in currency?
They would have protected against movements where exposed but damn sure they wouldn’t be trading.
That’s the type of shit which brings down businesses.
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@crucial said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
Another take on Reado's comments.
Maybe we didn't need to look for an ancient ex AB to try and talk sense into the parties. Just a newly retired one.
He's talking shit tho, "New Zealand Rugby to me is saying ‘this is the right option, it’s all we’ve looked at, , this is going to give us our best options’" NZR have looked at loads off other options. A slight finger on the pulse would make that obvious
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@kev said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
@kirwan said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
@kev said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
@bovidae said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
Silver Lake are behind the UFC so I assume maximising the worldwide PPV audience is one of the main potential income streams.
As to taking out a loan, NZR has stated why that isn't possible - they have no assets to secure the loan against.
But why do they need $387m now. Putting money into reserves earns you nothing?
Didn't they used to earn money on reserves with investments in currency?
They would have protected against movements where exposed but damn sure they wouldn’t be trading.
That’s the type of shit which brings down businesses.
I just remember them making a decent amount on something they did with how they got paid and what currency it was held in.
Like Homer, I’ve learned something and it’s pushed shit out of my brain.
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@kirwan said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
@kev said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
@kirwan said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
@kev said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
@bovidae said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
Silver Lake are behind the UFC so I assume maximising the worldwide PPV audience is one of the main potential income streams.
As to taking out a loan, NZR has stated why that isn't possible - they have no assets to secure the loan against.
But why do they need $387m now. Putting money into reserves earns you nothing?
Didn't they used to earn money on reserves with investments in currency?
They would have protected against movements where exposed but damn sure they wouldn’t be trading.
That’s the type of shit which brings down businesses.
I just remember them making a decent amount on something they did with how they got paid and what currency it was held in.
Like Homer, I’ve learned something and it’s pushed shit out of my brain.
I remember the same. Must have had some overseas denominated contracts which they took a position on. Trading with reserves would be different.
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@machpants said in Silver Lake buying a stake in the ABs?:
He's talking shit tho, "New Zealand Rugby to me is saying ‘this is the right option, it’s all we’ve looked at, , this is going to give us our best options’" NZR have looked at loads off other options. A slight finger on the pulse would make that obvious
What are the other options? What is the do nothing at this point option?
I'm still yet to see why this influx of capital is necessary. If the straits are so dire could we see at least some rationalization of the bloated professional system.
Even if it were the case that there is some magical way to increase revenues - why does this require vast amounts of capital? The All Blacks are not a resource company that needs to sink billions into a new oil field or coal mine which they will make back over the decades to follow. What possible revenue stream requires any major capital investment - this is an organization which has players play rugby games?
The one possible exception would be if the NZRU were in a crap stadium situation and had massive attendance. Then you could make the case for building a stadium they own which would generate massive additional revenue each year( think England without Twickers, if they had to hand over a big % to the FA every test playing at Wembley) - but that is not even close to the case here.
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@rotated I'm not going to Google all the articles and media releases where NZR listed the options they and their investment team went through. And it includes 'do nothing and go under cos we can't compete with NH wages and grass roots is dying'. But they looked at them, including a version of what the players are suggesting. It came down to silver lake was the best and that was presented to the Unions - who unanimously agreed.
Now I'm not saying it is the best option, I don't know, but to accuse the NZR of just going straight to SL without looking at anything else is utter bollocks ~ Read should be fucking ashamed to spout such bullshit, unless he's lying on purpose. It is showing no respect for a body that had done amazingly well financially over the professional period. No other RU had come close to doing as well as NZ. No other Union had anything close to a big cash buffer like we did when covid hit. Fucks sake, the so called richest Union England had splashed all it's money on random artificial turf throughout the country and was cutting costs and posts before covid hit!
So have a Google for NZR statements, they list all the options they investigated. And read should apologize for talking crap before he actually did some research
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@machpants the threat of players wages is over stated. We are not at some sort of crisis or tipping point. Sure it’s been a trend but they don’t need $380m and selling 12.5% of your revenue for ever is stupid. No one does that.
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