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Teflon Don confounds Democrats
Democrats have attacked the president every which way, but polling and focus groups show none of it's working.
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The research, conducted by private firms and for Democratic campaign arms, is rarely made public but was described to POLITICO in interviews with a dozen top operatives who’ve been analyzing the results coming in.
“If that’s the attitude that’s driving the Democratic Party, we’re going to drive right into the ocean,” said Anson Kaye, a strategist at media firm GMMB who worked on the Obama and Clinton campaigns and is in conversations with potential clients for next year.
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http://www.politico.com/story/2017/09/13/teflon-trump-democrats-messaging-242607
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Trump has REALLY messed up over this DACA thing by giving the appearance of siding with the Democarts and betraying his campaign promise over immigration.
If he doesn't backtrack very thoroughly and very quickly, it will be the end for him.
Politically stupid, his radar has gone wonky. His base was his strength. -
I wonder how Trump can frame his immigration policy tweaking alongside the stats around the current and estimated productivity of the DACA group?
Isn't it about bringing in the right kinds of people if there is a need for immigration? The link to supporting the Dems won't go down well - potentially enough mud sticking to make the economic arguments a minor factor.
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Do you think he's made a one off error of judgement or is he reverting to type?
I think the later. Ignoring his flirtations with the Reform Party he has largely agreed with Democrats throughout his life and has consistently donated to them.
In 2012 he described a Romney's fairly moderate immigration policy as "mean spirited" and "maniacal". He then went on to make the case for amnesty..Not many people in their late 60's have fundamental changes in view point like Trump apparently did on so many issues.
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@Duluth said in US Politics:
Do you think he's made a one off error of judgement or is he reverting to type?
I think the later. Ignoring his flirtations with the Reform Party he has largely agreed with Democrats throughout his life and has consistently donated to them.
In 2012 he described a Romney's fairly moderate immigration policy as "mean spirited" and "maniacal". He then went on to make the case for amnesty..Not many people in their late 60's have fundamental changes in view point like Trump apparently did on so many issues.
Maybe an error of judgement by returning to type?
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And the NFL players and administrators play right into Trump's hands. Can't people put aside their TDS and just ignore him?
That Turei bitch could become PM and introduce a Marxist state, but I still wouldn't disrespect the anthem and country by taking a knee.
At the end of the day Trump doesn't give a shit about the players or owners, but the fans. What do you reckon they think of all this.
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No doubt it's getting blown out of proportion by the mainstream news outlets, as they absolutely thrive on controversy. I imagine the majority of American's wouldn't really give a shit either way, but would far prefer the NFL didn't make political statements given:
- Most people watch sports for entertainment, and to escape things like Politics.
- The NFL has received over $1B in federal subsidies, so really should not be picking sides.
- Using the anthem and the flag to make your point is not going to endear you to many people, given how patriotic many American's are.
Of course Trump has fanned the flames, but he's very much a symptom of this insanity, not the cause.
It's really just another example of how divisive Identity Politics is. I bet the ideologues at Universities are enjoying watching people tear each other apart based on the Marxist ideas they've been pushing.
Also, the ongoing virtue signalling by people that have made millions thanks to the system they claim to rally against is pretty disgusting. These guys get paid outrageous sums of money to play a fricken game, and they're complaining about oppression? Really?
The USA has plently of real problems that need addressing, but thanks to a large chunk on the left buying into Identity Politics, the tribalism is increasing and people are attacking each other based on skin colour, which is absolutely nuts.
If I had to summarize the SJW movement, I'd say is it resentfulness disguised as compassion. As I said, no doubt this stuff is being blown out of proportion, but it's starting to have a real impact now.
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It's a good point. I don't see a win here for anti-Trumpers. He's already got my GOP friends posting like crazy on FB - the same people who would claim that the USA is the freeest country in the world.
Of course, they seem to have forgotten what supposedly makes it so fucking star-spangled-banner fucking awesome is supposedly just that freedom. Even though, personally, I think taking a knee is a bit ridiculous - I also can't see why people care. The irony is fun though, especially with my friend who identifies as a libertarian.
Btw, (genuine question) are the 'free speech' people having to tie themselves in knots about this? Any supporters (or at least not carers) from the people we often see cited in the religion (etc. thread)?
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I agree with much of that, but isn't this equally a situation where if you are for free speech (as I assume you are), then you'd be permissive of this action (regardless of whether you disagree with the purpose)?
On my hand, I'm wondering about my hypocrisy here. I've suggested in the past that it's fine for people to be fired if their actions are perceived to negatively influence their company (see Milo). So, in this case I don't have much choice but to celebrate people who oppose it being able to loudly disagree with the 'take knee-ers' and also put pressure on companies to fire them. I disagree, but I have to admit that they have that right.
But, does anyone think this is worth that, though?
Personally, I think it's a bit funny that their anthem gets pulled out, everywhere. It's not like it's an international fixture.
And then there is Trump. He's on a winner with his base, but is any of that making him a better president?
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@gt12 said in US Politics:
It's a good point. I don't see a win here for anti-Trumpers. He's already got my GOP friends posting like crazy on FB - the same people who would claim that the USA is the freeest country in the world.
Of course, they seem to have forgotten what supposedly makes it so fucking star-spangled-banner fucking awesome is supposedly just that freedom. Even though, personally, I think taking a knee is a bit ridiculous - I also can't see why people care. The irony is fun though, especially with my friend who identifies as a libertarian.
Btw, (genuine question) are the 'free speech' people having to tie themselves in knots about this? Any supporters (or at least not carers) from the people we often see cited in the religion (etc. thread)?
You can still support free speech while criticising how someone may express that right. At the end of the day, regardless of your right of free expression, it's never a great look when multimillionaire sportsmen protest against the very system that made them so successful.
With all the shit going down in my life, one of the few joys is being able to watch the Canes and All Blacks for a couple of hours each week. Fucked if I'd say that if every anthem involved bullshit political statements or the pre and post match reports involved politics and all that crap.
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@rancid-schnitzel said in US Politics:
@gt12 said in US Politics:
With all the shit going down in my life, one of the few joys is being able to watch the Canes and All Blacks for a couple of hours each week. Fucked if I'd say that if every anthem involved bullshit political statements or the pre and post match reports involved politics and all that crap.
Perhaps that is their point though? An opportunity to force relatively well-off patrons to consider the wider socio-economic situation of other citizens?
I'm not saying that I agree with it (because I suspect it hardens attitudes), but I guess that is why they do it.
And, on the multi-millionaires part - that's true. But, most of these guys came from nothing and still have many friends and family in exactly the situation they are protesting. I'll try to post a link about that in a bit if I can find it.
Edit: from Eric Reid (most won't like the source, but it's his opinion piece)
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@gt12 said in US Politics:
@rancid-schnitzel said in US Politics:
@gt12 said in US Politics:
With all the shit going down in my life, one of the few joys is being able to watch the Canes and All Blacks for a couple of hours each week. Fucked if I'd say that if every anthem involved bullshit political statements or the pre and post match reports involved politics and all that crap.
Perhaps that is their point though? An opportunity to force relatively well-off patrons to consider the wider socio-economic situation of other citizens?
I'm not saying that I agree with it (because I suspect it hardens attitudes), but I guess that is why they do it.
And, on the multi-millionaires part - that's true. But, most of these guys came from nothing and still have many friends and family in exactly the situation they are protesting. I'll try to post a link about that in a bit if I can find it.
And what difference are these protests making exactly? How are the lives of the friends and relatives still in the Hood being improved? It's complete bullshit that's doing nothing but alienate the fans. Don't even get me started on that Kaepernick tosser and his pig police socks.
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I don't know.
But, we are discussing here in NZ, so it's certainly generated discussion.
However, as I've mentioned, I don't see it necessarily being effective a- because most discussion is about the protest itself, rather than the rationale for it.
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I thought Trump's comments were dumb. Even if it might play out to his base it just needlessly fueled the flames. Multi-millionaire sportsman have the right to spit in the face of the country that gave them so much and pretend they really are the victims here, just as fans have the right to tell them to go fuck themselves. I see some are dragging out stories now of the kneelers who are also accused of physical and sexual assault. You want some spotlight, here you go enjoy. Everyone loses, and Trump has just made it worse.
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@rembrandt said in US Politics:
I thought Trump's comments were dumb. Even if it might play out to his base it just needlessly fueled the flames. Multi-millionaire sportsman have the right to spit in the face of the country that gave them so much and pretend they really are the victims here, just as fans have the right to tell them to go fuck themselves. I see some are dragging out stories now of the kneelers who are also accused of physical and sexual assault. You want some spotlight, here you go enjoy. Everyone loses, and Trump has just made it worse.
Totally agree. It was needless provocative shit from Trump, but it was even stupider that the NFL administrators and players fell right into his trap. It happens time and time again. When will people ever learn.
US Politics