RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1)
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@sparky said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Amazing to think the side that demolished the All Blacks on Saturday were the same lot as conceded 38 consecutive points to Scotland in March:
World Cups in September/October aren’t won in March.
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@ACT-Crusader Indeed. That is the lesson. Eddie Jones' made sure his team has kept learning over the last 2 years that is for sure.
It was an odd game as well. England demolished Scotland in the first 35 minutes. Whatever it said on the scoreboard, England were better than that. Then they obviously relaxed a bit and back Scotland came.
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@pakman said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@gt12 said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@MiketheSnow said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@Nepia said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@Victor-Meldrew said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Cane would have made a difference.
Also think he adds a lot in the leadership department - sadly lacking today.
Yeah, it's utter BS to pretend Cane wouldn't have made a difference when starting even if the result stayed the same - we have a much better chance of a win if he starts.
Agreed.
But S Barrett is the fall guy for a very shit Read performance and captaincy.
Unfair IMHO.
Excellent point.
I think Read has been a great All Black, but he is no legend - his five missed tackles (ESPN stats) tell the story of a guy who is either injured or past it. If he was amazing last week against a shit Ireland, how can he be amazing - with those stats - against England? He ran OK (25 metres off of 8 runs), but his captaincy tonight was pretty appalling - he and the team looked lost. He's been surviving on being McCaw's successor and tonight showed that it's all for shit. We were under pressure., but this wasn't 2011 8-7, this was a hammering, and he was front and center missing tackles.
Maybe he was carrying an injury?
Perhaps, in which case I'd have preferred us to have had real 8 cover there, like Steven Luatua, who we could have kept in the country if we'd ever considered that happening at a WC. Of course, we could have easily put Ardie there for this game with Cane at 7. If he was injured - that badly - I'd have a bit less respect for him as he should put the jersey and the prize first. Had we won, he'd have captained us in a final.
I know that sounds contrite, but there has only ever been one AB good enough - in the modern era - to play through injury, and he's been retired since 2015 - strangely enough - the last time we won the cup.
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@ACT-Crusader said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@sparky said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Amazing to think the side that demolished the All Blacks on Saturday were the same lot as conceded 38 consecutive points to Scotland in March:
World Cups in September/October aren’t won in March.
Yeah never understood it. All Blacks would put 60 points on Scotland.
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@pakman You must have been at the game......is all I can think of....
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@Jailbreak7 said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
@pakman You must have been at the game......is all I can think of....
Just like Dublin 1991, Ellis Park 1995, Twickenham 1999, Sydney 2003, and Cardiff 2007.
I see a pattern emerging.
BUT in my defence was ALSO at 2011 and 2015 finals!
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This from Reddit -
Pretty happy we didn’t vote for this flag right about now
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@Daffy-Jaffy I'm too dense, what?
Oh the arrow? Only works if it was enveloping the black not the red
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As expected. England got fined for advancing over the half way during the haka. Apparently less the the 2500 opunds France got in 2011, as that was all the team. Ridiculous since World Rugby promoted it as awesome on social media.
But Rules is Rules, I guess
Dane Coles has the best lines:
"They earn a shitload of money so they'll be able to pay the fine," Coles said with a chuckle. "They're a pretty wealthy union so they can take the hit.
"I thought it was awesome, that's what the haka is about, it's a challenge. They walked forward. I know all the boys were pumped for it we were looking around like 'let's go'.
"From an All Blacks perspective we didn't think it was bad. We thought it was awesome."
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Composure by Michael Lynagh:
Ireland 18 - Oz 19 RWC Quarter 1991
“I’d taken over the captaincy as Nick (Farr-Jones) had gone off injured. I knew I had to come up with something precise and factual. I was determined not to resort to the cliche of, ‘don’t panic, don’t worry’. There were no clocks at the ground so I asked referee Jim Fleming how long there was to go. Four minutes, came the reply. So, that’s what I said to the boys. I stuck to the facts. ‘Four minutes, still time, we’ll kick long from the restart, press, they’ll kick out and we’ll strike from the lineout’. In fact, Nick told me only the other week that he’d have kicked short to contest the ball if he had still be on the field and captain. So, there we are – what might have been.”
What was is that Ireland scrum-half Rob Saunders sliced his clearance, Australia had a lineout around the 22-metre line, David Campese took it up and was on hand later in the sequence but was tackled. Lynagh’s role had been to track play. He swooped and dived over the line.
QED
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@kiwiinmelb said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Saying read has a tight calf , didn’t train , spent the morning on the bike in the gym
I wonder if this was an issue in the game last week?
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Shameful hindsight now but I would have preferred bowing out to England while still testing the "experience wins you world cups" hypothesis.
I only learnt of the hypothesis from Ted and Shag and last night it got a tick with Bender, SBW Crotty and Cane all showing that old legs can be overcome easier than new heads.
Surely one of those four would have changed the leadership malaise last week. A combination of them had to have helped.
Hindsight, fuck it
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@Siam said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Shameful hindsight now but I would have preferred bowing out to England while still testing the "experience wins you world cups" hypothesis.
I only learnt of the hypothesis from Ted and Shag and last night it got a tick with Bender, SBW Crotty and Cane all showing that old legs can be overcome easier than new heads.
Surely one of those four would have changed the leadership malaise last week. A combination of them had to have helped.
Hindsight, fuck it
When the shit hits the fan , old heads are less likely to panic ,
The worst part of that game for me now in hindsight, although it was all england in the first half , the comeback was well and truely on after the savea try , yet we played like the wallabies, looked nervous and panic stricken .It was unlike the Allblacks.
Maybe with all the old heads out there, there may have been more composure
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@gt12 said in RWC: England v New Zealand (SF1):
Jordie Barrett on the bench in place of Ben Smith seems criminal now.
Not starting Sam Cane was criminal.
Crotty yesterday also reminded us why he and ALB might still have been our best midfield. But four into three doesn’t work.
Crotty instead of SBW might have given us more brains and helped Richie out of his deer in the headlights state.
So the selections were half of it, tactics from the coaches were found wanting too.
Time for a fresh start. Could argue it’s the first time since 2004, thats exciting in itself.
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Perhaps the most shocking thing was that AB pack didn't see fit to grind things out for a while. Not as though there weren't enough Crusaders there (5)?!
At end, BFA to come on with 25 to go was a no brainier.
Not sure TWM ever sorted midfield conundrum. Given RWC knockout I'd have wanted Crotty on field at end. Goodhue was excellent but maybe not 100% so seems starting the only option for him. Could have done with big unit at 12 to start, which means SBW. And can argue both ways for Crotty.
So SBW and any one of other three to start. If Crotty then ALB bench, and vice versa. If Goodhue, then Crotty bench.
In other words, almost any other option to the one taken!
