Springboks V All Blacks
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@chris-b said in Springboks V All Blacks:
Hansen (and Henry before him) have constantly beaten the "You can't beat experience in the big games" drum, so I reckon the chances of them heading to RWC with their first choice starting XV including all of Mo'unga, ALB, Goodhue and Rieko is about nil.
You know how some of us are reminded of a game won 6-3 vs Australia before the 1991 RWC.
Well the result of that game was to enter the Cup using experience as the primary selection criterion. It turns out, that the experienced players were past their prime though, and the strategy failed badly.
We've also had quite a few examples of complete novices turning it on for us at RWC games. NMS last one.
Experience is good. Except when the other player is better.
Shag uses it because he's not stupid. It allows him to justify the player he's already picked, rather than a guy who's having a single stellar season. Saying he values experience means he can keep a settled squad. But he's only too happy to ditch experience when he prefers someone, and elevate a DMac say to start over much more experienced players.
Surely then the solution anyway is to play Mo'unga more. Otherwise we are one injury away from him having to pull out an Aaron Cruden in RWC knockout stages -- and while it just worked for us that time, we got lucky.
Beauden Barrett hasn't covered himself with glory in the tight games. The solution isn't to keep playing him and hope it'll all just come right.
On the others --
I personally think ALB has plenty enough experience.
You're going to be a lone voice here suggesting Goodhue isn't up to it.
Ioane is more experienced than Frizzell at least. For #6 all our options really lack experience, so I'd pick the best one, not one with a trifle more experience.
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@crucial said in Springboks V All Blacks:
Funny how it has taken this long for everyone to realise that BB is not the type of 10 we require for a tight game that needs control and measured tactics.
It has been being pointed out for years that he is not a game managing 10.Yea wow crucial, literally no one else has been saying exactly that in the past...
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@mariner4life said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@crucial said in Springboks V All Blacks:
Funny how it has taken this long for everyone to realise that BB is not the type of 10 we require for a tight game that needs control and measured tactics.
It has been being pointed out for years that he is not a game managing 10.Yea wow crucial, literally no one else has been saying exactly that in the past...
I didn’t say no one.
Whenever the subject cane up though, there were always plenty of BB10 defenders. -
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For what it’s worth, Sam Whitelock is first picked in my team. Along with Moody, Taylor, Franks, Read, Scott Barrett....
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@act-crusader Good to be back!
I'm clearly late to this discussion, but some quick and random thoughts:
- A Smith seems well off the boil of late (the difference to Faf was stark), any thoughts as to whether this is a 9-10 combination thing or something more sinister? Would be interesting to see him inside Richie for 70mins
- Midfield - I don't have the answer to the SBW/Goodhue/ALB/Crotty/Laumape conundrum, but I do know that we are 12 months out from a RWC and I seem to recall tournaments past where we entered RWC's with an unsettled midfield. I'm of a mind that we need pin our colours to a mast soon and run with it for the next 12 months for better or worse. Combinations are king.
- Jeez we miss BBBR
- I'd give my left nut to be a fly on the wall and hear Shag and the team discuss pre/post-mortem tactics for the game just gone. Do they genuinely believe that kicking that much ball away is the way to play/ That the cross-kick to the touchline is a good option when you finally get possession after defending for 5 minutes? I don't buy the arrogant "putting ourselves under pressure" line, but how can these possibly be sensible tactics?
- I'm a big fan of finishing a game with Richie at 10, BB at 15 and Bender on the wing - but I'm totally torn as to whether we should we start with that
- Sam Cane - fark, what a beast. Nothing flashy about that man, just body on the line all night long. Hope he's OK
- Ardie - way to step up the last 2 games, O for Awesome that man
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@rocky-rockbottom said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@voodoo said in Springboks V All Blacks:
@act-crusader Good to be back!
Would be interesting to see him inside Richie for 70minsDoesn't need that long afterdavid
ahhhhhhh
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Finally found a minute to comment on this game. And what i really want to say is:
Fuck you All Blacks.
Seriously, when are you guys going to learn to lose?!
You spoiled a good game of rugby because after 10 years, you still haven't properly leant the skill of losing a rugby game.
note: the smiley face is just insurance before one of you takes the above comments all wrong...Bloody dramatic game. Gutted to be on the wrong side of the result. But probably balances the books a bit if one recalls Wellington. Still work to do for the Boks. But pleasingly they at least keep learning. And the big lesson of the day... you need a bench that delivers. BIG difference on the day.
@ Sam Kane: hope you make a swift and full recovery. You're a pain-in-the-ass to play against. Respect.
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@crucial said in Springboks V All Blacks:
Funny how it has taken this long for everyone to realise that BB is not the type of 10 we require for a tight game that needs control and measured tactics.
It has been being pointed out for years that he is not a game managing 10.I think the "defenders" mainly pointed out that he was still the best 10 in the country. Sops form fell off a cliff and he buggered off, DMac has no game management, and Mo'unga has only come of age as a consistent player at the top level this year. Otherwise the cupboard has been bare, and it's not like Beauden has struggled - when on form he's turned tight tests into blowouts.
Now we have a more traditional 10 in Mo'unga it will be interesting to see where Beauden fits in. Most (all?) on here agree he's not a perfect fit for 10 but he must be on the field as he's an absolute freak of a rugby player. I said earlier in the thread my preference is for Mo'unga to start at 10, Beauden 15 and DMac off the bench - I think that maximises all three players talents.
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@kirwan said in Springboks V All Blacks:
Other option is DMac on the wing instead of Naholo
Yes I would go for that. I prefer having a second fullback in the back three and Jordie's form has dipped.
He would still be involved in back field runs, picking out slower defenders, and he can drift into first receiver often. You would get most of the benefits of McKenzie without him having a huge amount of responsibility.
I wouldn't have him covering 10 from the wing, I would still have Mo'unga on the bench
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@chester-draws I'm not talking about individuals. I'm talking about a starting backline unit that includes all four "rookies".
Ioane will obviously start. I suspect Goodhue might get paired with one of SBW or Crotty. ALB will probably be on the bench.
Switching out the two time World Player of the Year for a guy with currently one test start (which was far from flawless)?
I don't see it. That would be a bigger call than ditching McCaw for Sam Cane!
Remember Shag fielded Carter, Nonu, Conrad Smith - guys all at the end of their test careers and with 300+ caps between them - and he was happy to run NMS alongside them.
And aside from these guys he had McCaw. He wanted to have Woodcock. He wheeled Kevvy Mealamu out of a rest home....
And at the end of the day, Danny Boy especially, showed why those years of experience were so valuable.
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@duluth Not out of the question. I do recall a test that Hansen went with Carter, Cruden and B. Barrett all in the team.
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@act-crusader If they're going down that path perhaps they should get Toddy Blackadder on the coaching staff?
No-one knows more about playing three first fives in a XV than Toddy - he might even have occasionally used four!
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Is BB starts at 10 then clearly Mo'unga is on the bench and I can't find room for D-Mac in my 22. And I think that's my preferred lineup TBH. I just don't trust D-Mac with any responsibility in a tight game, on either end of the park, whether at 10, 14 or 15.
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My only concern with dmac on the wing before seeing how it would go ,
Is if his lack of height could be exposed with the opposition putting in cross field kicks in one on one aerial battles .
