Springboks vs All Blacks I
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@Smuts said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
No disrespect but the outcome was very far from unacceptable. It wasn’t clearly and obviously wrong anyway so it couldn’t be reversed.
Big screen, collective sigh then silence from 50,000 Ellis Park supporters as Mbonambi drops the ball before the line doesn't support your argument.
Forgive me I'm feeling sore.
- ABs v SA we play terrible but also get whistled off the park by the referee Twickenham 2023
- ABs v SA WC final horrible game , officials / TMO dominate the game.
- ABs v SA Ellis Park I get my hopes up cos we play very well then inconsistent officiating influences the game. Not disputing SA played awesome in last 15 minutes.
SA are a great side, one of the best ever.
I would chew my right arm off to replay that with someone like Angus Gardner on the whistle. Great feel for the game.
See Twickenham 2023 above for the referee in the next game at Cape Town.
One last chance for us to play SA in 2024 huge. -
@DMX said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
Clarke was, very good but can someone teach him to stay on his feet? Soft ankle tap cost us 2 points right there. Will Jordan, good wing but no test full back despite BB having worst game this season, no need to change back three. I think Razor screwed up not having Proctor on bench after Fiji, imho Jordon/Proctor are the future. Loosies tough, don’t think they should have chosen both Jackobsen and Sititi, really limits options. That said Razor learning same thing as last two coaches, no one is pushing Ardie for his spot.
DMac would normally nail two points from where Clarke scored
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@BerniesCorner you’re forgiven.
We’ve all been sore.
But Brace wasn’t the reason you lost that game. In fact, viewed fairly he kept you in the game for the first 60.
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@Smuts said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@DaGrubster how is Jordie’s clear and obvious knock on a reason to overturn Bongi’s grounding?
Unless you’re saying it was deliberate and should’ve been a yellow card and a Bok penalty try?
Guess I’ll take the extra 2 points.
Now you are just being a dick.
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@DaGrubster said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@Smuts said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@BerniesCorner said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@Billy-Webb No disrespect but you've downplayed the Mbonambi lost ball. The outcome was unacceptable and the officials should acknowledge they erred.
No disrespect but the outcome was very far from unacceptable. It wasn’t clearly and obviously wrong anyway so it couldn’t be reversed.
More importantly you’ve ignored Billy’s understatement that for every baffling call against the ABs there was an equally baffling call against the Boks.
Anyone who’s watched Brace ref a few URC games will tell you that this is standard for him. His decisions are as baffling as the fact that he keeps failing upward.
Rubbish take on the clear and obvious knock on or didn’t you see the ball bounce on the ground?
Billy’s comment is a cliche with nothing to back it up
Actually, I was trying to avoid a tit-for-tat on could've - would've...
If you want examples I'll give you two:
AB first try - truck&trailer.
Sam Cane breaking Kolisi's cheek with his head in the tackle - definite yellow, likely red card...So no - not a cliche. We can argue who got more bad calls till the cows come home, point being some shockers against the Boks too and the ref did not cost the AB's the game. Poor game management and running out of puff in the last 10... maybe look there?
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@Smuts said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@BerniesCorner you’re forgiven.
We’ve all been sore.
But Brace wasn’t the reason you lost that game. In fact, viewed fairly he kept you in the game for the first 60.
1 But Brace wasn’t the reason you lost that game.
-that is possible
2 In fact, viewed fairly he kept you in the game for the first 60.
-that is hard to believe. -
Smuts your response is inventive and incorrect.
I've done the video analysis 7 times JBs arm hits the ball carrying arm of Mbonambi at the elbow initially. Mbonambi's arm travels backwards still holding the ball. When the ball hits Mbonambi's head he drops it.
I just did the TMO's job.
It's all here
https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/350399046/watch-springboks-hooker-awarded-controversial-try-against-all-blacks -
@Billy-Tell said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
Pretty disappointing. We had that game but indiscipline and unforced errors handed it to them. “20 out. 20 out”. Finau stays in…
I’m not going to be Irish and whine on and on and on but the first SA try deserved a review. In saying that Williams was getting folded at each scrum and not penalised so both ways.
No he wasn't. Maybe once. At least one scrum penalty could/should have been given for Frans collapsing.
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OK. Rewatched 60 to 75.
Blacks on top of Bomb Squad Boks from 60 - 63 when they get kickable penalty.
APPALLING OPTION. Take the kick. Over and game over. Miss and you get ball back.
Then we try Boks shift maul on them. WTF! We had edge in maul so KISS. A few phases and probably another pen or try.
They get lucky turnover and we try two Rieko specials, the second leading to another turnover.
WHY CHANGE A WINNING GAME?
That is where we took foot off throat.
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Around 65 Aumua and Ratima on. After excellent Bok breakout our lineout about 25 out. Good throw, but we try fancy play with Ratima at 10. Aumua pass no bullet and Ratima partially charged.
We nail catcher and ABs counter ruck over ball, which is lying at back of ruck. Ratima picks up as HB. Brace rules ball out. Then AR tells him Ratima joined the ruck from offside position. He didn’t join the ruck. First reffing mistake.
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Ball kicked about 7 out. We drive maul back and Brace calls stop once. At 67.10 the maul has stopped dead (a second time). SHOULD have been use it call.
Maul splits and Ofa pushes from behind last foot, but new maul going sideways and Ofa comes into contact with Marx, whom he grabs.
CORRECT call probably turnover. Maybe penalty, but HIGHLY dubious.
Brace claims too many penalties down that end.
ABs hadn't been down there for ten minutes or more. Ratima penalty highly dubious. Realistically even if penalty no yellow.
Boks launch another thwarted maul but score close in owing to man short.
In passage from 65 - 68 reffing team brought Boks back from dead.
PANTS!
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Three main events in 70 - 75.
First, at 73 Boks maul stopped and Finau come up side. Pretty sure he heard Brace say 'don't change your bind' but not 'out, out'.
Completely unnecessary, as Boks going backwards and RD effected turnover at 73.17. The following 5m lineout leads to try.
Darry make run and tackled at 76:14. Knee on ground but Etzebeth doesn't release. Pen ought to have gone our way.
Last two minutes BB and I think DMac both try kick passes when possession absolutely key. FFS.
That said, reffing from 65 - 68 cut our legs from under us.
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@Old-Samurai-Jack said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
I think the ABs are progressing which is nice to see after 6 years of stagnation
Can't see much progression TBH - apart from a continuation of the general upswing post the Ireland debacle last year.. Still the same mental fragility, poor discipline in the forwards and brain-farts from experienced players who should know better.. In some ways, worse.
Way too early to judge the new coaching regime though. That needs to wait until the EOYT IMHO.
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@MajorRage said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@kiwiinmelb said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
I’ve stayed out of the ref stuff until now but I think the confusing part for me is the different extremes they go to at times ,
In the wc final they go back a zillion phases to look at a slight knock on in the lead up to a try, and then here they don’t even look at a knock on in the act of scoring it.
Exactly this.
What is the point of a TMO?
Exactly. Canes head to Kolisis face should have been a clear red. Instead it’s play on. Outrageous.
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@Victor-Meldrew said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@Old-Samurai-Jack said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
I think the ABs are progressing which is nice to see after 6 years of stagnation
Can't see much progression TBH - apart from a continuation of the general upswing post the Ireland debacle last year.. Still the same mental fragility, poor discipline in the forwards and brain-farts from experienced players who should know better.. In some ways, worse.
Way too early to judge the new coaching regime though. That needs to wait until the EOYT IMHO.
Our scrum and lineout look pretty solid , that's a good foundation to work from
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@W32 said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@MajorRage said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@kiwiinmelb said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
I’ve stayed out of the ref stuff until now but I think the confusing part for me is the different extremes they go to at times ,
In the wc final they go back a zillion phases to look at a slight knock on in the lead up to a try, and then here they don’t even look at a knock on in the act of scoring it.
Exactly this.
What is the point of a TMO?
Exactly. Canes head to Kolisis face should have been a clear red. Instead it’s play on.
Do South Africans use a protractor at school?
Kolisi has bent his upper body to nearly 90 degrees just before impact.
Almost impossible to adjust to that in 500ms as a defender.Some things in rugby are never going to be 100% clear. Not like Mbonambi's spilled ball.
'Was there a TMO!?' - Outrage as Siya Kolisi is injured by unpunished Sam Cane high tackle
Springboks captain Siya Kolisi is set to miss the second match against the All Blacks after sustaining a facial injury in the 31-27 victory at Ellis Park.
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@BerniesCorner said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@W32 said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@MajorRage said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
@kiwiinmelb said in Springboks vs All Blacks I:
I’ve stayed out of the ref stuff until now but I think the confusing part for me is the different extremes they go to at times ,
In the wc final they go back a zillion phases to look at a slight knock on in the lead up to a try, and then here they don’t even look at a knock on in the act of scoring it.
Exactly this.
What is the point of a TMO?
Exactly. Canes head to Kolisis face should have been a clear red. Instead it’s play on.
Do South Africans use a protractor at school?
Kolisi has bent his upper body to nearly 90 degrees just before impact.
Almost impossible to adjust to that in 500ms as a defender.
Springboks captain Siya Kolisi is set to miss the second match against the All Blacks after sustaining a facial injury in the 31-27 victory at Ellis Park.
Some things in rugby are never going to be 100% clear. Not like Mbonambi's spilled ball.
Normal club level in England, you can get penalised for a late dip (as a ball carrier).
