All Blacks vs Wales

KiwiMurph

Good point on Ben Smith to wing. Still feels a little light on wing cover.

ACT Crusader

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="KiwiMurph" data-cid="583626" data-time="1464475030">Rokocoko came to NZ when he was 5. 
Speaking of the back 3 - it's a weird mix, you've got 4 fullbacks and 2 specialist wingers. Tamanivalu, Dagg and Fekitoa to cover wing?</blockquote>
 
It would've been interesting to see who missed out if Skudder was fit. 
Ben Smith also covers wing

Unco

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="KiwiMurph" data-cid="583626" data-time="1464475030">
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Rokocoko came to NZ when he was 5.
 
Speaking of the back 3 - it's a weird mix, you've got 4 fullbacks and 2 specialist wingers. Tamanivalu, Dagg and Fekitoa to cover wing?
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</blockquote>
I'd imagine a Kahui type centre/wing cover would be the goal, since Barrett already owns the 10/15 spot on the bench. Though as Billy said, B Smith covers 14 anyway, so they can probably get away with just centre cover.
 
Squad looks good to me, stoked for all the newbies in there, especially Ngatai and Squire. McKenzie isn't too much of a surprise, even if he hasn't looked as flash in recent weeks, Wayne Smith is a big fan of the guy, so he would've wanted to bring him in. Still hope he's released for the Chiefs vs Wales game though, as I think it'll give him an opportunity to play at 10 vs some high level opposition. Very interesting to see they only went with 2 halfbacks and that the second one is TKB. Guess he might make it back for the second or third tests then, which is great news.
 
My only real point of contentions are Romano, who I think has been pretty mediocre in his AB chances more often than not, and Franklin. Personally I think Barrett has more upside than either of them, Bird too. Not a big deal though, with Whitelock and BBBR around, they're mostly just injury cover and bench warmers.

rotated

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="583624" data-time="1464474893">
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But Rokokoko, Sivivatu and Naholo aren't exactly kiwi blokes and I don't recall you having a dig at them ?
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</blockquote>
 
McAlister was out of the country from an infant until mid-late high school too. Cross him out as well. Brad Thorn gone for sure, SBW deabteable.
 
Odd. I am against players coming with the promise of an AB jersey or AB jersey qualifying pathways (i.e. Ireland). But if guys want to come here at 16 on a 1 to 100 shot of making the ABs good on them.

Billy Tell

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="ACT Crusader" data-cid="583632" data-time="1464475313">
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It would've been interesting to see who missed out if Skudder was fit. 
Ben Smith also covers wing
</div>
</blockquote>
Hmmm. Probably back to the Dagg vs McKenzie thing again.
 
Personally, I would like to see Naholo learn to play 11. Savea has basically got in by default (although admittedly his international record is impressive) - his only remote challenger was Lowe.
 
If Naholo can't play 11, then it's always going to be Naholo vs NMS for right wing.

rotated

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="ACT Crusader" data-cid="583632" data-time="1464475313">
<div>
It would've been interesting to see who missed out if Skudder was fit. 
Ben Smith also covers wing
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Part of me hopes the would have given Savea a wake up call, although Hansen seemed very defensive of him with Veitch 4-6 weeks ago.
 
It's kind of an odd swing to go from the RWC squad that IMO had too much specialist wing coverage at the expense of having only 1 specialist fullback in the 31, to this squad which is almost light on genuine wingers - particularly those in great form.
 
As you guys point out plenty of guys who can switch over to either side, just unusual not to have an in-form, Super Rugby leading try scoring beast of a winger in the squad.

Nepia

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="rotated" data-cid="583634" data-time="1464475412">
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McAlister was out of the country from an infant until mid-late high school too. Cross him out as well. Brad Thorn gone for sure, SBW deabteable.
 
Odd. I am against players coming with the promise of an AB jersey or AB jersey qualifying pathways (i.e. Ireland). But if guys want to come here at 16 on a 1 to 100 shot of making the ABs good on them.
</div>
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For the odd, I didn't say it hasn't happened before, just that I don't like it, and I don't think we need them.
 
Those two guys you mention were NZers from birth. SBW went to Australia to play professional league, not sure why you're try and make out they were similar cases.

KiwiMurph

Naholo has played left wing before (if sparingly) - his debut for the Blues was on the left wing.
 
Agreed on Romano being underwhelming. I think both Barrett and Franklin could do with putting some bulk on then they'll go to another level.

Billy Tell

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="KiwiMurph" data-cid="583638" data-time="1464475799">
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Naholo has played left wing before (if sparingly) - his debut for the Blues was on the left wing.
 
Agreed on Romano being underwhelming. I think both Barrett and Franklin could do with putting some bulk on then they'll go to another level.
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I was really keen on Barrett. However, I must say Romano has stepped up in the last month, and I think he is worth his spot - for the moment... I'm also partial to players who turn down lucrative overseas contracts to represent us and our country at international rugby.

SammyC

I like it how they keep referring to picking guys in the forwards because they are physical 
Not blokes like whitelock who could "fit the game plan" as some suggested

rotated

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Nepia" data-cid="583637" data-time="1464475704">
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For the odd, I didn't say it hasn't happened before, just that I don't like it, and I don't think we need them.
 
Those two guys you mention were NZers from birth. SBW went to Australia to play professional league, not sure why you're try and make out they were similar cases.
</div>
</blockquote>
 
All three were born in NZ. It was more pointing to the vagaries of international qualifications. I certainly have less problem with guys who have lived at least part of their adult lives in NZ without playing professional football than those who haven't and those that appear to want to stay in NZ indefinitely regardless of their rugby career (unlike say Thorn who is back in Brisbane where we all knew he would end up).
 
My general point was if we are applying a purity standard to NZ qualifications there are some players not from the islands who also fall short depending on what your criteria is (playing football in NZ before high school seems to be a big one for you - Thorn, SBW and McAlister all didn't to varying degrees).
 
I cry few tears over this and we are still a fair way from getting repaid for the 25-40 very useful caps Isa Nacewa would have given us after Evans and before Cruden.

Nepia

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="MN5" data-cid="583624" data-time="1464474893">
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But Rokokoko, Sivivatu and Naholo aren't exactly kiwi blokes and I don't recall you having a dig at them ?
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</blockquote>
I'm not having a dig at the player, I like Tamanivalu (except for when he carries the ball in one hand all the bloody time).
 
As mentioned Roks was here as a kid, I can't remember my thoughts exactly on Sivi when he was first selector, I wasn't around here then, and I think I expressed similar thoughts with Naholo last year too.

Siam

We've got a bit of a problem at halfback it appears 
2 campaigns in a row they've picked the injured half who hasn't played for a month, such is their appraisal of the 3rd 4th stringers. 
It won't sink the ship but it's far from ideal

Stargazer

Don't agree with Tu'ungafasi, although I understand the reasoning. He wouldn't have been selected, I think, if Brendon Edmonds hadn't been injured, who is a far better player and plays both TH and LH.
 
I also don't agree with the selection of Squire and Franklin. Unlike others, I think Matt Todd and Taufua should have been picked, esp. Taufua who's also a good no. 8. I don't find it an obstacle that he's smaller than some other players; it's just how you prefer to use a player. I hope both make the EOYT, but fear Todd might head overseas.
 
Never liked TKB and never will. Weber unlucky IMO, hopefully will get a spot in the EOYT squad. Happy for him to play for the Magpies though!
 
Scott Barrett should also be in the EOYT squad, but Romano has played well this season and I guess they went for the more experienced player of the two.

Billy Tell

Who gets the bench loosie spot?
 
I suppose Savea, given that Kaino and Read can cover each other.
 
If you stick Dixon or Squire on the bench, there is really no 7 cover. And none of those loose forward options strike me as lock cover, so that should see the RWC option of 2 loose forwards scrapped.
 
Planning needs to start for Kaino though, he's not a spring chicken any more.
 
Elliott Dixon should patent his head tape.

MN5

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="KiwiMurph" data-cid="583638" data-time="1464475799">
<div>
Naholo has played left wing before (if sparingly) - his debut for the Blues was on the left wing.
 
Agreed on Romano being underwhelming. I think both Barrett and Franklin could do with putting some bulk on then they'll go to another level.
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Sam Whitelock has done ok for a stringbean and some of Romanos bulk looks to have been of the wrong kind.
 
I suppose to go from Nepias point Tamanivula might get a test or two, get found out and be cast on the international scrap heap when he could have had a long successful stint with Fiji.
 
Damn shame Nadolo isn't eligible.

Nepia

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="rotated" data-cid="583641" data-time="1464476148">
<div>
All three were born in NZ. It was more pointing to the vagaries of international qualifications. I certainly have less problem with guys who have lived at least part of their adult lives in NZ without playing professional football than those who haven't and those that appear to want to stay in NZ indefinitely regardless of their rugby career (unlike say Thorn who is back in Brisbane where we all knew he would end up).
 
My general point was if we are applying a purity standard to NZ qualifications there are some players not from the islands who also fall short depending on what your criteria is (playing football in NZ before high school seems to be a big one for you - Thorn, SBW and McAlister all didn't to varying degrees).
 
I cry few tears over this and we are still a fair way from getting repaid for the 25-40 very useful caps Isa Nacewa would have given us after Evans and before Cruden.
</div>
</blockquote>
What, did you ignore my post you just replied to, being a NZer is a big criteria for me, not playing rugby in NZ before high school - all 3 you continue to mention are NZers by birth. 
 
I'm not crying tears over anything, I'd just prefer guys like Tamanivalu play for Fiji.

Stargazer

Naholo has been a regular at 11 for Taranaki if I remember it correctly.

hydro11

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Billy Tell" data-cid="583645" data-time="1464476618">
<div>
Who gets the bench loosie spot?
 
I suppose Savea, given that Kaino and Read can cover each other.
 
If you stick Dixon or Squire on the bench, there is really no 7 cover. And none of those loose forward options strike me as lock cover, so that should see the RWC option of 2 loose forwards scrapped.
 
Planning needs to start for Kaino though, he's not a spring chicken any more.
 
Elliott Dixon should patent his head tape.
</div>
</blockquote>
Dixon would be a great player to have on the bench but I imagine he would be competing with Pat T for that role.

rotated

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Billy Tell" data-cid="583645" data-time="1464476618">
<div>
Who gets the bench loosie spot?
 
I suppose Savea, given that Kaino and Read can cover each other.
 
If you stick Dixon or Squire on the bench, there is really no 7 cover. And none of those loose forward options strike me as lock cover, so that should see the RWC option of 2 loose forwards scrapped.
 
Planning needs to start for Kaino though, he's not a spring chicken any more.
</div>
</blockquote>
It is interesting because presumably you pick these new guys to blood them. But with three loose spots you are also blooding Cane into the starting line-up full time and Read into the captaincy so may not be wanting to rotate those guys out too much either.
 
Perhaps one of them (Squire?) could just be one of those ones they bring into the enviornment to assess, and he gets 20 minutes in the 2nd or 3rd tests off the bench and is hopefully better off for the experience.
 
I don't know how you space out those minutes without resting Kaino a lot.

The Silver Fern

All Blacks vs Wales