All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour
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Super rugby aotearoa hos hidden so much. We have these games that are flat out, everyone wants themselves about how they are "test match intensity" and we talk up thr talent we have, and the huge depth
And as soon as we play someone who plays a bit different we get smacked, and realise we build, and wank over, players that do not measure up to modern top level test rugby.
We have to pick old locks because there is no one else. And we are not building any either. And out domestic coaching isn't either. The entire system has lost its way.
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@mariner4life We were poor against Wales B last week, our forwards in the first half particularly. Yet everyone in the media and elsewhere stroked themselves off over a poor win over a poor team.
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
@chimoaus said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
Wow, that is how you play rugby, Ireland take a bow, that was a pleasure to watch. That blueprint it how we should be playing the game.
We don't have the players
Same was said in 2004 when Henry took over. I think Foster needs to allow combinations to settle. Gone are the days when the ABs could field 2 different XVs on consecutive weekends.
Somehow NZ were within a fwd pass of taking the lead in a game they had been dominated in both in possession and territory. I don't know of another team that can roll with the punches like them. It is uncanny. There is still pride in the jersey at least.
Changes for next game with 2023 in mind - Taukei'aho at hooker, de Groot at LH prop, persist with Vai'i at lock (Scott Barrett still to come back who has probably been NZs best lock this year), Ioane at 6, Cane/Papali'i at 7, Savea/Sotutu at 8.
If Barrett is injured, Mo'unga will start. Christie or Weber to start with him with Smith on the bench as insurance.
Midfield. Who knows. ALB should play. I think R Ioane is a world class wing, but not a WC centre. He shouldn't be playing for the ABs as a centre until he reaches that level. I'd like to see Tupaea and ALB as the centre pairing, with both instructed to run hard and hold the ball. No risky passes. Just run it up the guts and get across the advantage line to give the forwards a chance to take ball on the front foot.
Back 3 - Barrett, Jordan, Ioane.
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@tim agreed, but point is he is a 7, not an 8.
Tbf I think cane, Dalton and Blackadder are all 6.5s, need to be looking at specialists, not all rounders.
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@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
@tim agreed, but point is he is a 7, not an 8.
Tbf I think cane, Dalton and Blackadder are all 6.5s, need to be looking at specialists, not all rounders.
NZ rugby looooves all rounders because we are all in on "get your best 15 players on the park"
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
@tim agreed, but point is he is a 7, not an 8.
Tbf I think cane, Dalton and Blackadder are all 6.5s, need to be looking at specialists, not all rounders.
NZ rugby looooves all rounders because we are all in on "get your best 15 players on the park"
It feels a lot like Solskjaer at Man Utd. I think part of the problem for an AB coach these days is to keep as many top players involved or risk them leaving for Japan or Europe. The pull of the jersey just isn't strong enough anymore.
You have to ask - will NZ be able to ignore the overseas playing talent that they could select for much longer?
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Just reading back through the thread. Why do the stats houses get Akira's stats wrong? That's twice now they've published stats saying he made no tackles when clearly any viewer with half a functioning eye can tell them otherwise. On his brother, he seems to be copping it in the thread but I thought he was one of our better performed backs, although guilty of a couple of dud passes which was pretty much par amongst our backs.
On thinking about the NH rush defence I think the pack has to play up the middle, but crucially the forwards need to be tight as fuck so that there are always numbers as NH refs seem to favour the defender regardless of whether they're on their feet/in through the gate etc.
@stodders said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
@tim agreed, but point is he is a 7, not an 8.
Tbf I think cane, Dalton and Blackadder are all 6.5s, need to be looking at specialists, not all rounders.
NZ rugby looooves all rounders because we are all in on "get your best 15 players on the park"
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You have to ask - will NZ be able to ignore the overseas playing talent that they could select for much longer?
What overseas playing talent do you think would make the ABs?
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
Super rugby aotearoa hos hidden so much. We have these games that are flat out, everyone wants themselves about how they are "test match intensity" and we talk up thr talent we have, and the huge depth
And as soon as we play someone who plays a bit different we get smacked, and realise we build, and wank over, players that do not measure up to modern top level test rugby.
We have to pick old locks because there is no one else. And we are not building any either. And out domestic coaching isn't either. The entire system has lost its way.
The teams need to be encouraged to develop their own style. There is too much homogeneity in NZ rugby. I would think that getting coaches like Gatland, Brown and Schmidt back into the NZ coaching mix will help develop players to the betterment of NZ rugby. But this will take time.
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
@chimoaus said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
Wow, that is how you play rugby, Ireland take a bow, that was a pleasure to watch. That blueprint it how we should be playing the game.
We don't have the players
This is the issue, we can no longer win just because we have freakishly talented players. What Ireland have shown us is the team is far more important than the individual, a well-coached team with a gameplan can beat a team full of talented players.
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@nepia said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
Just reading back through the thread. Why do the stats houses get Akira's stats wrong? That's twice now they've published stats saying he made no tackles when clearly any viewer with half a functioning eye can tell them otherwise. On his brother, he seems to be copping it in the thread but I thought he was one of our better performed backs, although guilty of a couple of dud passes which was pretty much par amongst our backs.
On thinking about the NH rush defence I think the pack has to play up the middle, but crucially the forwards need to be tight as fuck so that there are always numbers as NH refs seem to favour the defender regardless of whether they're on their feet/in through the gate etc.
@stodders said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
@tim agreed, but point is he is a 7, not an 8.
Tbf I think cane, Dalton and Blackadder are all 6.5s, need to be looking at specialists, not all rounders.
NZ rugby looooves all rounders because we are all in on "get your best 15 players on the park"
.
You have to ask - will NZ be able to ignore the overseas playing talent that they could select for much longer?
What overseas playing talent do you think would make the ABs?
Thinking about it, you're right, it isn't so much the ABs that struggle so much with the talent drain. It is the next tier that is losing experienced pros that the up and coming players used to be able to benchmark against.
Stephen Luatua would do a mightily good job at 6.
Charles Piatau would challenge.
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@bovidae said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
Today's JGP did not look anything like the halfback who played in the 6N.
Possibly because the Irish forward runners were better contained by the other 6 Nations teams. They were making easy metres against us all night and presented quick ball which gave him an easy ride.
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Next year will be telling when Ireland tour at the end of their season. If they win away for the first time ever, sound the alarm. If they lose comprehensively, it says more that until there is a global season, outside of the world cup, it is very difficult to judge where teams are against each other.
ABs have one chance at redemption this year. It was 2004 when they put down a signature performance against France in the last game on that NH tour. The players and coaches need to do the same next weekend.
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@stodders Muliaina; Howlett (Nonu 55), Smith (Mauger 68), Umaga (capt), Rokocoko; Carter, Kelleher; Woodcock (Somerville 62), Oliver (Mealamu 52), Hayman, Maxwell (Williams 52), Jack, Collins, McCaw, So'oialo.
I was there. Was awesome.
I'll be happy if we play structured, patient rugby with reasonable possession
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@mofitzy_ said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
@majorrage
You either want Foster gone or embrace failure.This Star Wars, “you’re either with me or against me”, talk is really really funny.
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@berniescorner said in All Blacks v Ireland, 2021 NH Tour:
@stodders Muliaina; Howlett (Nonu 55), Smith (Mauger 68), Umaga (capt), Rokocoko; Carter, Kelleher; Woodcock (Somerville 62), Oliver (Mealamu 52), Hayman, Maxwell (Williams 52), Jack, Collins, McCaw, So'oialo.
I was there. Was awesome.
I'll be happy if we play structured, patient rugby with reasonable possession
NZ were the best because they respected the basics. That seems to be missing a bit. Too many extra passes/offloads, not enough running with menace. ABs need to go back to respecting the ball again and learn to cherish it. NZ look a little spooked when in possession once it goes past 3 or 4 phases.
When kicking offensively, it has to be with purpose with the aim of contesting. Pressure needs to be exerted, which means no more stupid penalties. ABs defended brilliantly in their own 22 today without conceding penalties for some time. It can be done.
You only have to be slightly off your game to get a whooping at the top of the game. Will Foster give the team another chance or will he tinker again? What a quandary.
