All Blacks vs USA
-
@billy-tell I agree but still think Havilli is too light for the position not that Tupea is a heavyweight.
-
@broughie said in All Blacks vs USA:
@junior I have always appreciated him as a player. He has actually played pretty well at 1st five for the Canes. Good vision and pretty good kicking game. Maybe league would have accommodated his style of play. What do you guys think who watch league more? In the same vein I think DMac is not an international fullback because of his size, excellent at super rugby, but would imagine he would have been a fantastic halfback.
I think his passing would still have been a problem in league because they were looking at him as a hooker.
-
I went back and looked specifically at George bridge . To see why he was almost invisible. Every kick off was kicked to the same side and Will Jordan caught and passed to QT. Then it went left and never got out to bridge. We then snapped back right and because they were so shit we invariably scored off that phase. The ball just didn’t go his way. As a crusaders fan I think he’s a bloody good player. As a All blacks fan I don’t think he is one of our top 5 wingers.
As for Sam Cane, the guy is a freak. If we never had the goat before him then he would be regarded as one of our best ever. Actually watch what he does off the ball. Watch how quickly he gets off the ground and back into the play. These are the things the coaches look for in a 7. -
@broughie said in All Blacks vs USA:
I think DMac is not an international fullback because of his size.
Not sure about the size argument. His lack of size didn't stop him from being outstanding against the NH sides in 2018 and he's no worse under the high ball than other players. His defence is generally pretty good to outstanding:
-
@chchfanatic said in All Blacks vs USA:
As for Sam Cane, the guy is a freak. If we never had the goat before him then he would be regarded as one of our best ever. Actually watch what he does off the ball. Watch how quickly he gets off the ground and back into the play. These are the things the coaches look for in a 7
100% agree. Sam Cane is one of those players you only notice when he isn't playing.
-
@victor-meldrew But against the sides that are going to cause us problems like the Bok and perhaps England and Australia his size is an issue. But that is why I prefer Jordy.
-
@chchfanatic
i thought sam went pretty well for first game .in one of the phase plays for usa he must of done 4 or 5 tackes was noticeable the difference he made -
The Herald deserves an Asterix against their match coverage today for such poor quality. It belongs in a French comic. It was Dmac who took the kick covertly before the camera could fix in. Not Richie. Bias showed in the player reviews where Dmac was blamed for US LONE try and Jordan glossed past for second. Why focus so selectively on the odd error?
In the land of the Harlem Globetrotters spectators might occasionally enjoy seeing world class skills displayed and a lot of flowing play. Hell the depleted Eagles even scored twice themselves.
I wonder if the US coverage would have mentioned that Augspurger Civetta Lopeti and Germishuys all showed up pretty well against classy opposition.
Awful coverage for any American fan to read. I guess the excuse is that it's a holiday weekend and no sub-editors available. -
@broughie said in All Blacks vs USA:
@victor-meldrew But against the sides that are going to cause us problems like the Bok and perhaps England and Australia his size is an issue. But that is why I prefer Jordy.
At the moment and on current form, JB's the man, but I wouldn't make size a criteria.
England didn't cause DMac any problems in 2018 against England - quite the opposite. He was one of the best players in that game and on that tour in general, and none of the teams he played against contained collections of midgets.
-
@billy-tell said in All Blacks vs USA:
I see novices are using players running wild against USA to say other players are under threat. Let’s see Quinn against a proper team first before saying Havili is dooooomed.
Kind of agree but pretty sure that against the tougher teams QT would make an extra metre or two forward and use five metres less width.
-
@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks vs USA:
@broughie said in All Blacks vs USA:
I think DMac is not an international fullback because of his size.
Not sure about the size argument. His lack of size didn't stop him from being outstanding against the NH sides in 2018 and he's no worse under the high ball than other players. His defence is generally pretty good to outstanding:
That should've been a penalty to Fiji.
DMac's still a great threat in broken play, but he's not the threat he was pre-knee injury. He was badly exposed by the American scrumhalf. In much the same way Kellaway did. This was a game that suited DMac's strengths and it showed.
USA were too shit to raw conclusions from.
-
@victor-meldrew said in All Blacks vs USA:
@broughie said in All Blacks vs USA:
@victor-meldrew But against the sides that are going to cause us problems like the Bok and perhaps England and Australia his size is an issue. But that is why I prefer Jordy.
At the moment and on current form, JB's the man, but I wouldn't make size a criteria.
England didn't cause DMac any problems in 2018 against England - quite the opposite. He was one of the best players in that game and on that tour in general, and none of the teams he played against contained collections of midgets.
I must be one of DMac’s biggest defenders on here especially against those that continue to make judgments based on things they saw him do years ago and not the more mature player he is now ( Nonu syndrome).
However even I can see how the smarter teams will spot him or try to put him into a position where they can run a big man at him front on.
In part it is his terrier like attitude that gets him into these positions, like defending two out from a ruck near the line rather than getting others to fill the gap.
Tenacious defender but there are times when size outranks will.
As for that England game didn’t Eddie design that set piece try that pulled him one way then immediately switched so that he was sweeping from too far away as his tackle was too little too late? -
@bovidae said in All Blacks vs USA:
@ARHS Some of Cully's player ratings had me puzzled too.
What about TJ saying DMac missed a conversion when he didn't?
I was annoyed by that because I was waiting for them to confirm he had just brought up 100 points in test rugby. The TJ put his flag up too - so I was mystified. Then they had a covert conversion next time while the cameras were elsewhere. Still no mention of the century. Don't know why DMac cops so much when he is such a positive role model for the game.
-
@arhs said in All Blacks vs USA:
@bovidae said in All Blacks vs USA:
@ARHS Some of Cully's player ratings had me puzzled too.
What about TJ saying DMac missed a conversion when he didn't?
I was annoyed by that because I was waiting for them to confirm he had just brought up 100 points in test rugby. The TJ put his flag up too - so I was mystified. Then they had a covert conversion next time while the cameras were elsewhere. Still no mention of the century. Don't know why DMac cops so much when he is such a positive role model for the game.
DMac plays in positions where howlers stand out and as recently as last year (I think?) he made one or two howlers, but yeah, more so when he first started, and those sort of early mistakes can be hard to shake.
I also agree he is normally a good tackler but at fb he can be pushed back, swatted away or leaped over and it is harder for him to bundle big players out over the sidelines. I'd agree the size difference hasn't mostly been a huge difference and I'd say he has played more and more consistently, but in the last game, he really did look like a 10 playing at 15 (in a good way)! And I'd agree he'd probably make a good 9 especially at the base of the ruck, seems to have quick hands.
-
@nostrildamus said in All Blacks vs USA:
@arhs said in All Blacks vs USA:
@bovidae said in All Blacks vs USA:
@ARHS Some of Cully's player ratings had me puzzled too.
What about TJ saying DMac missed a conversion when he didn't?
I was annoyed by that because I was waiting for them to confirm he had just brought up 100 points in test rugby. The TJ put his flag up too - so I was mystified. Then they had a covert conversion next time while the cameras were elsewhere. Still no mention of the century. Don't know why DMac cops so much when he is such a positive role model for the game.
DMac plays in positions where howlers stand out and as recently as last year (I think?) he made one or two howlers, but yeah, more so when he first started, and those sort of early mistakes can be hard to shake.
I also agree he is normally a good tackler but at fb he can be pushed back, swatted away or leaped over and it is harder for him to bundle big players out over the sidelines. I'd agree the size difference hasn't mostly been a huge difference and I'd say he has played more and more consistently, but in the last game, he really did look like a 10 playing at 15 (in a good way)! And I'd agree he'd probably make a good 9 especially at the base of the ruck, seems to have quick hands.
Must be some amazing athletes out there that I haven't seen
You are missing his biggest asset. He sees space! Very much a heads up player and that be the winning of a close game.
In the past he have often gone looking to exploit it himself if no one else is there but he has tempered that with some better realisation of the %s.
As long as JB is playing well I am happy for him to be at 15 but Mac on the bench for 10 is a nice option to have. He's playing better than BB if looking at consistency.All of our 10 options have moments of brilliance and passages of averageness along with their weaknesses. RM is still a weakness in defence (we have to shuffle to cover him and these days that's a recipe for an error). Not convinced on his game management either.
BB can pull rabbits out of hats if the opportunity arises but I never feel that the rest of the backline attacks to their potential from unbroken play with him running the show.
DMacs kicking game from hand can be wayward and although he will make the tackles they usually concede metres. Of the three though I prefer his passing game and runner selection. -
@antipodean said in All Blacks vs USA:
DMac's still a great threat in broken play, but he's not the threat he was pre-knee injury. He was badly exposed by the American scrumhalf. In much the same way Kellaway did. This was a game that suited DMac's strengths and it showed.
USA were too shit to raw conclusions from.
That US halfback used to play winger and knows how to step and flatfoot a defender like good wingers do (take note Mr Bridge). Yep he got done but it was done by a very good play. Making that tackle is like a football goalie in a penalty shoot. The runner will get past more often than not.
-
@crucial said in All Blacks vs USA:
@antipodean said in All Blacks vs USA:
DMac's still a great threat in broken play, but he's not the threat he was pre-knee injury. He was badly exposed by the American scrumhalf. In much the same way Kellaway did. This was a game that suited DMac's strengths and it showed.
USA were too shit to raw conclusions from.
That US halfback used to play winger and knows how to step and flatfoot a defender like good wingers do (take note Mr Bridge). Yep he got done but it was done by a very good play. Making that tackle is like a football goalie in a penalty shoot. The runner will get past more often than not.
He finished the game on the wing
-
DMac wasn't really to blame for USA's first try, he was sprinting across to cover an expected break, most good players will step a player in that position pretty easily. It was non-existent ruck defense that was the problem there.
Jordan was 100% to blame for their second try though, that was really soft defense.
