Modern Day Parenting

MN5

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Rancid Schnitzel" data-cid="550755" data-time="1451969155">Getting involved with the other parents if the school don't take care of it must be pretty damn dicey. I know I'd freak out if either of my sons were bullies, but some parents probably think its cool.</blockquote>
 
Yeah I agree but I was willing to get in there and sort it out if the school didn't.

jegga

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="mariner4life" data-cid="550730" data-time="1451965673">jegga the thought of ongoing bullying is a real worry (thank fuck i have boys, girls are fucking evil to each other). I know i copped it as a kid (i was small), and the thought of it happening to them just sucks. How did you get through it?</blockquote>
 
The school decided my son was the problem , probably because that was the easy route. First they said he had Asperger's , went a specialist who said " wtf are they talking about?" ( I'm paraphrasing here) , then they decided he had behavioural problems and made him do this course about how to deal with his anger. Then they decided I might be to blame , interviewed me and the woman running the course what I did with my son in a typical weekend. I pulled out my phone and showed her photos of us swimmng with a pod of dolphins and my boy catching his first kingfish ( that was an awesome weekend, obviously not a typical one), I got a sour look from her in response . Anyway I thought thinks had settled down on the bullying front but in fact they had got worse and he was so low I was really worried about him. His mum , him and I had a sit down with him and got him to tell us what was going on. It was pretty hard to hear what these little shits were getting away with . We told him he had to take up a sport , to get him meeting other people and more active and a big talk about self respect . Lastly him and I went to mymother in law who used to run anti bullying program's in schools ( I know I should have done this earlier) and she backed up what I was saying about self respect and how you carry yourself and feel about yourself can make you a target . 
He chose boxing , on the first session the coach told all the kids if he found out they were bullying of hitting other kids they'd get kicked out. He lost weight and got fit which helped his self esteem as well, he doesn't get bullied anymore thank fuck and he's a lot happier (mostly when he's winding me up but that's another story I guess). He's still boxing, this will be his third year . 
The little shits that were bullying him who were apparently not the problem? One if them stomped on a kids wrist and almost broke it and thd other one barely turns up to school and they are both stoners at 13 years old . I realise schools have limited options when dealing with bullies bug making out to my boy that there was something wrong with him stank , the more sympathetic side of me says those little shits are going to be train wrecks as adults and intervening earlier might have avoided that.

jegga

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Rancid Schnitzel" data-cid="550755" data-time="1451969155">
Getting involved with the other parents if the school don't take care of it must be pretty damn dicey. I know I'd freak out if either of my sons were bullies, but some parents probably think its cool.</blockquote>
 
It turned out I know one of the parents who was bullying my son, he redefines loser. I didn't bother talking to him about it, he's a waste of space .

No Quarter

The bullying thing is a real worry. In the past it was easier to leave that shit at school. I was bullied like many others, but my home life was really good, and my oldest brother who was at Uni would say "don't worry about it, once you leave college you leave those losers behind and life gets better". 
I watched a farking heartbreaking documentary on it a while back, where a teenage girl was getting it at school, and then even worse on social media. M4l is right, girls can be fucking evil. This girls mother did everything she could to support her daughter, but the school didn't really do shit about it and she ended up taking her own life. The group of girls bullying her had very little remorse, and the mother recounted driving past them on the way to the funeral seeing them all laughing with each other. The kind of story that really gets your blood boiling. 
I'm not sure exactly what I'll do if it happens to my boy. There is no easy answer. Often the bully comes from a really shitty home life so approaching their parents isn't always easy. Probably the best thimg to do is ensure he can talk to me about it and we work through it together, so he isn't alone.

MajorRage

Interesting thread.
 
Have an almost 4 year old boy and an almost 2 year old girl. We try to do good cop, bad cop but where I'm bad for the boy and good for the girl. But I'm coming to the conclusion that it doesn't work. 4 year old boy is just too attached to Mummy, so anytime I deny him something or tell him off, he just cries to Mummy. I am really worried about bullying for him too, as he's extremely shy, very slow to warm and lets himself get pushed around.
 
Main reason I worry, is that I think it's similar to me. I let myself get pushed around when younger, and I'm infuriated at myself for it. Yeah, I wasn't very big, and was 4 eyed, and pretty shit at sports, and my parents were teachers at primary schools, so I was a very easy target. I just wish that I'd stuck up for myself once or twice and actually tried to kick some arse. I may have got my head kicked in a couple of times, but it would have been worth it, as bullies only go for the easiest targets. (side note, my bullies are all complete losers at life, who all peaked at high school - I won).
 
As for the daughter ... well, she's almost 2 and I'm her Daddy. She can't do a single thing wrong in my eyes. 
 
I'm sure that will change.

taniwharugby

TR Jnr was bullied by a kid who TBH should not have been at a mainstream school, quite bad ADD, pretty much needed constant attention by a teacher, which this school could not provide, but his mother kicked up such a fuss threatening to take legal action and blah blah blah if they didnt let him in...anywhoo, he was 2 years older than TR Jnr (6 at the time) and he sometimes put his arm round his neck in a strangling move, threatened to kill him...school was pretty good about it all, although that didnt stop it immediately.
 
Fortunately TR Jnr is pretty thick skinned about most stuff, so aside from the physical side, it didnt phase him.
 
Whangarei being what it was, turned out it was my sister-in-laws step-nephew...rather than approach the mother who we know is very precious about her boy at the best of times, 'we' thought if her kid saw TR Jnr in a social situation (with his Aunt, Grandad etc) realising he 'knew' him, it would resolve the issue, which it did fortunately, although my more agressive apprach woulda worked too I am sure 
 
I've taught my son how to throw a punch, often have him beating on the punch bag (told him when his sister winds him up, to beat it up instead...) but try to tell him that hitting someone is a last resort, although if they hit you first...
 
I was a midget at school, but was lucky I played rugby and league and was ok at both, so the big Maori boys looked out for me, and a couple of kids down the road that used to pick on me, stopped pretty promptly when they heard I was mates with this kid who I reckon in Standard 3 was as big as I am today!

Mokey

I have three nieces (7, 5, 3). The eldest is very smart and high achieving but can be a little madam in the wrong company. Middle is gentle, talented artistic type who gets pushed around by her sisters and has lots of boy friends, youngest is an adorable honey one minute, psychotic screeching biting hellraising diva the next. My BIL already has a gun, but I think he will flee long before the girls and my sister get in synch, because God help the world if that happens.
 
When I babysit, I am very strict. They bloody well use manners, talk in inside voices and tidy up toys. I was the same as a kindy teacher overseas, tough with boundaries, quick with hugs. And had kids who lined up every day for their turn. Whiny voices, fighting, tantrums etc result in nothing. Sometimes it is really, really hard, but if you drum it into them when they are younger, they wont grow up to be revolting spoilt horrors. Kiddies are never too young to be taught pwease and ta. Or 'you are the best aunty in the whole world'.

Baron Silas Greenback

Interesting .
I am a quite a permissive parent. My kids often get to make decisions, but there are always consequences and I never bail them out of them. When it goes pear shaped, I am usually very sympathetic but dont help them avoid the consequence. The are fast learning that good choices have good consequences and bad ones have bad ones.
Classic example today, they spent all morning bagging up plums.... bagged up 50 bags, then this afternoon started to sell them on the roadside. Daughter 5 bailed quite early, Son 7 stuck at it for HOURS. When it came to sharing the cash.... he got far more. Daughter was upset.... tough. She ended up being very upset at her decision to quit early. He was stoked and is planning an epic Lego purchase. I was sympathetic to my daughter, but secretly stoked as the boy deserved his cash, and she deserved a lesson for laziness.
 
I reckon she will get through cruising, she is very very clever and a real confident person, can entertain herself for ages and very empathetic. But she is a bit more likely to quit and get 'tired', she also handles punishment far to easily.
He on the hand gets genuinely upset if he has done something wrong. But by god does he have determination, he will spend hours days and weeks practicing some new skill, just will not stop. Played rugby this year first time, he is a slow runner, scored bugger all tries and was generally just making up numbers.. until he figured out that defense got claps as well.... and he just practiced ripping and made it his thing. Every single possession he would just sprint after the opposition, and then sprint back, it was like the coach had him on remote control. Back and forward back and forward and back and forward. Won the defense player award for the season, didn't care about not scoring tries. Wont ever be as smart as his sister, but I think he might do better, he has far more stickability than I ever had. Her is the same with tennis. Was playing once a week, begged to do twice, and then three.. then we had to say enough.. he is just always hitting a ball and practicing.
 
One tip we have with siblings is holding hands. If we are ever unsure over who did what to whom, or just cannot be bothered finding out... they have to sit facing each other and hold both hands and look at each other. And they stay like that until they have gotten over it. If one takes the piss, or wont do it properly, that one gets punished and the other can go. Just the threat of it works to quell disputes now.

NTA

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Baron Silas Greenback" data-cid="550818" data-time="1451982847">
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One tip we have with siblings is holding hands. If we are ever unsure over who did what to whom, or just cannot be bothered finding out... they have to sit facing each other and hold both hands and look at each other. And they stay like that until they have gotten over it. If one takes the piss, or wont do it properly, that one gets punished and the other can go. Just the threat of it works to quell disputes now.
</div>
</blockquote>
 
Oh that's good. I'm using that.

taniwharugby

yeah I am gonna try it tomorrow, cos I know the opportunity will arise.

Catogrande

Some tough stories here. As parents we all try to do our best and then better of us worry constantly that it's not good enough. I have two girls who are now both grown up (still a financial drag of course). First one is very arty and is currently in her final year of a fine arts degree at Slade (which I am told is one of the better art schools - but what do I know), so she's doing well. But by the cringe did she put us through some shit in her mid to late teens. Where we live most schools do not have a 6th form, so it's off to college (not University - please note American friends). This was a big change for her and we didn't notice this until it was nearly too late. New "exciting" friends, attentive boy friend who was into drugs, lack of pastoral care at the college in comparison to the previous school. We had to take her out of college after one term and get her into a private school the following academic year. A looong bad few months as we managed to persuade her that doing that much skunk was not doing her any good and the fucking low life tosser of a boyfriend was a waste of a lot of pasty skin. In the end it wasn't us that provided the turning point but a psychotic episode on the weed that did it.
 
No2 daughter by comparison has been a breeze which always begs the question "why?" We did our best to treat them both the same, give them the same love and attention etc. Is it the age old nature v nurture question? Eventually we came to the conclusion that it is down to many factors - nature plays its part, On reflection, try as we did you do not treat them the same. You learn lessons the first time around that you don't need to learn again which has a bearing. Then there is the second child's learned responses to the first child's behaviour. Peer groups play a significant part too, plus opportunities that may arise for one but not the other - both good and bad. And of course just plain luck.
 
In the end you just have to plug away doing what you think is best and constantly re-evaluate yourselves.
 
A good friend of mine that had his first child a few months before my first was born described having a kid as like getting the best Christmas present ever but you get to unwrap it every day and it's always a little different. The first few years are generally like that but in the longer run things can be a lot harder. All I will say is that the perseverance is worth it when you see them turn out OK.

mooshld

We are in the grips of toddler hell in my house. Only 18 months between them, youngest is coming up to two but doesn't yet speak much, oldest never shuts up. We don't do the smacking thing as though it may have worked on me, I'll be dammed if I am going to turn into my old man. Who used intimidation and violence to resolve everything. I get a fair amount of stick from the inlaws about being too tough on them, especially with things like manners and following instructions. I get the feeling they don't appreciate that to get those moments of good behavior on their own initiative, which they love so much, don't happen by chance. Its because I spent countless hours reminding them and reinforcing those behaviors.
 
The biggest issue we have is tantrums the youngest has damn near knocked himself out flinging himself to the floor in the bathroom, or in the car park. But just won't learn to stay on his feet. The eldest could do something in 30 seconds like put his shoes on but would rather spend 15 minutes in his room screaming about it first. 
 
They fight a bit but as the younger is a bit of a go nuclear type I think the eldest is starting to get the idea that you don't go round poking wild animals with a stick or it will end badly. Funny story when they were both at creche together last year, some older kid was pushing round my youngest. So my eldest told the boy off and gave him a verbal, I never saw it coming as he is quiet shy and he told me he did it in French, I was very proud of him though. So I asked did the boy listen to you, he said no. I said did you go and tell the teacher then, he said no I didn't because he did it again and my brother attacked him. I would like to think that will continue as they get older but know they will have their ups and downs.
 
We go pretty easy with the toys and tv I never had those as a kid so they were always a treat for me. They love BBC documentaries and ask for them a lot. My wife uses that sometimes when she needs some peace to get something done, I guess its better then cartoons. But I prefer to keep it for special occasions.
 
As others have said its nice to know that others have the same issues and I have not been cursed with demon spawn!

NTA

People talk about The Terrible Twos. 
Both of ours were more like The Fuckawful Fours.

jegga

Mooshld at the Insistence of the ex I went to a fathers group one night, they were all a bunch of whining twats apart from the guy running the group who had raised his son by himself. He described how he ended the public tantrums , his son tyres himself down on the ground at a supermarket because his dad wouldn't buy him chocolates so he did the same thing waving his arms and legs in the air and moaning. He said within seconds his son was standing next to him tugging his shirt tling him to stop. He reckoned that ended the tantrums . 
The other guys were wimps moaning about how dad's are made to look stupid in ads on TV , I never went back . I'm surprised their wives/partners were able to conceive at all from such effeminate stock.

mariner4life

I went to a "dads" lunch organised by the eldest's school. Everyone ate steak, drank heaps of beers, and talked about sport and horse racing. You just got lucky i guess...

jegga

That's what I was expecting , instead I got a dozen or so whining she males . They had pizzas and few beers but it was a token effort at best . We were asked to talk to the guy next to is about our relationship with our fathers, my dad was a Wahine survivor and has all the issues you'd expect with an experience like that but there was no way I was discussing that , the twat next to me started off his ten minute tirade with " my father is a scientist and was the result of a hole in a condom somy father had to get a reliable income instead of doing the study he enjoyed and I always sensed a distance between us because of it...........". Snivelling weirdo, build a bridge ffs was running through my head he whole time. 
Winger if you're reading this his dad obviously wasnt .on the climate change gravy train

mariner4life

that's his own fault, they're just giving money away to keep that rolling.

jegga

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="mariner4life" data-cid="550900" data-time="1452034790">that's his own fault, they're just giving money away to keep that rolling.</blockquote>
 
True I'm not sure if the gravy train was around 40 years ago though. He actually sounded like a good dad to me , putting his plans on hold to create a stable home for his ingrate of a son.

antipodean

<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="jegga" data-cid="550896" data-time="1452032560">
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Mooshld at the Insistence of the ex I went to a fathers group one night, they were all a bunch of whining twats apart from the guy running the group who had raised his son by himself. He described how he ended the public tantrums , his son tyres himself down on the ground at a supermarket because his dad wouldn't buy him chocolates so he did the same thing waving his arms and legs in the air and moaning. He said within seconds his son was standing next to him tugging his shirt tling him to stop. He reckoned that ended the tantrums .
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</blockquote>
 
I've had tremendous success from doing that. Kids seem amazed that you'd behave in the same way and then immediately stop. I don't know if it's embarrassment or their synapses are overwhelmed by wondering wtf you're crying about.
 
I also noticed how kids who fall over or otherwise hurt themselves tend to wait on the reaction of parents before crying; if they're laughed at and ignored, all other things being equal they won't cry.

taniwharugby

next time your cat throws a tanty, get it on cam and upload to Youtube, people love that shit!
 
Fortunately, only sulky behavior has been the extent of my kids tanty's, and they are made aware that everyone in the shop is looking at them and their sulkiness, I also told them about peripheral vision so they knew even if the person didn't seem like they were looking, they were.

The Silver Fern

Modern Day Parenting