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All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga

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  • Victor MeldrewV Online
    Victor MeldrewV Online
    Victor Meldrew
    replied to Chester Draws on last edited by Victor Meldrew
    #62

    @Chester-Draws said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    But "experience" is just a bullshit way of justifying your preference without actually being better.

    Are you saying Ma'a & Conrad's experience of playing together was irrelevant to how well they played individually? And a player having been in tricky situations before and knowing how to react or play is unimportant.

    Righto....

    rotatedR ACT CrusaderA 2 Replies Last reply
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  • rotatedR Offline
    rotatedR Offline
    rotated
    replied to Victor Meldrew on last edited by
    #63

    @Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    Are you saying Ma'a & Conrad's experience of playing together was irrelevant to how well they played individually?

    I'm sure it is important. Although not important enough to preemptively break up in a World Cup Final.

    @Chester-Draws said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    I don't think the experience thing works.

    Cruden came into the ABs totally green -- and yet we never lost with him running the ship.

    Not the best example, he was massively shaky to start and didn't have the pressure of goal kicking either. He needed Slade to bail him out of his first Bledisloe.

    NepiaN boobooB 2 Replies Last reply
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  • NepiaN Online
    NepiaN Online
    Nepia
    replied to rotated on last edited by
    #64

    @rotated said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    He needed Slade to bail him out of his first Bledisloe.

    Kaino, not Slade.

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  • MiketheSnowM Offline
    MiketheSnowM Offline
    MiketheSnow
    replied to Chester Draws on last edited by
    #65

    @Chester-Draws said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    I don't think the experience thing works.

    Cruden came into the ABs totally green -- and yet we never lost with him running the ship. A young McCaw was better than an experienced Holah. Milner-Skudder would never have started last RWC based on experience.

    Better is simply better. Experience, by itself, doesn't make you better.

    If Mo'unga is better he should start. If you think Barrett is better then he should start. But "experience" is just a bullshit way of justifying your preference without actually being better.

    Mike Catt
    Off the bench England v Wales RWC 2003
    Materclass of experience and skill

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  • ACT CrusaderA Do not disturb
    ACT CrusaderA Do not disturb
    ACT Crusader
    replied to Victor Meldrew on last edited by
    #66

    @Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @Chester-Draws said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    But "experience" is just a bullshit way of justifying your preference without actually being better.

    Are you saying Ma'a & Conrad's experience of playing together was irrelevant to how well they played individually? And a player having been in tricky situations before and knowing how to react or play is unimportant.

    Righto....

    They were still the best 12 and 13 going around though. Crotty and SBW were used as bench options and occasional starter, but they were both behind the former two.

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  • boobooB Do not disturb
    boobooB Do not disturb
    booboo
    replied to rotated on last edited by
    #67

    @rotated said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @Victor-Meldrew said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    Are you saying Ma'a & Conrad's experience of playing together was irrelevant to how well they played individually?

    I'm sure it is important. Although not important enough to preemptively break up in a World Cup Final.

    @Chester-Draws said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    I don't think the experience thing works.

    Cruden came into the ABs totally green -- and yet we never lost with him running the ship.

    Not the best example, he was massively shaky to start and didn't have the pressure of goal kicking either. He needed Slade to bail him out of his first Bledisloe.

    @Nepia has already partially addressed this. Kaino made a huge difference. Cruden was also carrying a wee niggle.

    1 Reply Last reply
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  • kiwiinmelbK Offline
    kiwiinmelbK Offline
    kiwiinmelb
    wrote on last edited by
    #68

    Experience has to count for something , if two players are relatively even , you favor the experienced one in a big game surely ,

    If you get someone like a J Savea , struggling , and a younger Reiko looking the much better option, the experience part only isnt enough .

    nzzpN 1 Reply Last reply
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  • nzzpN Offline
    nzzpN Offline
    nzzp
    replied to kiwiinmelb on last edited by
    #69

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    Experience has to count for something , if two players are relatively even , you favor the experienced one in a big game surely ,

    Ya need the mix. One of the reasons I think SBW keeps getting selected is because Hansen and co know he has track record at the highest level

    MN5M 1 Reply Last reply
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  • sharkS Offline
    sharkS Offline
    shark
    wrote on last edited by
    #70

    I'd love to see the Mo'unga / BB double act tried in the pre-RWC tests, with Ioane on the bench for a game or three.

    This gets Mo'unga some more big game experience while keeping BB in the fold and able to make an impression on games but from fullback, plus gives as an opprtunity to blood a third pivot should we need to bring one in during the RWC.

    Imagine the panic should we suffer an injury to Richie or BB in the RWC and we hadn't given anyone else any game time.

    ACT CrusaderA 1 Reply Last reply
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  • ACT CrusaderA Do not disturb
    ACT CrusaderA Do not disturb
    ACT Crusader
    replied to shark on last edited by
    #71

    @shark said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    Imagine the panic should we suffer an injury to Richie or BB in the RWC and we hadn't given anyone else any game time.

    Thank goodness Cameron has been in the setup then....

    I blame Fox.

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  • MN5M Online
    MN5M Online
    MN5
    replied to nzzp on last edited by
    #72

    @nzzp said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    Experience has to count for something , if two players are relatively even , you favor the experienced one in a big game surely ,

    Ya need the mix. One of the reasons I think SBW keeps getting selected is because Hansen and co know he has track record at the highest level

    The only track record he has recently is playing shit and getting injured

    No QuarterN 1 Reply Last reply
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  • No QuarterN Offline
    No QuarterN Offline
    No Quarter
    replied to MN5 on last edited by
    #73

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @nzzp said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    Experience has to count for something , if two players are relatively even , you favor the experienced one in a big game surely ,

    Ya need the mix. One of the reasons I think SBW keeps getting selected is because Hansen and co know he has track record at the highest level

    The only track record he has recently is playing shit and getting injured

    He's actually played well this year when on the park.

    BonesB MN5M 2 Replies Last reply
    1
  • BonesB Online
    BonesB Online
    Bones
    replied to No Quarter on last edited by
    #74

    @No-Quarter said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @nzzp said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    Experience has to count for something , if two players are relatively even , you favor the experienced one in a big game surely ,

    Ya need the mix. One of the reasons I think SBW keeps getting selected is because Hansen and co know he has track record at the highest level

    The only track record he has recently is playing shit and getting injured

    He's actually played well this year when on the park.

    Well yeah but you actually watch rugby, who needs your opinion?

    MN5M 1 Reply Last reply
    4
  • MN5M Online
    MN5M Online
    MN5
    replied to Bones on last edited by
    #75

    @Bones said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @No-Quarter said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @nzzp said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    Experience has to count for something , if two players are relatively even , you favor the experienced one in a big game surely ,

    Ya need the mix. One of the reasons I think SBW keeps getting selected is because Hansen and co know he has track record at the highest level

    The only track record he has recently is playing shit and getting injured

    He's actually played well this year when on the park.

    Well yeah but you actually watch rugby, who needs your opinion?

    Is the internet down? Your predictable and obsessive insult took awhile to get posted

    BonesB 1 Reply Last reply
    1
  • BonesB Online
    BonesB Online
    Bones
    replied to MN5 on last edited by
    #76

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @Bones said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @No-Quarter said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @nzzp said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    Experience has to count for something , if two players are relatively even , you favor the experienced one in a big game surely ,

    Ya need the mix. One of the reasons I think SBW keeps getting selected is because Hansen and co know he has track record at the highest level

    The only track record he has recently is playing shit and getting injured

    He's actually played well this year when on the park.

    Well yeah but you actually watch rugby, who needs your opinion?

    Is the internet down? Your predictable and obsessive insult took awhile to get posted

    alt text

    1 Reply Last reply
    0
  • MN5M Online
    MN5M Online
    MN5
    replied to No Quarter on last edited by
    #77

    @No-Quarter said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @nzzp said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    Experience has to count for something , if two players are relatively even , you favor the experienced one in a big game surely ,

    Ya need the mix. One of the reasons I think SBW keeps getting selected is because Hansen and co know he has track record at the highest level

    The only track record he has recently is playing shit and getting injured

    He's actually played well this year when on the park.

    .....just a minor detail.

    He's been nothing but impressive off field but by christ his hold on that jersey HAS to be getting tenuous. Are they really gonna hold a spot for him just in case ?

    nzzpN 1 Reply Last reply
    0
  • nzzpN Offline
    nzzpN Offline
    nzzp
    replied to MN5 on last edited by
    #78

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @No-Quarter said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @nzzp said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    Experience has to count for something , if two players are relatively even , you favor the experienced one in a big game surely ,

    Ya need the mix. One of the reasons I think SBW keeps getting selected is because Hansen and co know he has track record at the highest level

    The only track record he has recently is playing shit and getting injured

    He's actually played well this year when on the park.

    .....just a minor detail.

    He's been nothing but impressive off field but by christ his hold on that jersey HAS to be getting tenuous. Are they really gonna hold a spot for him just in case ?

    They are pretty ruthless selectors, but give plenty of leniency with injury. If they don't think he's up to it, he's for the chop. That said, on form he's magnificent - and despite the odd brain fade, has done some really good thigns at the top level in multiple sports.

    MN5M 1 Reply Last reply
    0
  • MN5M Online
    MN5M Online
    MN5
    replied to nzzp on last edited by
    #79

    @nzzp said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @No-Quarter said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @nzzp said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    Experience has to count for something , if two players are relatively even , you favor the experienced one in a big game surely ,

    Ya need the mix. One of the reasons I think SBW keeps getting selected is because Hansen and co know he has track record at the highest level

    The only track record he has recently is playing shit and getting injured

    He's actually played well this year when on the park.

    .....just a minor detail.

    He's been nothing but impressive off field but by christ his hold on that jersey HAS to be getting tenuous. Are they really gonna hold a spot for him just in case ?

    They are pretty ruthless selectors, but give plenty of leniency with injury. If they don't think he's up to it, he's for the chop. That said, on form he's magnificent - and despite the odd brain fade, has done some really good thigns at the top level in multiple sports.

    Not sure how much the fern was pumping when Jeff Wilson was playing but were his cricket achievements ever mentioned to back up his All Black ones ?

    In any case SBW was extremely underwhelming, full of mistakes and injury prone when in the Black jersey last year. He's injured. Again. Does anyone really think he can make it back at his advanced age and force his way back into the team ?

    nzzpN 1 Reply Last reply
    2
  • nzzpN Offline
    nzzpN Offline
    nzzp
    replied to MN5 on last edited by
    #80

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @nzzp said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @No-Quarter said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @nzzp said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    Experience has to count for something , if two players are relatively even , you favor the experienced one in a big game surely ,

    Ya need the mix. One of the reasons I think SBW keeps getting selected is because Hansen and co know he has track record at the highest level

    The only track record he has recently is playing shit and getting injured

    He's actually played well this year when on the park.

    .....just a minor detail.

    He's been nothing but impressive off field but by christ his hold on that jersey HAS to be getting tenuous. Are they really gonna hold a spot for him just in case ?

    They are pretty ruthless selectors, but give plenty of leniency with injury. If they don't think he's up to it, he's for the chop. That said, on form he's magnificent - and despite the odd brain fade, has done some really good thigns at the top level in multiple sports.

    Not sure how much the fern was pumping when Jeff Wilson was playing but were his cricket achievements ever mentioned to back up his All Black ones ?

    In any case SBW was extremely underwhelming, full of mistakes and injury prone when in the Black jersey last year. He's injured. Again. Does anyone really think he can make it back at his advanced age and force his way back into the team ?

    My comment originally was that he has the mental game, and won't choke at the top level. He's shown that in multiple sports. Stupid hits aside, he brings his A game at that level consistently. His offloading game is remarkable (still), and defensively he's a monster. Could be a year too far - but if the ABs dont' see what they want, there is a queue of people knocking on that door.

    MN5M 1 Reply Last reply
    0
  • MN5M Online
    MN5M Online
    MN5
    replied to nzzp on last edited by MN5
    #81

    @nzzp said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @nzzp said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @No-Quarter said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @MN5 said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @nzzp said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    @kiwiinmelb said in All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga:

    Experience has to count for something , if two players are relatively even , you favor the experienced one in a big game surely ,

    Ya need the mix. One of the reasons I think SBW keeps getting selected is because Hansen and co know he has track record at the highest level

    The only track record he has recently is playing shit and getting injured

    He's actually played well this year when on the park.

    .....just a minor detail.

    He's been nothing but impressive off field but by christ his hold on that jersey HAS to be getting tenuous. Are they really gonna hold a spot for him just in case ?

    They are pretty ruthless selectors, but give plenty of leniency with injury. If they don't think he's up to it, he's for the chop. That said, on form he's magnificent - and despite the odd brain fade, has done some really good thigns at the top level in multiple sports.

    Not sure how much the fern was pumping when Jeff Wilson was playing but were his cricket achievements ever mentioned to back up his All Black ones ?

    In any case SBW was extremely underwhelming, full of mistakes and injury prone when in the Black jersey last year. He's injured. Again. Does anyone really think he can make it back at his advanced age and force his way back into the team ?

    My comment originally was that he has the mental game, and won't choke at the top level. He's shown that in multiple sports. Stupid hits aside, he brings his A game at that level consistently. His offloading game is remarkable (still), and defensively he's a monster. Could be a year too far - but if the ABs dont' see what they want, there is a queue of people knocking on that door.

    I guess I imagined that Red Card against the Lions.

    Funny how even his biggest fans can't mention him without at least one negative.

    CanerbryC 1 Reply Last reply
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All Blacks starting 10: Beauden Barrett or Richie Mo'unga
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