Parker v ??
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@kiwiinmelb said in Parker v ??:
I suspect that might be it for joe ,
That loss will set him back a fair way in the pecking order ,
Back to fighting bums in manukau , which will be a struggle fgenerating ppv sales , kiwis were complaining about paying for this fight .
Unfortunately he just isn't quite at the elite level which is a hell of a shame.
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@dice Barry needs to take some blame for that and yes, he did bugger all for large parts of the fight and bought Whyte back into it by allowing him to bully him with lots of grappling etc. Whyte was there to be countered a lot as he swung and missed like a drunk a lot, but Parker doesn't look like he's been taught how to.
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@african-monkey He probably needs to move away from Barry, but unfortunately, I think he's too close to Barry and his family to do that.
I think the Parker camp had become a bit complacent, probably thinking Joe could win fights on hand speed alone, but the higher the level Joe has gone, the less his hand speed has been much of a factor because of his disadvantage in reach and not having the upper hand in height. The fighters are just able to see his punches better and are able to negate his advances and flurries more easily.
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@dice said in Parker v ??:
@african-monkey He probably needs to move away from Barry, but unfortunately, I think he's too close to Barry and his family to do that.
I think the Parker camp had become a bit complacent, probably thinking Joe could win fights on hand speed alone, but the higher the level Joe has gone, the less his hand speed has been much of a factor because of his disadvantage in reach and not having the upper hand in height. The fighters are just able to see his punches better and are able to negate his advances and flurries more easily.
Spot on.
And whilst every country wants their champion to be Champion, reality has to set in somewhere / sometime and accept that their best isn't good enough.
Cracking finish from Chisora though.
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Highlights the lack of quality in the heavyweight divison
Scottish fighter Lee McAllister has become the first lightweight champion to win a heavyweight world title after boxing Danny Williams into retirement.
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I think Parker is young enough to have a second coming but everyone as well as me just drank too much Parker kool-aid.
His power at 22 was good but not devastating. I thought it would come but it never has. He hit Whyte a hand full of times on the button and if he had real power hed have gotten the w.
We saw again, a trainer who means well and has obvious nous, but lacks the ability to motivate his fighter to follow the plan.
We also saw well and truly that Parker is not strong enough to deal with a fighter that wants to body him. He got man handled.
Whats really worrying is how often that happened and he looked back at his corner. Like "why is he doing this Kevin? ". Parker is just not smart enough and committed enough to stick to the game plan.
I dont think he'll fight again. If he does it wont be for a while. I think 18-24 months and if he does It will be with a different trainer.
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@raznomore said in Parker v ??:
I think Parker is young enough to have a second coming but everyone as well as me just drank too much Parker kool-aid.
His power at 22 was good but not devastating. I thought it would come but it never has. He hit Whyte a hand full of times on the button and if he had real power hed have gotten the w.
We saw again, a trainer who means well and has obvious nous, but lacks the ability to motivate his fighter to follow the plan.
We also saw well and truly that Parker is not strong enough to deal with a fighter that wants to body him. He got man handled.
Whats really worrying is how often that happened and he looked back at his corner. Like "why is he doing this Kevin? ". Parker is just not smart enough and committed enough to stick to the game plan.
I dont think he'll fight again. If he does it wont be for a while. I think 18-24 months and if he does It will be with a different trainer.
I think you could be right mate. But then again, his crew is probably stupid enough to get another fight lined up quick smart!
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*Barry took offence at one reporter's questioning of his ongoing role.
"I'm a little insulted you even ask that question. I can't get in the ring and throw the punches for Joe. I give every ounce of energy I have to this man. I love this man and my mission is to make him as good as he can possibly be and I'm totally dedicated to Joe."
I thought this was a bit weak from Barry. Compare that with what you get from many rugby coaches when they lose big matches - taking almost excessive responsibility, but definitely it's the whole team that lost - not just the players.
Think Barry would have been a lot better to have gone with the, "Look we'll review everything that we've done and what's happened in the fight and we're not going to leave any stones unturned in getting Joe to being the very best he can be - if that means bring other people with additional expertise, we'll do it".
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@chris-b and maybe that is the problem right there, their relationship is too close and Barr isnt able to give him the required kicks up the arse, or when he does, JP doesnt take it as seriously as he should
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@taniwharugby Seems a bit "I know everything that needs to be done".
I haven't seen the fight, but reading the Stuff commentary it seems like the expected fitness advantage to Parker didn't materialize.
Most pundits were saying that the longer the fight went, the more it would favour Parker. But, the commentary was talking about Parker looking tired in about Round 7.
So if Whyte is bigger, more aggressive and almost as fit, that's a lot in his advantage.
Doesn't sound like Joe was prepared perfectly.
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@chris-b Anthony Joshua last week was predicting Parker would run out of puff - what would he know eh?
It pretty much went as I expected. It has been apparent for a long time that Parker couldn't make the step up from fighting bums to being competitive at the upper echelon.
He's simply a journeyman who got lucky then got found out.
Not helped at all by Barry's obvious limitations as a trainer and the fact that Team Parker is the gravy train for Barry and Higgins. Not accusing them of being the traditional scum leeches boxing attracts but they are way to close to JP.
Higgins has actually managed Parker to two good paydays - time to retire and count the millions
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I always felt joe was more a manufactured boxer than a natural one ,
You get the same thing in rugby , where you get natural footballers that play the game in front of them , instinctive , it all comes natural ,
Joe never quite had that look about him for me ,not at the higher level, had some good athletic traits but the boxing skills didn't flow out of him, and when in deep water , he looked confused.
But he fought at the top level and won a world title , not many kiwis have achieved that , so still deserves credit for achieving that . -
@kiwiinmelb said in Parker v ??:
I always felt joe was more a manufactured boxer than a natural one ,
You get the same thing in rugby , where you get natural footballers that play the game in front of them , instinctive , it all comes natural ,
Joe never quite had that look about him for me ,not at the higher level, had some good athletic traits but the boxing skills didn't flow out of him, and when in deep water , he looked confused.
But he fought at the top level and won a world title , not many kiwis have achieved that , so still deserves credit for achieving that .I hope he's been smart enough to salt some of his winnings away
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And with Jeff horns humiliating defeat to Terrence Crawford a few weeks back ,
Duco must be feeling like they have gone from the penthouse to the shithouse almost over night .
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How much of this analysis is being done without watching the whole fight?
I haven't seen it either but from some of what I have read the headbutt JP took certainly had an effect of the way the fight went after that.
I'm not saying he was robbed just that comments about his abilities should maybe take that into account.
One thing apparent about the preparation of JP is that there always seems to be hindsight reasons after a loss or tough fight. It's like there isn't enough contingency and mental training for when things don't go to plan which is bizarre when you consider how rarely a fight matches the pre-fight predictions and how often outside factors such as refs can influence how it goes on the night.
They knew Whyte was a brawler but didn't appear to plan for the inevitable low blow or accidental head clash. -
The headbutt imho would have had bugger all impact. Looked more like a clash of heads than a full on head butt
I watched the fight pretty closely and big thing for me in this fight, and a lot of previous Parker fights was the inability to adapt during the fight. I’m not sure whether it’s Kevin Barry not being able to identify the need to make changes mid fight, not being able to communicate it, or JP being able to execute what he’s being told.
Was a pretty good fight to watch tho despite Parker’s frustrating performance. Would have been interesting to see him open up in the 10th or 11th round like he did in the 12th but hell both he and Whyte were pretty dam tired. Who knows how it would have panned out
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Was 90th anniversary of Tom Heeney's challenge against Gene Tunney last Thursday.
RNZ has some pieces from the Sound Archives. Commentary around NZ (3,000 outside the YA station in Heeney's native Gisborne) was a relayed morse code report!
Heeney retired to Miami where he bought a bar and used to go fishing with Hemingway
Hard Rock from Down Under: NZ's 1928 boxing world title fight
Tom Heeney's attempt to challenge the world heavyweight title - 90 years and three days before Joseph Parker's loss last Sunday - was a national sensation, but Heeney moved to Miami to fish with Ernest Hemingway.
