Blues v Rebels
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@canerbry said in Blues vs. Rebels:
@crucial said in Blues vs. Rebels:
I'll get accused of white knighting but questioning the decency of a person is getting a bit carried away surely?
@crucial I'll remind you of all the things you said about Justin Marshall, Reuben Thorne, Caleb Ralph et al. There is no moral highground.
Doubt I have ever questioned their decency or integrity. Just think that's a bridge too far.
By all means question ability or 'right' to continue. -
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@kiwimurph said in Blues vs. Rebels:
@crucial Care to comment on Tana as a coach?
Think I've made my views clear previously, but basically I think like the latter days of Lam and some of Kirwan's tenure their ability to shine as a coach has been hamstrung by many and varied factors.
Have they been the type of coach with the experience to get better results from a dysfunctional unit or overcome injury problems disrupting planning? Clearly not. Are they the completely useless fools some fans made them out to be? I also think not. -
@crucial Yes, I got carried away there and went too far. However, he represents a region of 1.8M people in NZ, and has horribly failed them. He knows he's terrible at his job, he knows he's responsible for further diminishing rugby in that region, and he knows that there are much better coaches around.
Everything ethical, everything logical tells him to just resign.
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@tim said in Blues vs. Rebels:
@crucial said in Blues vs. Rebels:
latter days of Lam
Comparing his tenure to Lam's lack of resources is ridiculous, as @Duluth has made abundantly clear again and again and again.
Did you not read the bit 'many and varied factors'?
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@tim said in Blues vs. Rebels:
@crucial Please enlighten us as to those factors. I'd really like to know what excuses you have for him.
I've been there before with my theories about the Blues, don't feel like sticking my head above the parapet again.
Put very simplistically I don't think the crux of the problem is the coaching and thinking that a coach change will perform a miracle is wishful thinking.
Look at the other thread where the possible squad for next year is being worked out. Does it look like a great squad (or vastly different one)?
What I see when I watch the Blues is a team so desperate that the moment they get behind or experience a good period from the opposition they start making poor individual decisions and go away from gameplans. They have been like this for a long time.
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I'll put money that the turnaround will be exceedingly swift. The right coach will be appointed and things that are currently insoluble will be solved.
It's not like Super Rugby isn't full of examples of teams suddenly finding their mojo with the right coach. Teams with far fewer natural resources than the Blues too.
Obviously not straight to winning the championship, but at least to winning.
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@chester-draws who is the right coach that will get this amazing turn around?
It ain't gonna happen this year, they need to be looking for that new coach for 2020 in early 2019...but this is unlikely as they will want to give Tana and Leon a chance to gel, meaning they will likely miss any coaches coming off RWC duties looking for a new challenge.
I do agree with @Crucial with his comment about when the blues get behind, they lose thier shit and can't buy a trick. Thier leadership is all but non exisitent, a number of senior player seem immune to being dropped, no matter how shit they play.
This is a deep dark hole this team is in, I agree that the right coach would likely get some immediate improvements with the talent available, but as above I can't see that happening Nytme soon...guess it depends how much power Leon has or if Tana is still pulling the strings as to if next year has a decent shot of improving.
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Do the blues have the same problem that plagued the Warriors for years ( something they have seemingly fixed despite recent up and down results)
Is there a few bad apples in the team ( likely to be senior players) who are a bad influence and are treated differently to the rest?
‘Tis was something that was changed at the Warriors with and obvious effect.
Both clubs have a very similar history in recent years, bad run of loses, try different coaches but nothing changes. -
Its pretty funny to say look the squad, what could Tana do, when Tana picked the squad.
He’s had three years, more than enough time to show progress, or the inklings of a plan. Other teams have had a bad run of injuries and the new players just slot into the team pattern.
It’s been said many times that the coaching is not the only problem at the Blues, we also need to replace the CEO and most of the board.
But it’s a fact that Tana is the worst coach the Blues have had, certainly the worst selector. If he had any self awareness, or respect for rugby in this region, he would quit and get his coaching experience somewhere else.
But he plainly puts his career ahead of any other factor. It’s the only explanation for not quitting with record after record tumbling this year. I mean, if you won’t quit when your team ships 60 points at Eden Park, or loses to the Sunwolves and Jaguares, fails to win a home game all season, I don’t see what’s wrong with questioning his class.
Even with the same squad, a real coach would improve things massively. Tana has put us in a death spiral, we are going to start shedding players and will not be able to attract anybody to the franchise.
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The NZRU are very aware of the significant problems in Auckland rugby. Surely they can't allow this organisation to continue to set new lows, and erode the last hope and goodwill of its supporters?
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@kirwan said in Blues vs. Rebels:
But he plainly puts his career ahead of any other factor. It’s the only explanation for not quitting with record after record tumbling this year. I mean, if you won’t quit when your team ships 60 points at Eden Park, or loses to the Sunwolves and Jaguares, fails to win a home game all season, I don’t see what’s wrong with questioning his class.
He admitted in the recent press conference that he didn’t deserve an extension. After every match he states he doesn’t know why the team doesn’t play like it trains.
The most important thing is that he still has a high paying consequence free job. Rugby in the region is less important than that.If he had integrity he would have quit. Tana has no mana.
Standards across the organisation are so low. The board takes no responsibility, they enforce no standards on the coach. The coach is out of his depth and is laughably not judged by the same standards as any other professional coach.
Those lack of standards, decency, integrity filter throughout the whole team. Why should the players have high standards when no one else does. It’s a cancer that needs to cut out. -
@kirwan I go back to my conversation with Tony Hanks the Blues high performance Manager who I believe is over in France watching the NZ under 20s..doing what..? Who the fuck knows..I asked Tony at the Condors Sevens last year,why did they not replace Luatua & Famauina with like for like players,because I felt their squad was looking very light on experience IF THEY HAD INJURIES..I was told by Hanks,the Blues would be the surprise packet,I did not believe that for a minute..
Always felt it was the weakest squad out of the 5,but you don’t have to be a rocket scientist to work that out..When you flip this around and look at the saders,firstly well selected which means Scott Robertson has got any eye for talent and work ethic,the other jewel in the crown they have is Jason Ryan,the forwards coach..expertly drilled and well coached by Razor & Ryan
The Blues on the other hand are poorly selected from the get go,that includes Hanks who apparently has a big say in recruitment,Steve Jackson who is a nice enough guy,but fuck me,despite the injuries,the work ethic of the forwards is lousy,it’s got some good individuals,but as a collective,they are awful..poorly drilled,got not idea how to form a lineout Drive or fucking defend one..they run into contact instead of trying to hit weak shoulders.
Even a player like Akira Ioane,for his talent has,coach him to run forward for fuck sake,that’s what big number 8s do..!As for Tana,it’s all very well lamenting all your injuries,but at the end of the day,Squad selection is huge,injuries have got to be taken into account,and on that note alone,Umaga,Jackson & Hanks are all totally culpable..The CEO Redman needs to have a good look in the mirror as well..The have got everything they desired in terms of a training facility and by the sounds it of their own autonomy..!
Would not be so bad if the sun was out,but it’s a shitty fucking day in Auckland
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@crucial said in Blues vs. Rebels:
I'll get accused of white knighting but questioning the decency of a person is getting a bit carried away surely?
He should resign, end of story.
If he doesn’t then he’s not acting as a decent person would.
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@steven-harris said in Blues vs. Rebels:
As for Tana,it’s all very well lamenting all your injuries,but at the end of the day,Squad selection is huge,injuries have got to be taken into account,and on that note alone,Umaga,Jackson & Hanks are all totally culpable..The CEO Redman needs to have a good look in the mirror as well..The have got everything they desired in terms of a training facility and by the sounds it of their own autonomy..!
Yes exactly. It’s obvious where the problem starts. If there wasn’t a popular former player in the middle of that group there would have been a blood bath. The media would have reported accurately and the nzru wouldn’t have protected reputations.
Why should Blues fans suffer because one of the incompetent people was a popular player? Fuck that. The back room should be judged by the same standard as any other franchise. They are all terrible compared to their contemporaries
I’m still amazed that the people involved haven’t quit.
