All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3
-
@Wairau said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
I would have accepted a yellow. But it deserved a red, or failing that, citing and 2 week ban.
This is a black mark against the officials, and Garces in particular. The SOB swinging arm should have been dealt with on the field. A penalty at least, but he couldn't have had any complaints if a YC was issued.
I expect both coaches are going to have plenty to say to Poite so he will be under pressure to get his decisions right. The last thing anyone wants is a controversial call to decide the game and series.
-
@Bovidae said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
@Wairau said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
I would have accepted a yellow. But it deserved a red, or failing that, citing and 2 week ban.
This is a black mark against the officials, and Garces in particular. The SOB swinging arm should have been dealt with on the field. A penalty at least, but he couldn't have had any complaints if a YC was issued.
I expect both coaches are going to have plenty to say to Poite so he will be under pressure to get his decisions right. The last thing anyone wants is a controversial call to decide the game and series.
That's why it was so frustrating that Garces was selected for the 2nd test. There was always going to be controversial calls left, right and centre that would take away from what was a brutal, awesome encounter. He's hopeless, but whoever chose him to ref a Lions v ABs match is worse.
-
@No-Quarter That would be Alain Rolland, World Rugby's High Performance 15s Match Officials' Manager.
-
so assuming Crotty isn't fit, what happens to our mid-field?
Fekitoa into squad, but Laumape the only specialist 12, or do we move ALB to 12 and Fekitoa to 13?
-
@Bovidae said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
@No-Quarter That would be Alain Rolland, World Rugby's High Performance 15s Match Officials' Manager.
I don't understand why he feels the need to appoint three different referees for three games. Surely you pick the best available, and give him all three tests? That way the players can adapt to his style and get on with letting the rugby do the talking, instead of (particularly with Garces) trying to work out what the fuck he is even talking about for most of the game. There's no points for participation at this level, we need the best referee available every test. Use the "lesser" games to give others experience to prove themselves - there's plenty of pro rugby around.
There was one point early on where Garces was talking to I think BBBR and AWJ. He said "YOU PUSH EACH OTHER! AND NOW IT'S OVER!" then waved his hands in the air and walked away, leaving both players looking bemused. It was comical, which is a shame given the importance of this tour.
-
@No-Quarter said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
@Bovidae said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
@No-Quarter That would be Alain Rolland, World Rugby's High Performance 15s Match Officials' Manager.
I don't understand why he feels the need to appoint three different referees for three games. Surely you pick the best available, and give him all three tests? That way the players can adapt to his style and get on with letting the rugby do the talking, instead of (particularly with Garces) trying to work out what the fuck he is even talking about for most of the game. There's no points for participation at this level, we need the best referee available every test. Use the "lesser" games to give others experience to prove themselves - there's plenty of pro rugby around.
There was one point early on where Garces was talking to I think BBBR and AWJ. He said "YOU PUSH EACH OTHER! AND NOW IT'S OVER!" then waved his hands in the air and walked away, leaving both players looking bemused. It was comical, which is a shame given the importance of this tour.
I kinda like that story if it's accurate. A bit of levity is no harm every now and then.
-
@No-Quarter yeah you wonder if his grasp on English is as good as it needs to be, given it seemed that Ayoub (no great endorsement I know...) thought Vunipola deserved more than a YC, but Garces wasn't having any of it.
Still think Read missed the opportunity to press for a YC on repeated infringements, although maybe he thought he'd not be able to convey it well enough? Who knows.
Agree that it would be a good idea to have the same ref through, for consistency of interpretations.
-
@taniwharugby said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
yeah you wonder if his grasp on English is as good as it needs to be, given it seemed that Ayoub (no great endorsement I know...) thought Vunipola deserved more than a YC, but Garces wasn't having any of it.
I thought there were technical problems at times. During one of the TMO discussions Ayoub clearly said “can he hear me?” After getting no response from Garces
-
@antipodean bit rich for anyone to be complaining about ayoub being ignored though isn't it?
-
@reprobate I complain about Ayoub being a TMO but the person who hires him doesn't seem to care about my thoughts on his competence.
-
@Duluth @antipodean beat me to it, Garces was probably ignoring him, cos Ayoub...surely if we can hear him, Garces can?
But yeah, is amusing we are querying why Ayoub's instructions weren't followed
-
@Catogrande said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
@JC Ach mate. I would't argue with the penalty thing. Farrell was holding on and Sexton was in an offside position. Both guilty but not picked up. However that is not why Perenera went wide. Which was the issue being discussed. Shitty stuff like that goes on all over the place but at this level it should not be an excuse if it doesn't materially affect what occurs. They're professionals after all.
When I watched the footage yesterday I felt that it was the kicking out of the hold that pushed TJP left. Now, TJP might have gone that way anyway and left the hole, but we'll never know because he 'was' held in the ruck illegally (and it's irrelevant if it's happened all tour). At the least Garces should have sent it to the TMO to review.
-
@Nepia said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
@Catogrande said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
@JC Ach mate. I would't argue with the penalty thing. Farrell was holding on and Sexton was in an offside position. Both guilty but not picked up. However that is not why Perenera went wide. Which was the issue being discussed. Shitty stuff like that goes on all over the place but at this level it should not be an excuse if it doesn't materially affect what occurs. They're professionals after all.
When I watched the footage yesterday I felt that it was the kicking out of the hold that pushed TJP left. Now, TJP might have gone that way anyway and left the hole, but we'll never know because he 'was' held in the ruck illegally (and it's irrelevant if it's happened all tour). At the least Garces should have sent it to the TMO to review.
Re the "held in the ruck" thing, just to be clear, I can't see that TJP was ever part of the ruck, there wasn't anybody bound to it at all that I can recall (I'll certainly take another look). Farrell came in through the gate, and dived straight onto the ground beyond it tackling TJP around the feet. No attempt to remain on his feet. No attempt to bind. No attempt to clear the ball, cause Murray already had hands on it. No "plane taking off" type clearout. Just a guy infringing and getting away with it.
-
I think if TJP hadn't been so worried about flapping his arms about and instead playing to the whistle (as we teach our kids) that try might well have not been scored.
-
Really disappointed that Hansen and co did'nt look at Charlie Ngatai as an option for what now appears to be a bit of a diliema for 2nd five spot.
While he has not played a terrible amount of code since his head knock,I thought Ngatai and Lienart Brown as a combination completely shut Laumape & Aso down a few weeks back for the chiefs against the Canes defensively,I also thought on a night when the NZ Maori were well beaten by the Lions he along with Akira Ioane were 2 of the better performers.
He has all the skills,temperament and brains to organise a backline..I sense they will go for a lienart Brown- Fekitoa combination which concerns me big time.Fekitoa throughout his career has been notorious for charging out of the line.
Would just like to see a more heady player (pardon the pun) in that import position,and in my opinion Ngatai fits the bill.
Be great to Akira Ioane on the bench as well,at the expense of Savea..
-
@Steven-Harris I agree re Ngatai and am not a fan of Fekitoa. Of the players in the current squad, I would much rather see Goodhue and ALB take the field instead of Fekitoa. What's the point of experience when the guy has tits for hands, is not a good distributor and always seems to make at least one bad decision a game.
Not sure about Akira over Savea. Savea was immense when he came on the other night.
-
@Steven-Harris said in All Blacks v BI Lions Test #3:
He has all the skills,temperament and brains to organise a backline..I sense they will go for a lienart Brown- Fekitoa combination which concerns me big time.Fekitoa throughout his career has been notorious for charging out of the line.
He might charge out of the line, but he's the best defender, by a long shot.
-
So if we have a Fekitoa-ALB mid-field, who moves to 12, same problem with Goodhue-ALB as well.
Lets all pray for Crotty.
-
I would be really worried having Ngatai there, he's way short of a gallop and while he's been solid enough in his return, he's been far from outstanding which is to be expected.
Laumape has to be odds on for the 12 jumper, with Fekitoa on the bench. I'm pretty comfortable with that.
