All Blacks 2023
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@Stargazer Different profiles though. If they want a hard ball-carrier, Tupaea and McLeod would be better bets than Havili imo.
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@frugby Not the same distribution and kicking skills though. Also not the same versatility and experience. At this time of the year, with little time to go before the RWC, Havili is a far more usefull squaddie than Tupaea and McLeod. They are for the future.
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@Stargazer Did you read what I said? I said, of they are looking for a like-for-like option, they might have Tupaea and McLeod in mind.
It wasn't a comment on Havili's overall ability, though that in itself can be debated, because he hasn't exactly set the world on fire at test level...
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God i hope Havili doesn't go
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby They are not like for like. They're super green, inexperienced and unproven.
In play styles, they are way more similar to Jordie Barrett than Havili is - so like for like.
By your argument, Sam Whitelock and Aaron Smith are like for like because they're both proven and highly experienced.
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If we want ineffective ball running, wayward kicking, and distributing to Scottish players for runaways, Havili is our guy fir sure
If we want someone to come in and do Jordie's role, then it's not David
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@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby They are not like for like. They're super green, inexperienced and unproven.
In play styles, they are way more similar to Jordie Barrett than Havili is - so like for like.
By your argument, Sam Whitelock and Aaron Smith are like for like because they're both proven and highly experienced.
the rest if us knew what you meant, im sure not all agreed but knew what you meant
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby said in All Blacks 2023:
By your argument, Sam Whitelock and Aaron Smith are like for like because they're both proven and highly experienced.
No, they're not. They play in different positions. Stop twisting my words.
By like for like, I was quite clearly referring to play style. Nothing to do with experience.
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@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
God i hope Havili doesn't go
I am sorry my son, but David is a near certainty. You may pray for something else, though.
I know what you mean. He would be extremely handy for the Mako.
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@Machpants said in All Blacks 2023:
They're like for like in that they are big bodies that can run it straight, jordie has a more full court game. He's played every position in the abs beyond 9, and has a lot of strings to how bow. McLeod and Tup not so much
Absolutely correct. That's why I originally said, if they want a hard ball-carrier, which to me has been the most important part of Barrett's game this year, then the other two are more like for like than Havili.
The most like for like in the other regard would be Sam Gilbert, but he is very much a Jordie Barrett lite, who does everything Barrett does, except slightly worse, barring the fact he is the greatest goal kicker of all time.
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@Chris-B said in All Blacks 2023:
@mariner4life said in All Blacks 2023:
God i hope Havili doesn't go
I am sorry my son, but David is a near certainty. You may pray for something else, though.
I know what you mean. He would be extremely handy for the Mako.
i think so too, but it's a wasted spot IMO
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@Stargazer said in All Blacks 2023:
@frugby Yes, but you made the comment in relation to a "backdoor entrance", so a spot in the RWC squad. And that's unlikely to happen for the reasons I mentioned.
Once again, did you read what I said? If they have now decided they want a hard ball-carrier, then it is entirely possible they opt for Tupaea over Havili - which would be a backdoor entrance into the World Cup squad.
You're disputing the likelihood of the overall scenario, not the statement. I literally have said several times I think Havili will go to the World Cup, I'm just suggesting another possibility.
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@Machpants said in All Blacks 2023:
jordie has a more full court game
not convinced of the distribution yet, but the carries are so effective. The game plan on the weekend especially meant he spent most of the time keeping us on the front foot rather than releasing the outsides.
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