All Black midfield options
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@taniwharugby said in All Black midfield options:
and it is unlikely he will play 12 all super
What the Crusaders decide to do with Havili, Goodhue, LF & Ennor will have a big impact. Recent AB's midfielders will be pushed to the wing, back to the bench or maybe even miss the 23
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@voodoo said in All Black midfield options:
@Chris-B said in All Black midfield options:
@voodoo said in All Black midfield options:
@Chris-B said in All Black midfield options:
@No-Quarter I've written several times that I think Will should stay at 14 until after this coming RWC.
May not happen if Jordie is permanently shifted to 12.
I think our backs are in more of a state of flux than they we're a couple of months ago - but, that could well be a good thing.
I don't think we are.
We have decided our best 10 in RM. We have locked in our best midfield in JB/RI. And for better or worse we have CC and BB at 11/14, with that not likely to change unless someone beats the door down next year at either spot. If they do, CC might fall out and BB might shift to being a reserve, but what a great reserve to have! 14 is still up for grabs, but likely WJ if fit, with a very able Reece if not
Pretty settled I think!
Even the reserves with TJ (oh yeah), ALB seem locked in.
I think most (probably all) of the guys you mention will be involved.
I'm a lot less confident about predicting quite what number they'll be wearing (even barring injuries) - though I think 9 and 10 are pretty locked in now.
Really??? You don't think 12 and 13 are locked in?
Surely JB has 12 sewn up even if just by default because everyone else has sucked there. And who else is putting their hand up at 13?
11, 14 and 15 I'll give you, there could be some flux there.
It will hopefully be a bit more locked in by Sunday lunchtime and we'll have won well against England.
But, if we lose, there's lots that could go back in the air. It's still early in the Jordie at 12 experiment and a lot of water still to go under the bridge before RWC.
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@Stargazer said in All Black midfield options:
@voodoo 11 should still be open, wide open.
Yep, agree, I wouldn't be locking in any of the back 3 just yet. BB and WJ will be in the 23, but Clarke could miss out completely and who bloody knows who'll wear starting numbers
Edit - when I said 9-13 I was excluding 11! I can see how that was confusing 😁
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@voodoo said in All Black midfield options:
@Chris-B But I've been wrong before!
Me too and quite recently!
Last night if I'd had to pick Fozzie's RWC squad I would've picked Caleb, Will and Sevu as his wings - by this morning it's looking like Telea might push Sevu out!
I'm pretty sure Jordie will be in the starting XV, but him staying at 12 is also dependent on Beauden (or someone else) working out at 15.
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@Chris-B said in All Black midfield options:
@voodoo said in All Black midfield options:
@Chris-B But I've been wrong before!
Me too and quite recently!
Last night if I'd had to pick Fozzie's RWC squad I would've picked Caleb, Will and Sevu as his wings - by this morning it's looking like Telea might push Sevu out!
I'm pretty sure Jordie will be in the starting XV, but him staying at 12 is also dependent on Beauden (or someone else) working out at 15.
Beaudy is a better 15 than havili etc are 12s. I would imagine the same is for Jordan. And 12 is so important with our relatively weak ten. So I'd rather have jordie at 12, then figure out who goes to 15
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@Bovidae said in All Black midfield options:
It's not just the Crusaders whose selections will impact the ABs midfield (form and time in a certain position). Holland needs to play JB at 2nd 5, and not swap him between 12 and 15. The same to a lesser degree with ALB at the Chiefs.
Yeah and for the Blues it's how they use RTS & Heem. Ioane will be the 13 of course
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@Duluth said in All Black midfield options:
@Bovidae said in All Black midfield options:
It's not just the Crusaders whose selections will impact the ABs midfield (form and time in a certain position). Holland needs to play JB at 2nd 5, and not swap him between 12 and 15. The same to a lesser degree with ALB at the Chiefs.
Yeah and for the Blues it's how they use RTS & Heem. Ioane will be the 13 of course
Haven’t the Blues used 2 or 3 different players at 12 this year?
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@ACT-Crusader said in All Black midfield options:
@Duluth said in All Black midfield options:
@Bovidae said in All Black midfield options:
It's not just the Crusaders whose selections will impact the ABs midfield (form and time in a certain position). Holland needs to play JB at 2nd 5, and not swap him between 12 and 15. The same to a lesser degree with ALB at the Chiefs.
Yeah and for the Blues it's how they use RTS & Heem. Ioane will be the 13 of course
Haven’t the Blues used 2 or 3 different players at 12 this year?
RTS started when he was fit. Heem generally got the other games. Evans, T Tele’a got matches too. Plummer was injured or he would’ve probably got time too
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@Bovidae said in All Black midfield options:
It's not just the Crusaders whose selections will impact the ABs midfield (form and time in a certain position). Holland needs to play JB at 2nd 5, and not swap him between 12 and 15. The same to a lesser degree with ALB at the Chiefs.
The Canes have Moorby and Love as fullback options so it’s most likely Barrett will play a lot at 12 next year which is a good thing for the ABs.
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@Canes4life said in All Black midfield options:
@Bovidae said in All Black midfield options:
It's not just the Crusaders whose selections will impact the ABs midfield (form and time in a certain position). Holland needs to play JB at 2nd 5, and not swap him between 12 and 15. The same to a lesser degree with ALB at the Chiefs.
The Canes have Moorby and Love as fullback options so it’s most likely Barrett will play a lot at 12 next year which is a good thing for the ABs.
Holland has already says he's sees him primarily as 12
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@Machpants said in All Black midfield options:
@Canes4life said in All Black midfield options:
@Bovidae said in All Black midfield options:
It's not just the Crusaders whose selections will impact the ABs midfield (form and time in a certain position). Holland needs to play JB at 2nd 5, and not swap him between 12 and 15. The same to a lesser degree with ALB at the Chiefs.
The Canes have Moorby and Love as fullback options so it’s most likely Barrett will play a lot at 12 next year which is a good thing for the ABs.
Holland has already says he's sees him primarily as 12
Did he say this before JB played at 12 for ABs?
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@nostrildamus said in All Black midfield options:
@Machpants said in All Black midfield options:
@Canes4life said in All Black midfield options:
@Bovidae said in All Black midfield options:
It's not just the Crusaders whose selections will impact the ABs midfield (form and time in a certain position). Holland needs to play JB at 2nd 5, and not swap him between 12 and 15. The same to a lesser degree with ALB at the Chiefs.
The Canes have Moorby and Love as fullback options so it’s most likely Barrett will play a lot at 12 next year which is a good thing for the ABs.
Holland has already says he's sees him primarily as 12
Did he say this before JB played at 12 for ABs?
And after, if I remember correctly
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@No-Quarter said in All Black midfield options:
@Chris-B said in All Black midfield options:
@No-Quarter said in All Black midfield options:
@Chris-B said in All Black midfield options:
@mariner4life No. The argument is that we've won quite a bit more against big teams than we've lost with Havili in the team.
He's no Ma'a Nonu, but he's decent enough.
I don't know if we can afford to play him next to Mo'unga. Our inside channel becomes a real liability on defense. He also can't be paired with ALB as we saw in the weekend, and he doesn't attract any defense in close to free up space for his outsides. I think he's a decent squaddie but if we're down to him starting a big test we're in a bit of trouble.
Yeah - I've got significant doubts that Dave and Anton are incisive enough. Dave and Rieko work OK. Dave is a bit Aaron Mauger, which will "attract attention".
I'd be very happy to have Jordie at 12 if I didn't also want him at 15. I'm probably less convinced about Beaudy there than some, these days
I think Beauden has played some of his best rugby for the ABs at 15, and he'll offer a lot more than Jordie on attack from the back. Do you think your boy Will is ready for the 15 jumper yet? I am sympathetic to your views on Jordie at the back though, he'll diffuse any plans teams have to launch high balls at us to the point that they are just giving back possession. However I'm not sure we can afford to be too defensively minded this RWC - if we're gonna win it we are going to have to throw caution to the wind and try to rack up some points against the big teams, as our defense hasn't been good enough to keep them under 20 points on consistent basis.
My backline right now has to be:
9. Smith
10. Mo'unga
11. Clarke
12. Jordie
13. Rieko
14. Jordan
15. BeaudenYou could slot Jordan at 15 and Reece on the right wing and we don't lose much. But to me that gives us the best balance of play makers and players that can genuinely beat their man and score points from almost anywhere. You put those guys behind our improved forward performances of late and we're in with a very good shout.
This is pretty much the top backline and good enough to develop into "best of" All Black backlines if kept together and injury free. On the bench I'd have - TJ/Weber, DMAC, ALB
with Havili, Telea, Reece, Christie in the squad.The balance with;
- 3 playmakers/kickers (Richie, Jordie, BB)
- Experience of Smith
- Ball carrying/kicking of Jordie
- Pace of Rieko
- Power of Clarke
- Freakish scoring ability of Jordan
- Experience of BB
This is it. Keep them together and manage them through the lead in to RWC.
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I hope Goodhue gets a full season without injuries. I still think he has potential to be a very good centre, even lacking top line speed.
We don't really need a brilliant player at 13, just a competent, organised and reliable player who takes the right options. It's been a while since we saw Goodhue sans injury but he could fill that role if he doesn't break down.
